Jump to content

Best coaches ?

berettaman1

By berettaman1,
in Clay Pigeon Shooting

 Share

Recommended Posts

berettaman1

berettaman1

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Ha Ha Ha, Quite right , My friend!! I was getting ****** off at what I saw was a scorning of my ability!! I am allas, only a shadow of what I acheived, and what my age was , When I did it.....But not many guys jumped staight int A class Sporting...A class DTL. and reached AA in Sporting.... AA in double rise.... As a Veteran?? ..... I am sorry Clayman thinks his acheivements are greater than Mine?..

Link to comment
Share on other sites
berettaman1

berettaman1

Posted
  • Author
Posted
Michael Schuemacher used adriver coach,as do all top racing drivers.Did this coach have to be a better driver?of course not,but he was obviously a very good teacher.

What the **** you on about??? if you cant do it dont come on saying you can??? please tell us all what you have won, ?? in clayshooting classifications??? --- PUT UP, OR SHUT UP>>> :good:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
eagleye

eagleye

Posted
Posted
Michael Schuemacher used adriver coach,as do all top racing drivers.Did this coach have to be a better driver?of course not,but he was obviously a very good teacher.

What the **** you on about??? if you cant do it dont come on saying you can??? please tell us all what you have won, ?? in clayshooting classifications??? --- PUT UP, OR SHUT UP>>> :good:

I have been reading this post with interest

but what did tiganut say wrong to get that response or have I missed something

Link to comment
Share on other sites
berettaman1

berettaman1

Posted
  • Author
Posted

What?? What,, dont you understand?? Following your train of thought I will have to get myself off to a top brain Hospital in the morning and tell the the doctors how to operate!!.on serious cases..No Problem, I will tell them you sent me.... :good:???

Link to comment
Share on other sites
eagleye

eagleye

Posted
Posted (edited)
What?? What,, dont you understand?? Following your train of thought I will have to get myself off to a top brain Hospital in the morning and tell the the doctors how to operate!!.on serious cases..No Problem, I will tell them you sent me.... :good:???

you probably won't have to tell him how to do it because he's going to be self taught and he read it all from a book

and blagged his way in to being a top rate AAA surgeon

Edited by eagleye
Link to comment
Share on other sites
berettaman1

berettaman1

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Hee Hee Hee, Oh come on!!! I have just been reading how to con people and make lots of dosh for doing allmost nothing!!... yes you have all guessed,..... tomororow I will stand as a New Labour Canditate!!!!... no, Not as a head coach for the CPSA!! :good:???

Link to comment
Share on other sites
tiganut

tiganut

Posted
Posted
Michael Schuemacher used adriver coach,as do all top racing drivers.Did this coach have to be a better driver?of course not,but he was obviously a very good teacher.

What the **** you on about??? if you cant do it dont come on saying you can??? please tell us all what you have won, ?? in clayshooting classifications??? --- PUT UP, OR SHUT UP>>> :good:

Please learn to read,& understand a simple statement before throwing your toys out.

What have I won?Nothing

What classification?None

There you are,your questions awnsered.

My point was,& is,you dont have to be the best at something to be the best teacher,very good yes,the best no,.All top professional sporting people have top line coaches,golf,tennis,motor racing,you name it, there is a coach for it.

Most top sportsmen do not anylise what they are doing,they just do it well,if they start failing the coach helps them put it right.

 

I can just imagine you as a coach:-

'where did I go wrong on that one?'

'You missed the*******thing you ****** ****'

'Thanks teach,very helpful,heres my hundred quid'

Link to comment
Share on other sites
berettaman1

berettaman1

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

Sorry old bean you are not good enough to be in my shooting class!... 1 You do not show enough reverance, and 2. you cant spell, A you misspelt )Awnsered !! and B. Anylise !!. you will obviously not even make it to level one of hopscotch in the infants class!!... you sir are a Wally of the lowest order!! please come back after 20 or so years when you have attained C class in sporting!! or top/and whip control. !! Or get yourself in AA class in any shooting discipline by a half hour course with a CPSA Coach :good:???:wub:

Edited by berettaman1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
tiganut

tiganut

Posted
Posted

Respect & reverence are earned,not demanded,Bad spelling?probably,but dilligaf?Will I get a classification?Who knows,but if I enjoy it,then it is worth it.

So come on big fella,name the world/olympic champions you are coaching now,not when they were kids but now.I await this list with interest,but wont hold my breath.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
clayman

clayman

Posted
Posted (edited)

No Berettaman, I don't think they are better, particularly when I have no knowledge of you on which to base any opinion.

 

I thought I had answered your criticism fully, to simply say I have concentrated on my coaching skills, not my championship shooting skills. It's coaching I work to excel at, not classification ratings.

 

As far as barbs goes, I am sorry if you feel I have thrown some at you. I like knowledge and debate, and I add facts as I see them, and opinions; to correct, add to, or show another angle on a topic. This is only to share my knowledge and gain more. I continue to learn everyday, including from the forum. Nothing personal intended, honest!

 

I think I should also make it clear what CPSA coaches are qualified to to.

 

A Level One Instructor ( old club coach) who needs two years min shooting experience, is qualified to take a novice and safely introduce them to a simple clay - THATS IT.

 

Level two and three ( old advanced coach) are qualified to advance a B shooter to A in the disciplines the coach is qualified in ( All = Senior).

 

The CPSA do not claim to train coaches to take A's higher. That task is undertaken by ISSF coaches and independents such as have been mentioned by others. The CPSA is aware of this gap, and is working on the "International" package to bring the top level of CPSA coaches in line with an ISSF C Certificate. Existing high profile coaches may be able to go for direct assessment at the highest level to gain CPSA endorsement. Over time, the CPSA should be able to provide training from its coaching group at the level you describe.

 

I don't coach at this level nor claim any abilities there. All the work I do is within my qualification levels, and its novice shooters with no method, and expanding B shooters into A, or moving them cross discipline.

 

What I do believe though, is that many people how would benefit far more from CPSA instruction choose to go directly to the top independents. I have expressed my view that the top independents may be less expert at teaching at the lower levels where CPSA has trained coaches.

 

A coaching qualification is in fact nothing to do with shooting. Its passing an exam that shows you can analyse a pupil, put a lesson together, provide feedback and practical instruction. The BASC coach is the C1 NVQ ( The accredited Shotgun Coach in CPSA), and the vehicle of shotgun shooting is only for providing practical content. You can get the same NVQ at your local Higher Ed coaching cookery, badminton, or a choir. The qualification of coach them means you can coach in anything you have personal competence in.

 

While the CPSA offered the NVQ endorsement up till 2006, but I think only the CPSA's internal qualification remains, ie L-1 etc, although it still contains all the NVQ elements.

 

Oh, and head coach? Where does that come from? There is no such person at the CPSA, nor has there ever been. The structure is Training Manager ( who will be a Senior Tutor, formerly me and now Chris McVerry), a group of Senior Tutors, a group of assessors, and a group of tutors and range assistants ( tutors in training). Below that there are Senior coaches, about 40 in the UK and I'm one of those; then L-2, and L-1 instructors, about 600 altogether.

 

Anyway, I'm proud of my achievements and abilities, and I'm sure Berettaman and I will be destined to meet up soon enough!

 

Jerry

Edited by clayman
Link to comment
Share on other sites
berettaman1

berettaman1

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Sorry Sonny, but when you have even the slightest grasp on what you are bleating about, then- and only then will I reconsider and decide if you merit a response to your crude knowledge of the English language.. now off you go, soon be your bedtime sonny jim!! :good:???:wub:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
berettaman1

berettaman1

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Ooh Erh, Is that a threat to do me harm then Jerry?? Must make a note to pass on to your local police , who have OK your SGL then..I dont remember your exact qualifacations you put down when you joined this forum, but I remember you stated head/ or main coach. I only raised what I did in revenge at your putting down my replies to PW members inquiries re, what was the rules at two different types of clay shooting discipines, I stated what had occured several times when I was a participiant. You tried to belittle me in my honest replies, so I decided to see what was your shooting Qualifications, and was amazed to see that for a senior/head/ coach, you could not practise what you charged ,to teach.!!I am sorry you have made a subtle threat to my well being, and I will in the morning make an official protest to my local police area.. as I am quite allarmed at your behavior. Cheers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
clayman

clayman

Posted
Posted

Well you obviously don't know me , as I hold malice to no man. To me meeting is simply to get further insight into people and to continue to learn. Whatever your opinion of me is, and regardless of whether you would benefit, my knowledge and experience would be enhanced. I merely expressed that in the goodness of time we should probably meet ( if you reveal who you are, but you remain to me behind a cloak of anonymity).

 

Please cut and paste for the benefit of other forum readers where you saw this claim I have made to be the CPSA Head Coach is.

 

I have earned £30-40k a year for the last 8 years as a full time coach or training manager. I shoot for fun and have no need or wish to chase classifications, but I do strive daily to improve my coaching skills and continually seek further knowledge and training - you never stop learning.

 

If I disagree with some-one, I say so. Otherwise, anything I add to a topic is just to provide further knowledge for the readers. The view I gave was entirely impartial and my interpretation of the rules and ethics involved.

 

I am here for the future of our sport... are you?

 

Jerry

Link to comment
Share on other sites
eagleye

eagleye

Posted
Posted

I said earlier that I was reading this topic with interest

but like a lot of debates on here it has degraded into a back-biting,hair pulling,throw your toys out the pram bitch fight

with I want the last word,no I want the last word,no I want the last word

grow up children and know when to knock it on the head

if anyone wants to slag off this post I will not be responding so tough

 

eagleye

Link to comment
Share on other sites
clayman

clayman

Posted
Posted

For the benefit of those who seem believe that you can buy CPSA qualification and that it involves no learning.

 

The system is designed to eliminate potential failures before they waste their money on the full course, and the tutors time.

 

Before you can attend a CPSA L-1 course you need to go on a minimum of two one day courses, the first is a Safety Officers Course with a multi-choice examination, and a 5yr refresher system.

 

The second is an IDW ( Instructor development workshop). Here, your personal ability to shoot is checked, you are given an overview of the main course, you have a go at applying instruction technique so things like communication skills can be checked. You are then debriefed and a Course Tutor will tell you your strengths and weaknesses, and whether they think you are ready for a positive outcome at the main 4 day course. If the recommendation is that you are not ready, you can return and repeat the IDW, or get 1:2:1 preparation mentoring for the main course.

 

Of those that then do pay the L-1 fee, the pass rate varies from 75% to 90%, but there are usually some failures. Remember, the aim of the system is to get 100% pass at the main course by having a robust filter at the earlier stages. Every failure of an instructor to qualify is a failure of the tutors to get that person to the correct standard by assessment - thats what we try to achieve, and we now use a very high staff / pupil ratio to do this - over a L-1 course there are 10 staff members to 18 instructor pupils, as compared with 4 staff for 24, with the tutors doing the assessments (not new staff who had not been involved in the teaching) when I took over in 2001.

 

Even so, the blind assessment system ( based on NVQ standards) that runs against a set series of achievements and standards every pupil must achieve, does fail a portion.

 

Failures have to go back into the IDW loop to sort out the weaknesses before returning for re-assessment.

 

Ask anyone who has been through the course, and all will tell you its not falling off a log, indeed it is a very intense learning curve and hard work. The most common comment afterwards, is " I was giving lessons at my club for x yrs, but it wasn't till I went on the CPSA course that I realised my knowledge / instructional content was as poor as it was".

 

We also found that established coaches from shooting grounds or other qualification organisations found the knowledge base required in the CPSA to be considerably higher than they had needed for their existing outside qualifications, or within their existing jobs. We had coaches from top UK shooting grounds with many years of experience fail.

 

Yes, there will always be the odd instructor who qualifies and goes back to old ways giving poor advice, but reputation and repeats count, and they are unlikely to make a living as a 1:2:1 coach, they will probably do very nicely on corporate days, and introducing young shots at have a goes etc.

 

99% say a CPSA safety course or an IDW is a big eye-opener. Before you criticise the system, or repeat generalisations, go on one of the courses yourself. I'd be interested to hear your comments afterwards.

 

I am no longer personally involved in the CPSA Academy ( ie train the trainers), but I do believe it is a very robust system and that it does turn out a good product in qualified instructors for the benefit of all who need tuition.

 

Jerry

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share
Go to topic listing

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...