Bleeding heart liberals and do gooders what have they done .

[Harnser]

Have they ruined this country with their weak willed policies and constant propaganda against a people who given the chance of a referendum would surely bring back capital punishment ,tougher imigration laws ,the birch for yobs , life in prison for drug pushers , death penalty for child rape , castration for sexual offences against children ,i could go on .

I think they have and look foreward to the revolution when they will be given the chance to explain themselves to the rest off society ,or will they just crawl under the nearest rock and hide away . Harnser .

[bob300w]

Have they ruined this country with their weak willed policies and constant propaganda against a people who given the chance of a referendum would surely bring back capital punishment ,tougher imigration laws ,the birch for yobs , life in prison for drug pushers , death penalty for child rape , castration for sexual offences against children ,i could go on .

I think they have and look foreward to the revolution when they will be given the chance to explain themselves to the rest off society ,or will they just crawl under the nearest rock and hide away . Harnser .

Harnser, I, and I suspect 90% of the population of this once-great country feel the same as yourself, unfortunatly we cannot go back now, it's far too late, we have long since passed the point of no return. There will be no revolution, because by the time we are pushed to that point, there will be no legally held guns.

[Bryn]

Whilst i agree with your ideas, Harnser i can't help but wonder what brought this on

[bob300w]

Whilst i agree with your ideas, Harnser i can't help but wonder brought on this

:blink:

[Harnser]

Bob,

I think that we can go back to the times of proper law and order . All it needs is voting the proper people in to the government . But that will have to be done by the people of this country .I think that the people are getting just about fed up with the so called leaders of this country . A party with a strong law and order manifesto, in my opinion will do well at the next general election . Harnser .

[bob300w]

Bob,

I think that we can go back to the times of proper law and order . All it needs is voting the proper people in to the government . But that will have to be done by the people of this country .I think that the people are getting just about fed up with the so called leaders of this country . A party with a strong law and order manifesto, in my opinion will do well at the next general election . Harnser .

I know exactly what you are saying, and I agree with you 100%, but what political party fills this criteria? Certainly none of those on offer at the moment.

[Harnser]

There is one Bob , but i personally wouldnt vote for them . Harnser .

[Maiden22]

Whilst i agree with your ideas, Harnser i can't help but wonder brought on this

 

Can't speak for Harnser Bryn, but for me it can be pretty much anything LOL.

 

The revolution has already happened - the liberal revolution that has brought some benefits and also done such terrible damage to this country. It was a slow-motion revolution that was never approved by the people (they were never asked, because they would have given the wrong answer).

 

I think that many if not most of the architects of the liberal revolution were well-meaning if terribly naive people, many of whom would be or are horrified by many of the effects of their actions. The liberalisation of the abortion laws is a case in point. When this "reform" was passed few desired the situation where nearly 200,000 babies are aborted annually in Britain, and the total number aborted since then has surpassed the numbers killed in the holocaust.

 

Others, such as Woy Jenkins, are probably burning in hell as we speak. The permissive society is the civilised society? Oh ******* really?

 

The truth is that many of them are rich and powerful enough to be insulated from the worst effects of their folly. Like Lord Woolf, the Lord Chief Justice who thinks that burglars should not be jailed. A reasonable position if you happen to have 24hr armed police guards. Rather less appealing for the rest of us.

 

Crime doesn't affect them, poor schools don't affect them, mass immigration doesn't affect them, a squalid NHS doesn't affect them, their ivory towers are built far above such things.

 

There will be no further revolution. It must be hard for older people to accept, because they lived through a different reality, but the fact is there is no way back. This should not be surprising - it has happened to many before us, and will happen to many in the future.

 

Our country was special - the best the world has ever produced in my opinion, although few any longer know this or why it was, or even care that it was so. Uniquely civilised, ordered and free, the world had never seen the like, nor will again for many years. The conditions that made us were unique, and the process was necessarily slow and measured.

 

Harnser, this doesn't end in revolution and a long overdue reckoning. It ends where it always ends, in the gutter.

 

Perhaps when historians look back they will wonder how we allowed it to happen, as they have for centuries wondered about Rome and its destruction, marvelling at how such a light was permitted to be extinguished.

 

Robert

[mudpatten]

Needless to say I don`t agree. I think that there is every reason to anticipate a right wing backlash as the lives of ordinary, decent, law abiding citizens are more and more affected by crime, uncontrolled immigration and spineless politicians.

 

You only have to look at Germany in the 1930`s to see the political parallels.

 

I don`t know whether Robert ever worked in a disciplined service but one has to have seen first hand Englishmen under life threatening pressure to understand what will happen. You can kick and beat us for a while, but sooner or later we`ll get up off the floor and fight back. Then God help the opposition.

 

Roberts view of the populace of these islands as whipped and supine reveals a lack of insight into what made this country great. Its people are slow to anger, but terrible in their wrath.

 

Mark my words, the revolution IS coming. With luck, however, it will be through the ballot box.

 

And no, I don`t support the racist lunatics of the National Front.

 

Nick.

[Cranfield]

What we need is Sharia Law.........................................just saying.

[Ferret Master]

What we need is Sharia Law.........................................just saying.

Incoming.

[Evilv]

Have they ruined this country with their weak willed policies and constant propaganda against a people who given the chance of a referendum would surely bring back capital punishment ,tougher imigration laws ,the birch for yobs , life in prison for drug pushers , death penalty for child rape , castration for sexual offences against children ,i could go on .

I think they have and look foreward to the revolution when they will be given the chance to explain themselves to the rest off society ,or will they just crawl under the nearest rock and hide away . Harnser .

Harnser, I, and I suspect 90% of the population of this once-great country feel the same as yourself, unfortunatly we cannot go back now, it's far too late, we have long since passed the point of no return. There will be no revolution, because by the time we are pushed to that point, there will be no legally held guns.

 

 

I wouldn't support all of Harnsers list opf punishments, but the general point about left wing policies having ruined the country I thoroughly agree with. As for Bob's suggestion that it has all gone too far to be got back, I'm not so sure. There is a huge undercurrent of resentment about many things that are happening in this country and changing altogether the character of the land we older ones were brought up in. It isn't the same nation now in many ways. That trend can be stopped and the sooner it is the better. I've never been a racist ever, but I am very angry deep down about the cultural changes that are happening in whole areas of this land. If someone comes to live here, he'd better intend to come and make himself British. I don't care about what colour he is, as long as he has come here to be an Englishman, or a Scot or a Welshman. If he has come just to soak up the benefits and to carry on the way people do wherever he came from, I have a big problem with him. I also don't see how a person can travel overland from Africa or the Middle East to escape persecution in whatever God forsaken hole he came from, sneak in here in the back of a lorry and then claim he is seeking asylum. How does that work? If he wanted asylum, he could have got that as soon as he crossed the border of his own land. If he comes here in the back of the truck having crossed half the planet, he is an open and shut freeloader and criminal looking for a good life. That is not the same thing at all. The politicians of this nation have become an easy touch and lack the spine to stand up and stop these scum from taking our country from us and turning it into something horrible just like where they came from. Worst of all, they parrot the rubbish that chants how wonderful all this sliding into medieval cultural standards is and how terribly tuned in people are who like that kind of thing. I mean, it's great to make women dress up in a black sack isn't it chaps? Very PC.

 

Back to the point - this could be put right in short order if there was a party ready to do it. That is the problem, not the people. People will vote for a respectable party that espouses their ideals.

 

Bob has a point about whether any of the mainstream parties have the stomach to take on the things that are ruining the land we love. The one party that says it will do these things is unfortunately tainted with the stink of neo - nazi extremism. My old man fought against all that as I dare say did some of yours. My mother now dead was in the forces too at that time, and I'm not going to vote for any party that has the links and the membership extremes that would have supported old Adolf and his gang.

 

By the way Bob - the eastern Europeans showed that you don't need an armed insurrection to bring about radical change in government. They all just stood in the open and chanted and government after government toppled.

 

 

 

 

ORANGE REVOLUTION

Edited August 4, 2008 by Evilv

[Maiden22]

What we need is Sharia Law.........................................just saying.

 

Good evening Archbishop .

 

Robert

[Chard]

What we need is Sharia Law.........................................just saying.

 

Insh'Allah

[death from below]

It's like any other movement......we(the hard working class of this country....whatever age/sex/colour) have let this happen to ourselves.....by standing by aimlessly whilst soft politicians and soft leaders drown the country in watered down left wing drivel politics. We as a voting nation have let this happen to us and we are getting the society we deserve. there is hope at the end tunnel I believe. I have been in my chosen career for 18 years now and I can slowly see the wheels turning back towards the ideas and principles for which I first signed on the dotted lines all those years ago. The grievances that we all moan about but do little to correct will implode the country in a few years, I believe, and some sort of reasonable justice system will prevail where by the 'victims' of crime will be fairly judged when taking appropriate action against the unlawful of this country.

 

What I reckon anyway

[Maiden22]

Needless to say I don`t agree. I think that there is every reason to anticipate a right wing backlash as the lives of ordinary, decent, law abiding citizens are more and more affected by crime, uncontrolled immigration and spineless politicians.

 

You only have to look at Germany in the 1930`s to see the political parallels.

 

I don`t know whether Robert ever worked in a disciplined service but one has to have seen first hand Englishmen under life threatening pressure to understand what will happen. You can kick and beat us for a while, but sooner or later we`ll get up off the floor and fight back. Then God help the opposition.

 

Roberts view of the populace of these islands as whipped and supine reveals a lack of insight into what made this country great. Its people are slow to anger, but terrible in their wrath.

 

Mark my words, the revolution IS coming. With luck, however, it will be through the ballot box.

 

And no, I don`t support the racist lunatics of the National Front.

 

Nick.

 

I hope that you're right, and I agree that the British possessed astonishing qualities. But I think that these evolved from indistinct intangible things - our history, our culture, our strange mix of tolerance and bloody-mindedness, our reckless adventurism and our love of the small, the homely and the familiar, our remarkably law-abiding nature and our extreme suspicion of all authority, our passion for fair play and our unshakeable conviction in our own superiority.

 

Our society evolved, it wasn't and couldn't be created. But it needed nurturing by tradition, history, family, religion - all things that have been systematically destroyed over the past decades. We have no sense of identity or meaning, and all we know of our history is the lie that it was shameful and best forgotten.

 

It is true that there may well be a nasty backlash, and in fact this is already happening in unlikely places around Europe. I can think of few things more unplesant, or less British.

 

Robert

[paulf]

Although I dont and would never suport capital punishment or the birch i wholehartedly agree on true life sentences, Zero tollerance to low level disorder and castration of sex ofenders.

[Evilv]

Although I dont and would never suport capital punishment or the birch i wholehartedly agree on true life sentences, Zero tollerance to low level disorder and castration of sex ofenders.

 

But that would imply that you had total confidence in the honesty of witnesses, the police and the infallibility of the courts. It would be damned hard lines to find that a later appeal exonerated you of the accusation leveled at you by a lunatic or a bungled investigation. I have absolutely no confidence in the courts to nail the right people all the time. If you want to cut off somebodies private parts, you'd better damned well get the right man 100% of the time. Same with hanging. That's why I said earlier that I wouldn't go all the way with Harnser's list of punishments. We know full well that people are convicted who are innocent. Prison is bad enough in such a case, to be hanged or deprived of your nads would be much worse.

Edited August 4, 2008 by Evilv

[paulf]

Elviv, I cant think of one child molester whos been wrongfully convicted, DNA testing makes proof of sex ofenders almost absolute hence my suport of castration.

 

I do however agree with you regards the death penalty.

Edited August 4, 2008 by paulf

[Evilv]

Elviv, I cant think of one child molester whos been wrongfully convicted, DNA testing makes proof of sex ofenders almost absolute hence my suport of castration.

 

I do however agree with you regards the death penalty.

 

Tell that to Stephan Kiszko. Sixteen years convicted of the murder and rape of a poor little girl Leslie Moleseed. Problam was, he was retarded and innocent and badgered by police into confessing. When he later retracted, the courts looked at the misfit simpleton and decded he had done it. In fact, Ronald Castree did it as was later proved.

 

All kinds of people are accused of rape without any good reason. Some dysfunctional schoolgirls threaten men they will accuse them of sex crimes. I know, I have worked with some of them. There are a lot of evil people around and some of them are not the archetypal villains. They are people who falsely accuse people they want to control.

 

Of course child molesting perverts need to be punished, but if anyone thinks we have a good justice system here in the UK they are kidding themselves. Innocent people are regularly convicted and guilty ones go free. I can remember my grandfather extolling the view that. 'British Justice is the best in the world'. God help the rest then - that's all.

[Harnser]

It seems a misconception by some people that the police only prosecute innocent people . I have sat through hundreds of criminal court cases throughout the uk .Ranging from petty theft to murder . I can honestly put my hand on my heart and say that i have never seen an innocent person convicted of a crime ,but have seen many guilty people found not guilty . Harnser .

[Harnser]

What we need is Sharia Law.........................................just saying.

 

Its a start cranfield ,but not tough enough . Harnser .

[Evilv]

It seems a misconception by some people that the police only prosecute innocent people . I have sat through hundreds of criminal court cases throughout the uk .Ranging from petty theft to murder . I can honestly put my hand on my heart and say that i have never seen an innocent person convicted of a crime ,but have seen many guilty people found not guilty . Harnser .

 

Well that's your opinion and you are entitled to think as you like of course, but that doesn't make you right any more than I am. What makes you right is incontrovertible evidence.

 

Of course the police don't ONLY prosecute the innocent. I don't think I read any post that said they did, but anyone who thinks that innocent people don't get convicted is a fool. The court system doesn't think that either. That's why we have courts of appeal and that's why every year people convicted of heinous crimes and having served often long sentences are released without a stain on their character and compensated. There is massive evidence that there are quite often miscarriages of justice and I don't understand how a rational man could deny it. It's perhaps easy to rubbish the freeing of people like Barry George as you did the other day when it isn't you that has been locked up and traduced for eight years. It suggests a rather cavalier attitude to people's liberty if you don't mind me saying so. But before you dismiss me as a 'lefty' which I am not, just remember that respect for liberty is a Conservative principle and it is a fundamental principle of this nation leading back to the signing of the Magna Carter in 1215.

 

By the way Harnser - I've seen guilty people found not guilty, particularly by magistrates - laughably so in fact. I'm not a soft touch on crime. I would never have found some individuals not guilty in some of the cases I have sat through. I did this because I was thinking of becoming a magistrate, or at least applying to become one, and I spent a few weeks in court and saw some right villains let off. Fortunately, these were all rather trivial cases. I also saw a vastly inefficient system at work in which solicitors could spin out the process to no ones benefit other than their clients. Most appearances ended with an adjournment.

Edited August 4, 2008 by Evilv

[Evilv]

Whilst i agree with your ideas, Harnser i can't help but wonder brought on this

 

Can't speak for Harnser Bryn, but for me it can be pretty much anything LOL.

 

The revolution has already happened - the liberal revolution that has brought some benefits and also done such terrible damage to this country. It was a slow-motion revolution that was never approved by the people (they were never asked, because they would have given the wrong answer).

 

I think that many if not most of the architects of the liberal revolution were well-meaning if terribly naive people, many of whom would be or are horrified by many of the effects of their actions. The liberalisation of the abortion laws is a case in point. When this "reform" was passed few desired the situation where nearly 200,000 babies are aborted annually in Britain, and the total number aborted since then has surpassed the numbers killed in the holocaust.

 

Others, such as Woy Jenkins, are probably burning in hell as we speak. The permissive society is the civilised society? Oh ******* really?

 

The truth is that many of them are rich and powerful enough to be insulated from the worst effects of their folly. Like Lord Woolf, the Lord Chief Justice who thinks that burglars should not be jailed. A reasonable position if you happen to have 24hr armed police guards. Rather less appealing for the rest of us.

 

Crime doesn't affect them, poor schools don't affect them, mass immigration doesn't affect them, a squalid NHS doesn't affect them, their ivory towers are built far above such things.

 

There will be no further revolution. It must be hard for older people to accept, because they lived through a different reality, but the fact is there is no way back. This should not be surprising - it has happened to many before us, and will happen to many in the future.

 

Our country was special - the best the world has ever produced in my opinion, although few any longer know this or why it was, or even care that it was so. Uniquely civilised, ordered and free, the world had never seen the like, nor will again for many years. The conditions that made us were unique, and the process was necessarily slow and measured.

 

Harnser, this doesn't end in revolution and a long overdue reckoning. It ends where it always ends, in the gutter.

 

Perhaps when historians look back they will wonder how we allowed it to happen, as they have for centuries wondered about Rome and its destruction, marvelling at how such a light was permitted to be extinguished.

 

Robert

 

This is an important contribution to the discussion in my opinion.

 

I think a lot of these ills can be traced right back to 1968. Events then led to a revolution of sorts which at the time I thought were exciting and wonderful. Sadly - things got out of hand and we now have perhaps hundreds of thousands of fatherless children growing up in a moral vacuum, politicians who clap hands at the subversion of our culture by a malign foreign religion, and cities so changed in the character of their people, that my grandfather would think he had been transported to the hinterland of Hindu Kush, rather than that he was in Birmingham, Leeds, Leicester, or London.

Edited August 4, 2008 by Evilv

[Harnser]

Evilv .

I am glad that you were able to spend a couple of weeks in magistrates courts watching the due process of law . I spent 25 years in at the deep end with these people and know what they are capable of . The majority of people in prison are mainly inadequets and are in prison because there is no alternative . The remainder are full time professional criminals who will do any thing to beat the system ,and i mean any thing .

I dont doubt that innocent people have been convicted of crimes but it is very rare . The system that we have is the best in the world and has been copied by many other nations . All i am saying is that we should respect the system and give it our full support and do away with all the left wing propogander that has tipped the balance in favour of the evil people who will rape , murder , blow us up and rob us while we sleep .

If we want this system to work then we must be prepared to accept the fact that on the rare occation an innocent person may be convicted . What we can do without is the bleeding heart liberals knocking the system all time . By the way did you know that there is no appeal against a guilty plea and thats the main reason for a not guilty plea at crown court . Harnser .