DanBettin

https://www.guntrader.uk/guns/shotguns/longthorne/over-under/12-gauge/the-hesketh-deluxe-171121151008001 Pretty special.

I have a bettinsoli too, it's a cheap gun - but for the reasons you described in your last sentence, I can't say I'm in a rush as such to upgrade. Still, I love the look of some of the 'up-market' guns, wouldn't mind a go of a few.

Title. I'm kind of new to the sport, so my experiences have all been with club guns or my own (relatively) affordable gun, but I wouldn't mind shooting 50 with a H&H royal or longthorne, if only for the looks alone.

Thanks for sharing, mate. A good mate of mine is looking to apply soon, I'll share this thread with him to give him a heads up on the wait. Good luck with it, I imagine it'll be March before you know it

From the few posts I've seen you seem like the right guy for the job. Pretty patient in the other thread and helped me improve my shot and I haven't even met you so I'm sure you'll do well as a paid instructor. Let me know if you ever do lessons in the North West mate.

Maybe I'm paranoid and (again!) over-thinking things, but I like to do things by e-mail, you have a paper trail that way of commitments that have been made. Further still (but this definitely is my paranoia), I have an app for recording calls on my android called ACL. When things heat up a bit, I always let them know I'm recording my calls for training and monitoring purposes. If it's good enough for them.... EDIT: I guess the above's probably irrelevant, since they're not denying what they claimed they'd do, they're just blatantly saying they go back on their word. Idiots mate.

Well I think it's only fair I post an update and concede. I cancelled plans I had today and went to Worsley to redeem myself from a bad shoot on Sunday which I was losing sleep over. Decided to totally forget about the gun and really try and fall back to instinct and pointing rather than thinking and aiming. I've just had the best shoot i've ever had, and worsley has some challenging birds. Appreciate your replies, it's quite obvious my tendency to over think things takes away from my instinct to shoot well as you say. Thanks

My point is that this is valid at certain distances is it not? Since I'll be shooting higher on closer clays? Basically, I was shooting with no rib, and hitting the clays left, right and centre. But noticed on the further clays, the idea of blotting out a clay from a distance didn't work since I needed to see the path of the clay I was trying to shoot! So I started mounting my gun to see a bit of rib, and coincidentally it's more comfortable. But now it's at an angle, which I think is giving me more problems. The general consensus here is to stop thinking about it and just shoot, but from a practical sense what does that mean I do next time I go out? I'm even starting to annoy myself now, and it seems like I'm being stubborn with this for the sake of it but I'm just thinking, how should the gun fit? What is my sight picture and where is that clay in my sight picture when I pull the trigger? I reckon they're very real questions. I've had a few lessons, when I seen no rib I done well on them, so no faults were picked up on - but it wasn't ideal making the clays disappear on every target (as opposed to just the driven/rising ones). ------------------------- Btw, thanks for all the replies so far! Appreciate the wisdom of shooters that are obviously better than me, I don't mean to seem impatient, just trying to work out what's what.

Got it in one, I'm a software engineer so I make a living from over-thinking things. But if I'm hitting a blocker and not managing to smash targets - then I'm bound to look at analysing it a bit at least.

I definitely get this, and I'm at a level where I also don't consciously focus on the bead, but I'm aware of where it is in relation to the target, since this will determine whether I need to bring my gun up to meet it or, basically, where I should be looking then to place the shot.

How will he tell if it's a good gun fit? Does it not matter where it's pointing?

Been led to believe a good fitting gun is one that you can consistently mount comfortably with your point of aim right as soon as it's mounted. That point of aim is valid for clays at one distance but it's a lot lower further out. If someone was to check my gun fit, wouldn't they check where I was pointing it? To get there though, to a point where you're able to disregard the sight picture, you've definitely had to work some things out more consciously, surely. By the way, these are honest questions. I'm not trying to prove a point, I'm wondering how to make sure that my approach is right before I can expect it to become second nature.

You're not saying the same as what ips is, I kind of agree with him - there's a lot of thought gone into this, probably far too much since it's a pretty instinctive thing, but that's most certainly not the same as me trying to shortcut it. I guess what I'd ask is how you know your gun mount is 'good'. If the first time you mount the gun there's no rib, then the second there is, that's not good - that's inconsistency. Also, it's not good to practice what I'm doing poorly over and over again without tweaking my approach to progress. Let me try and simplify what I'm asking - is it not a problem that the gun 'fits' less at a distance? Point taken, as I said above I agree with you. I'm not making terrible progress, to be honest, it's only the birds in the distance that are causing me a bit of a headache so I'm trying to work out why. I struggle with the notion of just disregarding the sight picture altogether and 'just shooting it'. That's not really practical, how much rib you see is pretty important, and how much lead is too, initially they're things you need to think about before you can get to a point where you don't need to think about it.

It'll take some explaining this, I've kind of touched on it before but I can't find anywhere at all that addresses what I'm on about. I finally got around to buying a laser bore sight for my 12 gauge. Using it, I can see that at 25 yards, for example, the laser is on the bead. At 40/50 yards, the laser is increasingly above the bead. This is because I have some rib visible, which means the gun's ever so slightly pointing upwards, which matters more and more the further out a target/clay is. If I flattened out the gun when mounted (i.e. see no rib at all), the laser remains on the bead so it is more accurate in that sense. The problem with shooting with this kind of sight picture (I know, because I've only just started with a better fit), is that you obscure a lot of your view, so regardless of what bird you're shooting at - it has to disappear behind the bead in order for you to shoot at it. I struggle sometimes with the birds right out in the distance, and I think I'm usually below them. This could kind of explain why, can anyone give any insight into whether this should even matter that much? Does the pattern opening up take care of this anyway? edit

That's pretty extreme, it's interesting that - since I've always thought with my own ground I'd be out there every day, but you've obviously felt what I felt on Sunday with that pressure looming. Thanks for sharing mate. I can't say I'm a natural myself, but I've got an obsessive personality. So rather than just dismiss it as not my forte I'm hooked on trying to progress. I'm happy so far, to be honest - I think I have been sticking with the easier familiar birds but even when not - I'm making decent progress, but I shot like that bag of cack you mentioned with 7 of my pals looking on with great expectation.

I think if your mates have already been before it's probably different, if I took them back again I'd be a lot more relaxed and so (I'd hope!) I performed a bit better. I think it threw me off because as TC said I was hosting, which meant I had a million things going on. Also, they had the expectation I'd be great since I've been going for a while so didn't feel great performing terribly. I do go with mates now and then who also go often, we're on each other's case too, I'm OK with that pressure I think. Strange.

I guess it is part of the learning process. Pretty frustrating, I can deal with the embarrassment in front of friends, but I think the real hit comes from the fact that, the way I shot, it's as though I hadn't dedicated a ton of time and money into it. Rather deflating. I think I also need to get to some different shooting grounds, this was the first time I'd been here, totally different clays - I think I'm sticking to my comfort zone with the ground I go to since I know their layout like the back of my hand.

How important do you think your mental game is when it comes to shooting? Been making great progress lately, hitting all sorts of moderately difficult targets consistently, the ones with a bit of distance I'm struggling with but making improvements. Took a few friends out (all new to shooting) on the weekend and had a million things on my mind, making sure everyone was safe, making sure everyone enjoyed it etc. etc. and missed majority of what I shot at. Head just wasn't in it, for some reason when I'm not relaxed I tend to shoot under the clay (I think it's because I'm too nervous to let it out of my sight by get 'up' to it and blotting it out when I need to). Someone reassure me by telling me these shocking days are typical when your head's elsewhere. I thought even with distractions I'd be smashing most of them but seems the mental side to this sport is MASSIVE. I'm not going to feel right again until I get to shoot and redeem myself on Saturday!

It's crazy that by now none of these specialists have contemplated a 'balance' may just be the answer, may also be the reason they're struggling to be consistent.

Pebcak.

It's been said a few times already so don't quite know why I'm posting this but if I were you I'd play it safe with Bose. Soundlink ticks all the boxes.

Brilliant those mate, good work

Just don't do it? I'm not being facetious, but really - just play it safe and don't go near them?

I know the feeling mate. I'm entirely addicted to shooting so, for me, whether to give up or not is a no-brainer - but it's a horrible feeling when you hit a wall. I've been terrible (consistently) up until recently, and I've been shooting for 2 years. Sorting the following helped me break through that plateau, and trust me - it's well, well worth it when you do: - Know where your pattern is going (point of aim). If you're not sure where the clay should sit in your sight picture when you pull the trigger - how do you know when to? Until I fixed the fit of my gun, I was very low on it, meaning I had to blot out the clays before I shot them. Terrible approach - but at least I knew consistently where I needed to be. After a while, you want be thinking about where to aim. Get your gun fit sorted, and get to a ground that has a pattern plate. If you can't, look into getting a laser for the barrels for you to have a play about with (note: a lot of the cheap ones won't let you close the barrels, avoid them). - Consistent gun mount - no point at all in working out where your pattern is going if your gun mount changes every time. Consistency is key, it kind of forms a foundation on which you can then start practicing the following. - Lead. Don't get too obsessed with it, but get used to shooting into 'nothingness'. It's uncomfortable, and it's not intuitive to be shooting well away from something you're trying to hit but it most clays you'll be presented with require it - so try and condition yourself to 'feel' where to hit it (using distance and speed). - Be systematic. If you don't have an instructor with you, it's upto you to work out where you're going wrong. Don't give any amount of lead the first time you miss a clay, and then some random amount of lead the next time, and then try again with some other stab in the dark. Instead, give it no lead if you must, then a touch more, then a touch more - until you hit it.

There's a LOT of debate around gender lately. In America it's a bigger talking point than the UK, since recent legislation (bill C16) makes it a criminal offence to not refer to somebody by the pronoun they choose rather than the gender you'd assume. It's outrageous. Disgusted by most of the stories I'm hearing when it comes to kids. A parent who blocks their child's growth process is a disgraceful parent. Like Scully, if my boy wanted to play with dolls and dress up, I'd just let it play out, it's harmless. But to interpret that behaviour as adequate cause for hormone treatment is criminal.