robc89 Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Well i have had my .22rf and .17hmr for a while now. Im finding alot more foxes on my permission, have shot a couple now with the .17hmr but i notice on here and in magazines that not many people use a rimfire for foxing as a centre fire is far supperior. Iv foned the relevant departments and they have informed me if i have a good enough reason for a centre fire then they will grant it as long as i shoot with someone for a while as i suspect every1 knows anyway. My only query now is what caliber should i be applying for in your oppinions? And if anyone can tell me about when they made the change from rimfire to centre fire? Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeymagic1969 Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 (edited) 222, 223 or 22-250 for foxes or if you think you may get the chance to go stalking as well one day, then try for a .243 .223 is probably the most common round used for foxing in this country. Edited November 19, 2009 by monkeymagic1969 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robc89 Posted November 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 well im intending on doing my dsc1 as soon as i can afford it in the new year so do you think i should just ask for .243 or should i also apply for .223? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docholiday Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 If you can justify it ask for both, you dont have to buy them but easier if you have them on your ticket from the start (and cheaper) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 If you're going for your DSC go for a .243 then you don't need to buy 2 guns 2 scopes 2 moderators etc. At the interview they will say if its an issue if so go for a .223 but if you show reason and have some experience behind you it should be fine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 (edited) Hi, Except for the fact that I'd have added 22 Hornet, what Monkeymagic said is good. However, you are the best person to answer the question. Just ask yourself two questions; in the forseeable future am I, A. going to shoot deer and, B. am I likely to get any further permissions. While you're thinking about it, have a wander around your shoot and see what is the range of the longest safe shot that you will make. A. is yes, then 243 B. is yes, then 223 would be sensible A. and B. no, then less than 200yds is 22Hornet, over 200 is 222 and out to 250+ is 223 or 22-250. Good luck Rob, when I started this there was only Monkey's reply but I got dragged away and the scenario has changed, so now what Al4x and Doc say Edited November 19, 2009 by wymberley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robc89 Posted November 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 rite well i think im gonna go for .223 and .243 and like you say they will let me know if its a problem they shouldnt just refuse it. I was gonna try and get my rimfire calibers opened but i think ill just get the dsc1 done and then they should open it up after that. Thanks for the advice guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 I'd just ask for a .243. It's not much more expensive to feed than a .223 and will give you the option of Deer. If you ask for a .223 for the Fox then a .243 wouldn't be my first choice as a Deer calibre. Go for something a bit bigger like a 6.5x55, .270 or .308. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newsportshooter Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Ask for .223 for fox (& the occasional long rang Hare) and 7mm 08 for Deer (it flatter than a .308 and has much less recoil than a .270). If you have suitable (ie has the relevant targets fox & deer) permission, which has been police checked, then thereshould be no problems asking for both. I would suspect you will have mentor conditions attached to the deer rifle slot (which ever calibre you go for) but you should be OK for the .223 without conditions if you've be shooting with the rimfires for a while without incident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 There are really two ways of looking at this situation. Firstly the .243 for everything. This would mean that you only have to buy one kit. You could get a better rifle and scope package this way as you could budget higher. My issue would be that with just a .243 you would ideally need two bullet weights, one controlled expansion type for Deer and one fragmenting type for Fox. That's in an ideal world, but if you have good backstops for your Foxing and are prepared to learn the trajectory then a Deer bullet will kill a Fox just fine! If you only really want to buy one gun then this option is ok and will work (but see my last point at the bottom). Second option is a .223 for Fox and a bigger round for Deer. The only reason for getting the .243 in my opinion is that it is a stunning Fox calibre that is Deer legal. For Deer though I feel you can make better choices (although many people take every uk species of Deer with the .243). A heavier and bigger bullet just does the job that little bit better. A Deer is a tough animal so a little more gun isn't a bad thing. The slower, heavier and bigger round often causes less bruising around the shot area whilst still making a big hole to offer good blood loss. The choice is yours. What I'm really trying to say is that if you do decide to go the two guns route, the .243 may not be the best choice of Deer calibre as it's a bit light. If I had to buy one rifle for Fox and Deer it would be either the .243 for smaller Deer species or the .260 Remington if I was going for bigger Deer too. The .260 is a .308 case necked down to 6.5mm. It handles lighter bullets better than the 6.5x55 but will also fire a much heavier bullet than the .243, up to 140grn or more. If you were to fire a 100 or 120 grain bullet from the .260 it would be a great multi purpose tool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robc89 Posted November 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 interesting.. so maybe maybe if applying for 2 guns calibres i should ask for a lesser.22 calibre for foxes and a calibre higher than .243 for deer. Possibly for my circumstance having only shot rimfires it would be best to just apply for .243. As short term i can use it for the fox problem i have and also use it for the Pre DSC course and the DSC1 course itself? Hmmm decisions decisions thanks for all the information tho its really appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeymagic1969 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 only need to go bigger than .243 if you are going after Red deer - a 243 will drop any of the others very well ( talking from experiance here) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robc89 Posted November 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 the only reason i thought i would go for .223 is i thought it may be preferred by some farmers as aposed to a higher calibre. Think ill just go for the one calibre tho .243. Cheaper than applying for 2 guns and mods, more money to spend on the gun itself and can use for everything. I think there wouldnt be much chance of me being granted anything higher than that for a while. Ill just focus on getting the DSC1 done in january i think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 farmers generally don't mind, .223 isn't that tame a calibre compared to a .243. If you're after deer just go for the one as NJC said the .243 is superior to the .223 for foxes so why take the lesser caliber out. Plus with each gun fully kitted being likely to be in excess of 1K why pay that twice then have to buy two types of amunition etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 Being down in Cornwall do you have the same number of Red Deer as Devon? Devon stags are pretty big animals so if you plan to get out on them I would go for a 6.5x55 or .260 Rem. They're still acceptable for Fox but can handle heavier bullets than the .243. If you really want a .243 plenty of people get by with it for Reds, it's by no means a lightweight calibre. The .260 would be my choice though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Galore! Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 i got caught out with something like this when i put in for a variation on my ticket. my FLO advised me to get some more experience with centrefire before i apply for a larger calibre deer rifle, they may say the same to you. I think the .243 is the smallest calibre allowed for deer, there's some really good advice here about more dedicated calibres so maybe 2 different calibres are the best way to go. .223 is a good calibre to start with for foxing. does anyone know if this calibre can be used on muntjac? if so then you can practice your stalking and get some real experience behind you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robc89 Posted November 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 o man theres too much to think about here isnt there. Am i maybe getting ahead of myself here and should be putting in for like a .22hornet or something?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 24, 2009 Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 nope you're not, all centrefires are dangerous you have some rifle experience behind you so have prooved you are safe with them. Go for a .243 because you want to shoot deer as well and explain you want ideally to just have the one rifle and you should be fine. If its an issue then they can change the calibre to a .223 during the interview Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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