Anti-Hunt protestor walks free

[Pepe]

I can not believe it

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/mar/17/g...aughter-cleared

Killing hunters and shooters in now legal. It would not happen if it was the other way round

[JonnyR]

It would be really interesting to know the facts of this case. It says that the chap was killed because he refused to get out of the way of the gyrocopter, which had just been refuelled.

 

It is impossible for us to know whether his death was accidental or deliberate - either way it is terrible that this chap lost his life.

 

I do agree that if this was an anti that died I think that certain parts of the British press would have given it far more coverage.

[Pepe]

To be fair I do not know the facts but I feel that if this was an anti war protestor being run over by a tank the veredic would have been different. What really winds me up is that people applauded the veredict, have they forgotten somebody died?

 

Deepest sympathies to Trevor Morses families in this difficult times.

[groach1234]

I hope he lost his little gyrocopter licence.

 

George

[libs]

I hope he lost his little gyrocopter licence.

 

George

 

 

And soon hopefully his testicals in a freak vegetable Puréeing accident.

 

He is a murderer, and should be treated as such.

[death from below]

He was fairly tried and aquitted - end of the matter - innocent

[Mungler]

I have said it once and I'll say it again, the English Criminal Justice System is entirely flawed, the CPS are a joke and the jury system.... well don't get me started on that. Mind you, our legal system is considered in World terms, to be quite advanced in that it's difficult to noble Judges and Jurys.

 

If Trevor Morse was in the way of the gyrocopter, they should have stood down the engines and called the police and sought to have him arrested for either trespass or breach of the peace. Revving it up and attempting a take off was neither safe nor necessary - it's not as though he was about to fly off to save someone from a burning roof top.

 

A better analogy is that of someone standing in a non threatening manner (for example an obstructive but peaceful demonstration) in front of a motor car; were the driver to then proceed and run over the person obstructing the vehicle such as to crush them to death........

Edited March 17, 2010 by Mungler

[starlight32]

I have said it once and I'll say it again, the English Criminal Justice System is entirely flawed, the CPS are a joke and the jury system.... well don't get me started on that. Mind you, our legal system is considered in World terms, to be quite advanced in that it's difficult to noble Judges and Jurys.

 

If Trevor Morse was in the way of the gyrocopter, they should have stood down the engines and called the police and sought to have him arrested for either trespass or breach of the peace. Revving it up and attempting a take off was neither safe nor necessary - it's not as though he was about to fly off to save someone from a burning roof top.

 

A better analogy is that of someone standing in a non threatening manner (for example an obstructive but peaceful demonstration) in front of a motor car; were the driver to then proceed and run over the person obstructing the vehicle such as to crush them to death........

 

 

So on that basis Mung, if the anti hunt protestr have been on the highway and in a car and ran him down, do you think the jury would have found him guilty?

 

Also can a jury in such a case this be 'advised' in any way to an expected outcome?

[digger]

He was tried at Crown Court and cleared by a majority of 10 - 2 by the jury. Therefore the jury members are a bunch of twits and I hope the pilot crashes on his next flight, killing his passenger in the process. Hunt monitors are pathetic little hypocrites, they run to the police when it suits them and hide behind masks when it doesnt.

Verminous, odious cretins who deserve a good kicking every week

[Mungler]

So on that basis Mung, if the anti hunt protestr have been on the highway and in a car and ran him down, do you think the jury would have found him guilty?

 

Also can a jury in such a case this be 'advised' in any way to an expected outcome?

 

 

If you are asking me were it a hunt supporter in a Range Rover and an anti standing in the road.... yes I reckon the person behind the wheel of the Range Rover would have gone down for it big time.

 

A Jury is filled with the unemployed and the unemployable - normal people with jobs to do, mortgages to pay and families to see, will do everything in their power to avoid jury service. It is human nature. There is also pressure from employers - if one of my key members of staff told me they were about to get called up on the Maxwell fraud trial and that they would see me in a year or so and I had to keep their job open for them etc.... well I would do all I could to make sure they weren't called. Accordingly, the quality of jurors can be somewhat lacking.

 

On this aspect of how a jury is comprised, I really don't know what the answer is - I am not comfortable with criminal trials run by a single Judge. Maybe there should be professional jurors who are anonymous and who get paid properly and visit the Courts across the Country.

[richie223]

If you are asking me were it a hunt supporter in a Range Rover and an anti standing in the road.... yes I reckon the person behind the wheel of the Range Rover would have gone down for it big time.

 

A Jury is filled with the unemployed and the unemployable - normal people with jobs to do, mortgages to pay and families to see, will do everything in their power to avoid jury service. It is human nature. There is also pressure from employers - if one of my key members of staff told me they were about to get called up on the Maxwell fraud trial and that they would see me in a year or so and I had to keep their job open for them etc.... well I would do all I could to make sure they weren't called. Accordingly, the quality of jurors can be somewhat lacking.

 

On this aspect of how a jury is comprised, I really don't know what the answer is - I am not comfortable with criminal trials run by a single Judge. Maybe there should be professional jurors who are anonymous and who get paid properly and visit the Courts across the Country.

well said mungler,totally agree

[malkiserow]

From the scant information I had on the incident, seems both parties were to blame. The thing is one lost his life, to my mind that makes the other guilty. Murder, no but maybe something else?

[Mattw]

I dont like the anti hunt lot any more than the rest of you. The fact remains, you dont walk into an active runway directly infront of an aircraft and expect not to get hurt.

 

If the aircraft was doing somthing dangerous to annoy the hunt, 30 or so phone calls to the CAA to complain and the chap wouldnt have had a licence. Job done...

[Mungler]

From the reports, the chap that got hit was standing still at the time and the gyrocopter was being revved up.

 

As much as the bloke that got hit shouldn't have been standing there, the bloke in the gyrocopter could have just switched it off.

 

There we go.

 

I saw some female relative of the pilot on the news doing a piece to camera after the verdict and she blamed the whole incident on people who chase wild animals with packs of dogs. A lovely slice of logic for you there.

[kdubya]

If you are asking me were it a hunt supporter in a Range Rover and an anti standing in the road.... yes I reckon the person behind the wheel of the Range Rover would have gone down for it big time.

 

A Jury is filled with the unemployed and the unemployable - normal people with jobs to do, mortgages to pay and families to see, will do everything in their power to avoid jury service. It is human nature. There is also pressure from employers - if one of my key members of staff told me they were about to get called up on the Maxwell fraud trial and that they would see me in a year or so and I had to keep their job open for them etc.... well I would do all I could to make sure they weren't called. Accordingly, the quality of jurors can be somewhat lacking.

 

On this aspect of how a jury is comprised, I really don't know what the answer is - I am not comfortable with criminal trials run by a single Judge. Maybe there should be professional jurors who are anonymous and who get paid properly and visit the Courts across the Country.

 

Having actually done jury service your description of the make up of the jury could not be further from the truth, the self employed may squeal a bit? but overall and certainly from my companies point of view jury service is two weeks out of your working life and your done, so no big deal, most of the jury members I was with (got to know a few quite well and one actually worked with me though not on the same shift) worked full time, in this case we may not agree with the verdict but like it or not they sat through the evidence and they made the decision,innocent by majority end of, we gave up burning witches and dunking stools centuries ago, or are they still the norm in Essex?

 

KW

[digger]

We did give up burning witches, we replaced it with people who loathe the police bashing out their frustrations on a keyboard. Constantly knocking the police yet defending the justice system ? Very odd.But then again maybe not, never a copper but once a juror = authority on the judicial system.

I say reintroduce AA guns and declare idiots in rubberband o copters fair game.

[kdubya]

We did give up burning witches, we replaced it with people who loathe the police bashing out their frustrations on a keyboard. Constantly knocking the police yet defending the justice system ? Very odd.But then again maybe not, never a copper but once a juror = authority on the judicial system.

I say reintroduce AA guns and declare idiots in rubberband o copters fair game.

 

 

I replied re my experience of the make up of a jury I was not unemployed or unemployable having worked since the monday following the friday I left school and with the same employer for the last 35 years, the rest of the jury I was with where also EMPLOYED however one case was dismissed as one copper stated she was not the arresting officer had had not delivered the defendant to the charging desk officer(description?) CCTV disagreed :look: and another "lost "his notes defence said that meant he never took any? so there you are a thumbs up for british justice and a bash at plod :yp:

please keep digging eh?

 

KW

[guest1957]

Going back to the original point, it seems that natural justice hasn't been granted. The implication here seems to be that the jury disgreed with idea that the pilot had recognised that continuing on his path of direction was potentially risky even though he knew there were people close to the leathal blades. If this is accepted surely that means a tree-surgeon could fell a tree knowing it could possibly fall in the direction of a protestor and face no legal consequences. All seems a bit dodgy legally, and I hope the deceased's family push for a retrial

[kdubya]

Going back to the original point, it seems that natural justice hasn't been granted. The implication here seems to be that the jury disgreed with idea that the pilot had recognised that continuing on his path of direction was potentially risky even though he knew there were people close to the leathal blades. If this is accepted surely that means a tree-surgeon could fell a tree knowing it could possibly fall in the direction of a protestor and face no legal consequences. All seems a bit dodgy legally, and I hope the deceased's family push for a retrial

 

whilst I agree to a point we dont know the full facts and events, the jury rightly or wrongly found him by a 10 to 2 majority not guilty, thats it end of it, and to try to ridicule the jurors and even question their social makeup is a bit shallow, like you I find it hard to understand whyhe got off, but then again I cant get my head round a man standing in the way of a spinning rotor blade? death wish 6 in the making :yp:

 

KW

[guest1957]

I'm not here to question the jury, but equally will be interested to see whether this goes any further particularly given changes in double-jepordy laws. It would be nice if certain groups such as the HSA didn't see themselves as some sort of guardians of the law as well.

[jonno 357]

The man had bottle to stand there. No brain though. What did he actually achieve? **** all! Head chopped off and a no guilty verdict for trying to be clever

 

He won't be doing that again will he? :yp:

[Mungler]

whilst I agree to a point we dont know the full facts and events, the jury rightly or wrongly found him by a 10 to 2 majority not guilty, thats it end of it, and to try to ridicule the jurors and even question their social makeup is a bit shallow, like you I find it hard to understand whyhe got off, but then again I cant get my head round a man standing in the way of a spinning rotor blade? death wish 6 in the making :yp:

 

KW

 

 

I find it truly hilarious that you lecture me on the jury system having sat on one jury for just two weeks.

[MC]

All these comments about walking onto an active runway and whatever are complete nonsense. If you walked on to the runway at Heathrow all aircraft movements would stop instantly.

 

CAP 658 of the Air navigation order states that is an offence to operate an aircraft recklessly or negligently in a manner that could endanger person or property.

 

The ANO is law, at the very least the pilot was guilty of breaking that part of it as at no point could he say he didn't see the guy.

 

If you walked on to the M25 and got hit by a car then yes it is your own fault but if the driver saw you and could avoid you and still hit you then that is another matter.

[death from below]

Whiging and maoning - our justice system is flawed but it is the model that every other civilised country in the world models itself on - 12 ordinary people heard the story and delivered a sentence - as this is primarily a hunting site I can understand the opposition to the verdict - I actually find both sides pretty sad,ie, the ***** on horseback who flout the law at every meeting and the anoraks that try to stop them.

[Flashman]

...we gave up burning witches and dunking stools centuries ago, or are they still the norm in Essex?

 

KW

Unless it's a monkey, eh? Nowadays, you simply elect them as Mayor.

 

On a serious note, the defendant was buzzing the hunt, trying to disrupt it. Hopefully, there will be a civil prosecution and claim for damages. Blood money will not bring back the victim, but it's better than nothing.

Edited March 18, 2010 by Flashman