B725 Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 A bit of advice from you fac holders.A bloke came to the farm today and asked the farmer if he could have his fac on the farm just to get his ticket but surely he can only shoot on that land or if he has a open ticket why does he need this land.The farmer is leaving it to me but the answer will be no, as it has roads and foot paths on it and no knows him from adam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theosmith Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 (edited) bit selfish tho isnt it, shooters are meant to help each other out!!!!! would you like to be treated like that? i take people out and get taken out on loads of land its all about a bit give and take i hope you try and get a licence and cant get the land, people dont get the land if they dont ask so between 2 of you, you dont know him why does that even matter on loads of my shoots the landowner doesnt or didnt know me people have to start somewhere Edited July 31, 2012 by theosmith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 A bit of advice from you fac holders.A bloke came to the farm today and asked the farmer if he could have his fac on the farm just to get his ticket but surely he can only shoot on that land or if he has a open ticket why does he need this land.The farmer is leaving it to me but the answer will be no, as it has roads and foot paths on it and no knows him from adam. Spot on, sounds like an idiot- why have an FAC if he has no permission Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B725 Posted July 31, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 bit selfish tho isnt it, shooters are meant to help each other out!!!!! would you like to be treated like that? i take people out and get taken out on loads of land its all about a bit give and take i hope you try and get a licence and cant get the land, people dont get the land if they dont ask so between 2 of you, you dont know him why does that even matter on loads of my shoots the landowner doesnt or didnt know me people have to start somewhere I do not think I am being selfish,would you honestly let some one you did not know shoot fac on your land,I do let others shoot there but how the farmer is there has to be some trust.What concerns me was that he said he only wanted approval so to get his fac.Who would take that chance with a stranger with a fac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rec-baller Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 sorry ,, but i agree, most farmers need to gain trust, a mate of mine who was trying to get his ticket came to me and said he had seen a feild with rabbits & pigeons on it and he was going to aproach the farmer to see if he could get permission to shoot on it, when he told me where it was i said i knew the farmer personally " will you come with me to see him " he said, i rang the farmer and arranged a meeting time, on the day we both turned up and i introduced my mate to John the farmer, when i had explained everything he signed a permission slip for my mate and agreed he could shoot the land BUT --only if i was with him, as he knew me. my mate asked John if he would have given him permission if he had turned up on his own ""NO CHANCE, I DONT KNOW YOU FROM ADAM !!" was the reply shaun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeonblasterian Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 I do not think I am being selfish,would you honestly let some one you did not know shoot fac on your land,I do let others shoot there but how the farmer is there has to be some trust.What concerns me was that he said he only wanted approval so to get his fac.Who would take that chance with a stranger with a fac. I think your doing the right thing.Where is this bloke going to go shooting if he gets a fac.Just does not seem right to me just so he can get a fac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brisa Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 Would it be worth you taking him out for a days shooting to sus him out? might be a genuine guy just going a out things the wrong way. When i was 16 or so I posted on an airgun forum looking to buy a rifle, little did I know there was more to it than that in this country and luckily someone set me straight and helped me out. I shoot with the same guy some 9 years on and are very good friends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B725 Posted July 31, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 when or if he gets his fac where will he go? Would there be any come back to me or the farmer if some thing went wrong,to me it seems a little strange thats why I ask you fac holders for advice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brisa Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 i personally wouldn't sign him off to go away get a gun and do god knows what with it but like I said its maybe worth sussing him out and help him go the right way about things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B725 Posted July 31, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 Would it be worth you taking him out for a days shooting to sus him out? might be a genuine guy just going a out things the wrong way. When i was 16 or so I posted on an airgun forum looking to buy a rifle, little did I know there was more to it than that in this country and luckily someone set me straight and helped me out. I shoot with the same guy some 9 years on and are very good friends. You may right and I might be doing him an unjustice but the farmer is nervous of strangers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drut Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 I do not think I am being selfish,would you honestly let some one you did not know shoot fac on your land,I do let others shoot there but how the farmer is there has to be some trust.What concerns me was that he said he only wanted approval so to get his fac.Who would take that chance with a stranger with a fac. I think your reasoning is absolutely spot on,without personal knowledge or someone to vouch for you it is not a reasonable question to ask of a farmer in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brisa Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 I think your reasoning is absolutely spot on,without personal knowledge or someone to vouch for you it is not a reasonable question to ask of a farmer in my opinion. I am from the centre of Belfast originally so the chances of me knowing any land owners was slim, I have done a lot of door knocking at the start and luckily a few people trusted I wasn't a hallion and gave me permission. These days a lot of it is gained by word of mouth but it was a hard start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drut Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 I am from the centre of Belfast originally so the chances of me knowing any land owners was slim, I have done a lot of door knocking at the start and luckily a few people trusted I wasn't a hallion and gave me permission. These days a lot of it is gained by word of mouth but it was a hard start. Good for you!It must have been hard for you,in my area it seems easier to get more permissions once you have some.Given the amount of rural theft/crime in this area farmers are reluctant to have any strangers,shooters or otherwise on their land. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theosmith Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 do you realise how easy it is to even get a gun or even easier make your own? all he wants to do something he likes, and on your origianl post the saying have his licence on there..... does tghis mean he has a licence and wants to get persion there or do you mean the word GET as in wants permission to get his licence there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 Spot on, sounds like an idiot- why have an FAC if he has no permission It's a viscous circle. You can't exactly knock on farmers doors offering to shoot there bunnies, but hang on and I'll apply for my FAC and get round to that in 3-6 months time. Even if this chap has to get land cleared it is much faster. I can see exactly how the situation could arise. Not everyone knows other FAC holders to mentor them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted August 1, 2012 Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 It's a viscous circle. You can't exactly knock on farmers doors offering to shoot there bunnies, but hang on and I'll apply for my FAC and get round to that in 3-6 months time. Even if this chap has to get land cleared it is much faster. I can see exactly how the situation could arise. Not everyone knows other FAC holders to mentor them. Err, what about stating with airgun and shotgun like 99% of us do? I would deffo turn such a guy away "i want a gun, and i only need permision to be granted one" Nope not having him on. Like it or not need and "good reason" must come first to FAC guns Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedwards1966 Posted August 1, 2012 Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 Well it's not actually that uncommon for people to get 'permission' to shoot a piece of land in order to get a FAC, but on an understanding that they won't actually shoot on it. It's easily done (as an example) to get a fox/deer rifle - say a force won't allow a .243 for foxes, if the person wanting one gets a 'permission' for deer then he gets the rifle he's after, and the police are happy. It does help, as a) some forces do issue open certificates immediately, and B) it then gives the person a FAC and all they then need, having found a permission at a later date, is to get on and shoot it, or get it passed first. Considering how long it can take to get a FAC it can be a very sensible way to get into it. Stating with a shotgun has it's limitations, and if I had to start hunting with an air-rifle I think I'd quit - so pathetically limited. Oh, just because the land has paths on it does not automatically make it unsuitable for police clearance, loads of land has paths through it and the police can be perfectly OK with it. With all this said about the reasons why it may be OK (it's very important to help as many people into shooting as possible), I'm not suggesting you allow this to go ahead on this land. He might be asking for any reason - does he just want a gun, but with no actual reason to? Dangerous motives perhaps? Most likely he just wants to get into shooting and has started by asking. It's very hard to start shooting unless you know someone with suitable land who can give you permission, it's not easy. It's quite possible that he's just taken it a bit far in asking a stranger for permission, that's all. Unless you feel 100% sure that the person is OK (not likely as you don't know him) and has good reason to do this (the thought of someone using this as a way of getting a gun then shooting someone/people hardly bears thinking about) then the answer should be no. Perhaps you could point him in the direction of a nearby rifle club, and suggest he tries to get into target shooting/club membership first? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houlsby Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 To be fair guys, alot of farmers and keepers "sign off" their mates and even random people sometimes. I have 4 farms where the guys wouldn't help me get my fac, but as soon as they know I now have one there now ringing me and asking me to come over to sort there fox,rabbit, etc. so it does work both ways, if someone had "signed me off" before now id have been doing this ages ago! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshLamb Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 I do not think I am being selfish,would you honestly let some one you did not know shoot fac on your land,I do let others shoot there but how the farmer is there has to be some trust.What concerns me was that he said he only wanted approval so to get his fac.Who would take that chance with a stranger with a fac. Is it actually YOUR land? I.e do you own it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drut Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Err, what about starting with airgun and shotgun like 99% of us do? Good point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vermincinerator Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Even though i agree with B725, a knock on the farmers door is the only way to get permission to shoot on land even if you already have FAC and open ticket, however i would be wary if a guy asked if he could have permission just to get his FAC. Having said that on one occaision in the search for permission, i knocked a local farmers door and even though he would not give permission to actually shoot, he said that he would happy to sign a permission slip to aide getting or keeping my FAC. Ian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SneakyD Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Err, what about stating with airgun and shotgun like 99% of us do? I would deffo turn such a guy away "i want a gun, and i only need permision to be granted one" Nope not having him on. Like it or not need and "good reason" must come first to FAC guns Both of which require a FAC in northern Ireland. Looking for ways to actively exclude people from shooting does none of us any favours in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drut Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 "Both of which require a FAC in northern Ireland. " Original poster is from Tibshelf:Derbyshire I believe.Northern Ireland is a different matter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SneakyD Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 "Both of which require a FAC in northern Ireland. " Original poster is from Tibshelf:Derbyshire I believe.Northern Ireland is a different matter Northern Ireland is different, hence my post. The second point I was making, was that an 'I'm alright Jack' attitude does not best serve our long term interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drut Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Served my time,started with airgun & shotgun,worked my way up gaining contacts & trust on the way.Recommend it to others,it works eventually,cannot see where 'I'm alright Jack' attitude " fits in.Perhaps you will enlighten me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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