big bad lindz Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 I may have to travel to a clay pigeon shoot by train next month as I wont have my car (mid week shoot & wife needs the car). In order to find out the in and out`s of what I can do legaly I was going to ask on PW, but I thought I would first contacted by email the train company- no reply yet, secondly, British transport police- no reply yet and thirdly Northern Constabulary fire arms. Well to my suprise I recieved a reply within 2hrs from them. And what do you know as long as the shotgun is secure in a travel case/box and not out of your sight there is no problem. I am in no doubt that some goody anti may have some thing to say if they knew what was in the box but at least I know I would not doing anything wrong. Has anyone had any hassel transporting a shot gun on public transport ? BBL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul2012 Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 btp once closed the station where i lived because somebody reported a gun in someones bag, turned out to be a trainer, the guy who was 'carrying' was frankly terrified when the aru were in his face lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 I'd print the email from the firearms team and take it with you if I were you. Break it down too so it doesn't look like a shooter. Who'll know? Just don;t get on the Stella from the buffet car then leave it on the train! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr smith Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 Techincally it's against the conditions of carriage,TOC's can allow it if they want.My advice would be,be discrete and chances are none of the staff will know wether their TOC allows it or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swiss.tony Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 man up "MAN" just break it down into a sports bag and no 1 will be any wiser unless you show them and **** the cops if you have a valid licence and its covered in public there nothing any 1 can say or do your not breaking any rules you can go into a bank if you like they would not Evan no its a gun . the stupid rules company's make up is a joke just make sure you have your ticket "sgc" with you just in case save hassle moveing about with guns is nothing if done in correct manner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 Techincally it's against the conditions of carriage, Doesnt it have to be specifically excluded from the TOC? Would that even be legal? (look at the rukus re PO and guns recently) "Public transport". Chances are if you ask they will say no........Which train company Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrispti Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 (edited) I'd put the trigger lock on it, put it into its plastic case, lock that, then put it into a holdall. If it somehow got knicked, at least you've done as much as possible to secure it. What I wouldn't do, is just carry it in a slip. Edited March 1, 2013 by chrispti Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunnerbob Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 Back in the early 1960's, I can remember buying an old sxs shotgun from a junk shop in Cowley Mill Road, Uxbridge and taking it on the 198 bus back home to Hillingdon. I was about 14 at the time and the gun was broken down and stuffed in an open sack. No sgc's in those days and no one cared....try that now ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloke Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 As said, break the gun down into a holdall, put the the forend in your pocket and that should satisfy "reasonable care". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr smith Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 Page 25 of COC says unloaded guns not allowed....but then says ....may be subject to individual Train Company dispensation..... Who says yes and who says no i've no idea and i work for one and i'm pretty not many other employees of any TOC's would know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshLamb Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 I was on a train a few weeks ago. And wondered at the time how many of these people are carrying guns with them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delburt0 Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 No laws against it , it is down to the train company's, ticket blokes discretion , but I wouldn't even let them ponder on it , getit broke down into a hold all take your cert happy days.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 (edited) Page 25 of COC says unloaded guns not allowed....but then says ....may be subject to individual Train Company dispensation..... Who says yes and who says no i've no idea and i work for one and i'm pretty not many other employees of any TOC's would know. Could find no mention on page 25 here: http://nationalrail..../nrcc/NRCOC.pdf 47. Accompanied luggage, articles and animalsYou may take a single item of hand luggage that must be capable of being held in your lap if required, plus up to 2 items of luggage each not exceeding 30 x 70 x 90 cm in size. Unless you are disabled or have reduced mobility and have made arrangements in advance for assistance, you should be able to manage your luggage without additional help. Luggage is carried subject to sufficient space being available in the train service you wish to use. Luggage should not occupy seats intended for passengers; if it does so, it may be charged for as set out in Appendix B. hmmmm 2349. Restrictions Any Train Company may refuse to accept an item of luggage, an article, an animal or a cycle, even though it meets the requirements set out in Condition 47 and 48 and Appendix B, if, in the opinion of its staff: (a) it may cause injury, inconvenience or a nuisance or it may cause damage to property; ( B) there is not enough room for it; © the loading or unloading may cause delay to trains; or (d) it is not carried or packaged in a suitable manner. No mention of guns until Page 29 where "unloaded" ones are allowed Items permitted at the discretion of individual Train Companies, for which a fee may be payable I would suggest mentioning it to the staff is bad idea. Edited March 1, 2013 by HDAV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr smith Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 Okay that's the very latest version now page 29 where it says no guns allowed and no mention of company dispensation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr smith Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 Okay quick re-read thats loaded guns Unloaded at discrestion of TOC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diceman Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 I have been on lots of trains, and I have never had my bag searched by a ticket inspector. Break it down, split the components up as much as possible, pack them so they don't look like bits of gun and let the train take the strain. I was on a train a few weeks ago. And wondered at the time how many of these people are carrying guns with them Swansea? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big bad lindz Posted March 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2013 Cheers for the replys guys. I fully agree with out of sight out of mind. I do have a large enough holdall to carry my shotgun in its berak down case, as what I was intending to do but I was just wanting some confirmation. As good practice I always take my certificate with me when I am out with my local area, and when I have been down the shore wildfowling or out on the pigeons I usually have a copy of it in my car or in my game bag. I have attached the reply from Northern Constabulary. I still have had no reply from Scot Rail or the transport police. BBL You can carry your shotgun on the train provided it is contained in a secure case throughout the journey and not removed for any reason. It must be kept in sight of the certificate holder at all times as responsibility for the security of the weapon rests with the certificate holder. If travelling overnight on a sleeper train written permission must be obtained on production of a valid certificate and must be carried on your person at all times during your journey. The sleeping compartment may not be shared with any person not know to the certificate holder. Hope this helps. Regards A/Deputy Licensing Manager Firearms Licensing Dept Northern Constabulary Police HQ Old Perth Road Inverness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted March 4, 2013 Report Share Posted March 4, 2013 I may have to travel to a clay pigeon shoot by train next month as I wont have my car (mid week shoot & wife needs the car). In order to find out the in and out`s of what I can do legaly I was going to ask on PW, but I thought I would first contacted by email the train company- no reply yet, secondly, British transport police- no reply yet and thirdly Northern Constabulary fire arms. Well to my suprise I recieved a reply within 2hrs from them. And what do you know as long as the shotgun is secure in a travel case/box and not out of your sight there is no problem. I am in no doubt that some goody anti may have some thing to say if they knew what was in the box but at least I know I would not doing anything wrong. Has anyone had any hassel transporting a shot gun on public transport ? BBL There isn't any law which says you can't travel on public transport with firearms. Some train companies don't like you travelling with firearms and try to stop you. The Tyne & Wear Metro got shirty with a couple of chaps I know and said they weren't allowed to travel with firearms. Personally, I don't think they can actually stop you although they clain they can. Public transport is supposed to be just that - public, and they should be required to allow anything which is legal. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney86 Posted March 4, 2013 Report Share Posted March 4, 2013 (edited) I've done it a fair bit around Wales, with the gun broken in a holdall. I checked it wasn't against the law, nothing more. I think it may have been against the TOS, but I think you'd get treated differently on the rural lines. Once I was on my way to a ground by train and the guy that got off in front of me had the barrels sticking out the top of his rucksack :-) The last time I did it I had to walk through Euston past a row of coppers with propper guns - I decided never again! Edited March 4, 2013 by Barney86 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr smith Posted March 5, 2013 Report Share Posted March 5, 2013 Personally, I don't think they can actually stop you although they clain they can. Public transport is supposed to be just that - public J. Yeah pubilc transport that is owned by private companies,their trains their rules. I do agree with you if it's legal you should be able to travel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highseas Posted March 5, 2013 Report Share Posted March 5, 2013 when i moved to scotland i took my 223 17hmr and shotguns up on the train all in full lenth hard cases. and it was standing room only from carlisle to dunblane! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted March 5, 2013 Report Share Posted March 5, 2013 (edited) Yeah pubilc transport that is owned by private companies,their trains their rules. I do agree with you if it's legal you should be able to travel. Not at all............ There are thousands of rules that stop that. Otherwise they could say no "anything they felt like" http://www.arrivatra...k/AllowedItems/ Interesting.... As a guide, you will require special permission for anything over one metre in length, for which we may have to charge you extra, but the common sense rule is that anything that cannot be carried by one person, on their own, cannot be taken on the train. 40 inches is 1.016m (just over the min legal length for a section 2)................ However broken down its well under 1m............... Edited March 5, 2013 by HDAV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeh Posted March 5, 2013 Report Share Posted March 5, 2013 Back in the early 1960's, I can remember buying an old sxs shotgun from a junk shop in Cowley Mill Road, Uxbridge and taking it on the 198 bus back home to Hillingdon. I was about 14 at the time and the gun was broken down and stuffed in an open sack. No sgc's in those days and no one cared....try that now ! Not that many years ago I used to go ferreting with shotguns and take the bus! Never had any issues with the guns but a few bus drivers turned there nose towards the ferrets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angustusgloop Posted March 6, 2013 Report Share Posted March 6, 2013 If you have a ticket to travel you can take a secured unloaded firearm on a train with you. Take all due care to keep in with you, in direct sight and try to never leave the carrier unattended. I would consider disguising the carry case, eg with an old second hand musical instrument case. The doubt on this right to travel with your legally held guns is a classic case of 'colour of law' developing, where the general whispering and fear caused by 'anti-gun' and 'terrorists everywhere' propaganda is making the thought of traveling with a firearm illegal, when in fact it is perfectly legal. To a degree, a visit from the Police ARV is becoming a source of terror in it’s own right. As for the Railway Conditions of Carriage, these truly archaic laws are long overdue for review and sticking out, if you examine them, you don't even have a right to breathe, unless they say so. Back in the days when our railways were a national asset, this *may* have been acceptable, in these days of them being stolen from us for the almighty god of private Profit, I would say they should be actively ignored on point of principle, it’s bad enough a private company has it’s own police force anyway.. You should not advise ANYONE you are traveling with a firearm. The Railway employs an enormous number of people with heavy-duty previous criminal convictions, people you would NOT want knowing you were traveling with, or indeed have, firearms. I speak from personal employment in that industry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr smith Posted March 6, 2013 Report Share Posted March 6, 2013 The Railway employs an enormous number of people with heavy-duty previous criminal convictions, people you would NOT want knowing you were traveling with, or indeed have, firearms. I speak from personal employment in that industry. Really go on give us a clue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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