bikemad24 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 well i picked up my ziess durylt on Wednesday and compared to my hawke edurnce optically there is a big difference it miles better. But unless iv done something wrong mounting the scope its not as accurate when dialing in as the hawke and it has no where near as much elevation (clicks) as the hawke. i can only shoot upto around 230 yrds when dialing in as it runs out (17hmr) i could shoot crows with my hawke at 250 yrds but cant with the ziess. Im pretty disappointed. If anyone can suggest how i can get more out of this scope it would be appreciated. looks like im going to have to spend more money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
team tractor Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 Pack the back mount ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Funker Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 Do these scopes come with their adjustment centralised from the start? By that I mean halfway through it's adjustment on windage and elevation, how do you know you didn't start with the elevation already 50 clicks towards it's maximum? In my head I'm making sense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hornet 6 Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 I would be looking at your rings before suspecting a fault with the scope, and I would be very surprised if it lacked enough adjustment when properly mounted to get an HMR out to 150 yards. Zeiss claim 110cm of square adjustment at 100 meters, so to run out you have the scope out of true to the bore, by quite a long way. Neil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikemad24 Posted June 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 Thanks for all the replys, going to get checked tonight by someone who knows a lot more about scopes than i do. i do suspect the mounts. il let post the findings a soon as i can Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mereside Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 As another posted either Burris rings or a 10 or 20 moa rail, atb Wayne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 It is likely to be a ring issue I'd swap them round before doing anything else, I've a Swarovski scope that is fine in optilocks but in 3 sets of leupold rings you haven't been able to zero it, yet my sako and hmr it's fine zero about middle of adjustment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe soapy Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 got a mambe lite, drove me to distraction till i swapped rings around, all good now though. before dissmantiling current setup, mark the rings and caps and keep a record of how fitted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikemad24 Posted June 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 going to order new scope rings tomorrow (Burris). the ones i have now are mounted on the rail so cant be moved. I know its the cheaper end of ziess scopes but cant help feeling a bit annoyed with how little adjustment they have. i think i would have been better of with a nikon monarch. It may sound crazy to some but i actually missed my hawke endurance today! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matone Posted June 3, 2013 Report Share Posted June 3, 2013 First thing to do is centralise the reticle and shoot it to see how far out of true its mounted.Unlikely to be a scope issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hornet 6 Posted June 3, 2013 Report Share Posted June 3, 2013 I know its the cheaper end of ziess scopes but cant help feeling a bit annoyed with how little adjustment they have. i think i would have been better of with a nikon monarch. It may sound crazy to some but i actually missed my hawke endurance today! The amount of adjustment is clearly stated on the Zeiss website, and a metre + of square adjustment is pretty good by any standards. But you need to sort the mounts out, not a lot of point in a decent scope if it isn't mounted in alignment with the barrel. Neil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cal 7888 Posted June 3, 2013 Report Share Posted June 3, 2013 what mounts are you running? if your using say hawke mounts then there your problem! each one will be miles different from the other! get some decent mounts! and id say that will be your problem! at 250 yards a 17hmr is 18.6 inches low (if i remember rightly) and your zeiss has 110cm of elevation! thats well over 18 inches! also if you have a mahooooosive gap between the objective lens and your barrel that could be a contributing factor! c Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikemad24 Posted June 3, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 3, 2013 im using one piece mounts. there is a small gap between scope and barrel. the distance between middle of the barrel and the middle of the scope is 1.75 inches. iv used a rifle clamp and checked with a spirit level for cant. im going to order burris mounts tomorrow. Thanks again for all the help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 4, 2013 Report Share Posted June 4, 2013 what mounts are you running? if your using say hawke mounts then there your problem! each one will be miles different from the other! get some decent mounts! and id say that will be your problem! at 250 yards a 17hmr is 18.6 inches low (if i remember rightly) and your zeiss has 110cm of elevation! thats well over 18 inches! also if you have a mahooooosive gap between the objective lens and your barrel that could be a contributing factor! c Oh Dear! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cal 7888 Posted June 4, 2013 Report Share Posted June 4, 2013 Oh Dear! explain... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 4, 2013 Report Share Posted June 4, 2013 what mounts are you running? if your using say hawke mounts then there your problem! each one will be miles different from the other! Oh yeah, everyone with Hawke mounts throw them away they don't work , I know a lot of people that will give you an argument about that wildly inaccurate generalised comment get some decent mounts! and id say that will be your problem! at 250 yards a 17hmr is 18.6 inches low You have no idea until you know his scope mount height, ammo type, barrel length, moderator and VERY specifically where he is currently zeroed, you like assuming a lot! (if i remember rightly) and your zeiss has 110cm of elevation! thats well over 18 inches! also if you have a mahooooosive gap between the objective lens and your barrel that could be a contributing factor! Just how big a gap do you think he will need for this to be anything but a TINY insignificant factor in this specific problem? c explain... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cal 7888 Posted June 4, 2013 Report Share Posted June 4, 2013 what i was getting at was you dont mount an expensive piece of glass with cheap tacky mounts! thats why all the high end manufacturers make "precision matched rings" when they cut both rings from the same block of metal and then cut them down the middle! hawke mounts are okay but are really meant for an airgun mounting a hawke or of the like scope! as for the bullet drop, yes generally a .17 hmr will drop arouns 18" at 250! barrel length will not make any difference whats so ever! my ruger m77/17 was 24" its now 17.5" and is alot more accurrate and i can still get out to 275 yards on a good still day! also all .17 hmr ammo is almost identicle, all the different makes are made in the same factory, using the same hornady heads! the only thing i can really understand about your ammo argument is if he was shooting say a 20gr xtp hollow point (which no one really does...) and yes that would make a difference! a moderator will not affect a bullets trajectory! everyone thinks it does but it doesnt! unless you are getting bullet clip in the mod it wont make any difference whats so ever! as for zero, lets be honest every zeros their rifles at 100, appart from the odd .22lr! and finally i like how you say "you have no idea until you know his scope mount height" and then a few lines down when ive mentioned scope height you reply saying "just how big a gap do you think he will need for this to be anything but a TINY insignificant factor in thsi specific problem" you have just contradicted yourself... lol oh dear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted June 4, 2013 Report Share Posted June 4, 2013 the fundamental on this is either the rings aren't quite in line with the bore or the scope is faulty, try different rings first then try the scope on a different rifle if you can and see how you go. I've been there with a swaro in 3 sets of leupold rings never got down to the reason behind it as it was fine in 2 different brands of different rings. Its annoying but I do wonder if some scopes are set up so you get more elevation adjustment from zero than others, as those 3 sets of leupold rings were also ok with a nikko sterling scope and a S&B 8x56 at times it makes you want to pull your hair out but it just happens from time to time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 4, 2013 Report Share Posted June 4, 2013 (edited) Deleted and PM sent to cal 7888. Edited June 4, 2013 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted June 4, 2013 Report Share Posted June 4, 2013 gawd almighty Dekers I'd missed most of those points I'm about to have to look away from this thread to prevent me banging my head on the desk too many times Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikemad24 Posted June 4, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2013 please, can this not turn into anothe pw row. it does make any thread intresting tho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodo123 Posted June 4, 2013 Report Share Posted June 4, 2013 Get rid of the scope, cardboard tube, a rubber band x in the middle and a magnifying glass stuck to the end. No need for scope rings just use no more nails oh you can also paint it cammo if you want Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikemad24 Posted June 4, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2013 Get rid of the scope, cardboard tube, a rubber band x in the middle and a magnifying glass stuck to the end. No need for scope rings just use no more nails oh you can also paint it cammo if you want Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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