Not so cuddly seals

[Sprackles]

Discussing Sammy with some friends on a fishing forum I frequent and the topic got around to Seals and the governments refusal to cull them despite record numbers (which means even more fish eaten)

A lot of lads are having real problems with them at the minute and are openly talking about shooting some...apparently the MMO has said in certain circumstances this can be allowed.
Just thought I would post you a picture of what these cute doe eyed creatures have done for one blokes work for the day.....

 

 

 

 

Edited September 26, 2013 by Sprackles

[Sprackles]

And this video from Marine Scotland......
There is another one that I cannot copy for some reason that shows a seal swimming into the codend..helping itself to a mouthful then back out again.

 

 

<iframe src="https://www.facebook.com/video/embed?video_id=477873962253845" width="1280" height="720" frameborder="0"></iframe>

Edited September 26, 2013 by Sprackles

[paul87]

Nightmare, not even much to salvage from a hard days work.

[Sprackles]

He said he managed 1 marketable fish for the day....

[Psyxologos]

Seals are in their natural environment doing what they are supposed to do. I do not see what the fuss is all about. Instead of threatening the marine biodiversity we will be better off improving our fishing technology and conduct...

[Sprackles]

Seals are in their natural environment doing what they are supposed to do. I do not see what the fuss is all about. Instead of threatening the marine biodiversity we will be better off improving our fishing technology and conduct...

And foxes are in theirs but they are managed for a reason...If fishing effort has to be massively curtailed which it has been, where is the sense in allowing an uncontrolled seal population explosion.

Fishermen are already teetering on the edge due to EU rules and the chap whose pic I posted has just lost his income for the day but will still have his expenses to pay...thats what all the fuss is about.

[sako751sg]

Seals are in their natural environment doing what they are supposed to do. I do not see what the fuss is all about. Instead of threatening the marine biodiversity we will be better off improving our fishing technology and conduct...

 

So,using that reasoning there is no need to cull rabbits,deer,foxes.....................?

[vulpicide]

There was a labrador savaged by a seal on the east coast I think Tam posted the link.

[Malik]

Seals are in their natural environment doing what they are supposed to do. I do not see what the fuss is all about. Instead of threatening the marine biodiversity we will be better off improving our fishing technology and conduct...

+1

[Sprackles]

+1

Lots of seals and fish where you are in Nottingham then....

[Malik]

Lots of seals and fish where you are in Nottingham then....

Loads. They all tend to be in broxtowe.

[jasper3]

I heard on the radio the other day a guy talking about , the sea, and countryside, it was a superb interview, he had a counter balance answer for every question

 

he basically kicked the anti's into touch along with the countryside folk

 

he said... this country has very little natural countryside now..its mainly farmed or in the case of woods controlled. even the mooorlands are farmed in a way.... this meaning, man has taken the natural habitat of such things as fox's badgers etc etc so they need controlling to keep a healthy number

and to all you anti's , most of you live in houses, these house's where built on land, that was taken from the animals habitat...

 

this also goes for the sea, we reach out further and further with bigger and better nets and computers , catching more and leaving less... so we are now in a bigger competition with the natural inhabitants ,

but being humans, we put our selves 1st ....

 

he did agree that certain things need to be culled , to keep a healthy stock, but he did say, we should think about our own greed too

 

personally i thought it was a great interview, with a real good honest outlook

[stumpy69]

There was a labrador savaged by a seal on the east coast I think Tam posted the link.

Yes it was north of Aberdeen at Newburgh. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-19882985

[Sprackles]

 

we reach out further and further with bigger and better nets and computers , catching more and leaving less

 

Actually with the decline of the deep water fleet we are not reaching out further.

Gear is now more selective than its ever been and fishing effort in terms of allowed catch is a fraction of what it used to be and I do mean a fraction.

Seals are also more abundant now then ever and eat the same fish we are trying to catch and to some extent, they are like foxes, will damage rather than take the full fish, just biting the bits they want. They are also creatures of the inshore waters so the deep water fishing is not affected by them. They are however the difference in some cases between a man earning a hard living and bankruptcy.

The likes of HFW have done the fishing industry a great disservice with his edited footage and misleading dialogue.

Take the discard issue, yes, discards are a crime and should be stopped and the EU is now in the throes of legislating against it but how many of you know that instead of dumping it at sea, it now is proposed that it has to be landed but not sold and is most likely to end in landfill.

Too many of you believe the green agenda and coming from a shooting background I am amazed at the support for such agendas but then, you are only being told one side....I am showing you the other.

 

[scimitar]

I wonder what seal tastes like, I seem to recall Keith Floyd cooked one a few years ago on tv.

[Psyxologos]

And foxes are in theirs but they are managed for a reason...If fishing effort has to be massively curtailed which it has been, where is the sense in allowing an uncontrolled seal population explosion.

Fishermen are already teetering on the edge due to EU rules and the chap whose pic I posted has just lost his income for the day but will still have his expenses to pay...thats what all the fuss is about.

 

I understand what you mean about people's livelihood being threatened by an alleged increase in some wild animals. This is why I said that we need to concentrate in improving our conduct and technology, meaning we need to find ways to be more efficient and productive than we have been. Traditionally humankind has concentrated on sustainability by just taking what they needed, up to the industrial revolution and the exponential increase in natural resources exploitation in the name of profit. If we are to continue existing on this planet we need to make sure we have a liveable habitat to exist within, and not treat everything around us as our property. It is not, it is our children's property which we borrowed for the duration of our existence. When it was suited to the human way of life, investment has been made to find ways to co exist (shark fences and other ways to keep sharks away from surfers and swimmers for example). Finding a solution to the seal problem (if there is such a thing) will require investment that nobody wants to make, unlike the investment on shark deterrents. You see, in the latter there are billions in tourist industry revenue, whilst in the former, like most human activity, quick profit and low cost for short term gain always come first...

 

So,using that reasoning there is no need to cull rabbits,deer,foxes.....................?

 

Interesting association. No, I do not believe foxes have to be controlled that way, but there are financial reasons that make shooting the cheapest and easiest way to control them. I personally do not shoot them when I see them, I do not see the reason to do so. If I was a farmer then I would have a different view. Unless I had the time and money to research alternative ways of dealing with them. But I believe this should be the job of the relevant departments in government and academia...

 

As for rabbits and deer, again I do see them as a valuable source of food that has to be treated with respect and done properly. I am not happy seeing piles of dead rabbits laying on fields, I would much rather see them eaten by people. It is a very cheap, nutritious and delicious meat that is misunderstood and undervalued in the UK but thankfully not so in continental Europe.

 

As for deer, I stalk myself, again as a means of adding a delicious and free range option to my diet. If I had the time I would probably shoot more and hopefully supply my friends and local butcher with excellent quality meat. I have seen people though shooting many beasts simply out of greed. I do not agree with that, but this is what they decide to do and it is their prerogative. I decide to take what I need, and leave the rest for another day.

Edited September 26, 2013 by Psyxologos

[Blackpowder]

Discussing Sammy with some friends on a fishing forum I frequent and the topic got around to Seals and the governments refusal to cull them despite record numbers (which means even more fish eaten)

A lot of lads are having real problems with them at the minute and are openly talking about shooting some...apparently the MMO has said in certain circumstances this can be allowed.

Just thought I would post you a picture of what these cute doe eyed creatures have done for one blokes work for the day.....

 

These fish look like high value bass into the bargain. During my 20 years at sea bottom gill nets were tried of the north northumberland coast- most were torn to shreds by seals within a few days. After the annual cull of surplus seals was banned mainly through the work of Greenpeace the Farne Islands population spread down and certainly up the north sea coast either side of the Border. Now there are some 2-3000 resident on Holy Island Sands while 2000 breed on the secluded beaches north of St Abbs Head. Certainly not an endangered speceies yet our local paper to day carries a feature on unexplained grey seal deaths. Could it be starvation now they have eaten a big whack of inshore resident species. As th OP has shown livelyhoods can be threatened by over populations of seals. I suggest those who dont want to see an effective cull start a fund to compensate fishermen who are being financiaslly threatened by seal numbers.

 

Blackpowder

[sako751sg]

 

I understand what you mean about people's livelihood being threatened by an alleged increase in some wild animals. This is why I said that we need to concentrate in improving our conduct and technology, meaning we need to find ways to be more efficient and productive than we have been. Traditionally humankind has concentrated on sustainability by just taking what they needed, up to the industrial revolution and the exponential increase in natural resources exploitation in the name of profit. If we are to continue existing on this planet we need to make sure we have a liveable habitat to exist within, and not treat everything around us as our property. It is not, it is our children's property which we borrowed for the duration of our existence. When it was suited to the human way of life, investment has been made to find ways to co exist (shark fences and other ways to keep sharks away from surfers and swimmers for example). Finding a solution to the seal problem (if there is such a thing) will require investment that nobody wants to make, unlike the investment on shark deterrents. You see, in the latter there are billions in tourist industry revenue, whilst in the former, like most human activity, quick profit and low cost for short term gain always come first...

 

Interesting association. No, I do not believe foxes have to be controlled that way, but there are financial reasons that make shooting the cheapest and easiest way to control them. I personally do not shoot them when I see them, I do not see the reason to do so. If I was a farmer then I would have a different view. Unless I had the time and money to research alternative ways of dealing with them. But I believe this should be the job of the relevant departments in government and academia...

 

As for rabbits and deer, again I do see them as a valuable source of food that has to be treated with respect and done properly. I am not happy seeing piles of dead rabbits laying on fields, I would much rather see them eaten by people. It is a very cheap, nutritious and delicious meat that is misunderstood and undervalued in the UK but thankfully not so in continental Europe.

 

As for deer, I stalk myself, again as a means of adding a delicious and free range option to my diet. If I had the time I would probably shoot more and hopefully supply my friends and local butcher with excellent quality meat. I have seen people though shooting many beasts simply out of greed. I do not agree with that, but this is what they decide to do and it is their prerogative. I decide to take what I need, and leave the rest for another day.

 

Interesting answer fella.

Why do you mention shooting as the way they have to be controlled when I never mentioned shooting?I said cull.

On your reasoning then we can cull seals without any problems as long as we eat them then?

Edited September 26, 2013 by sako751sg

[four-wheel-drive]

One could make the argument that if there are more seals then it must imply that there are more fish for them to eat you cannot have one without the other also fish was not put in the sea by god as food just for people they are there for the food chain that includes us but not only us.

[jasper3]

not strickly true Sparkles, i have lived near fishing ports for most of my life, here in exmouth we have small trawlers come in , brixham is just down the road, Beer is just up the road i am also a very keen sea angler,

I have seen the reefs off of Budleigh totally trashed with scallop dredging, the reef use to be full of fish, we even had a tope run...... now its a underwater wasteland , with very few fish.

 

you didn't read my post correctly, i didn't say they don't need controlling, i said we all have to answer for our own greed.... as you say..the deep water fish have declined...thats was caused by bigger better nets, boats and technology ..and no control over other countries,, we all went out further...

 

and yes, i have also heard fish discards are being sent to landfill..that is totally bonkers...but it comes down to greed..if they give them away...who will want the fish for sale.

 

its not a point of being green and hugging trees..its a point of realising the way we all live can't go on... the fish will be gone one day.. just today on our local news..Bass stocks are down 1/3rd

 

i have often heard on here...I went out last night and shot 130 rabbits... then , had another 78 last night...... then a few months down the line, we aint go no rabbits down our way... mixi wiped them out

 

OK !!! i know many will be asked to remove all the rabbits..but my point is , once their gone, their gone ..then the shooting, ferreting becomes rubbish..

 

once all the fish have gone, the trawlermen will have no work at all, and the seals will die down in numbers ,

[Sprackles]

One could make the argument that if there are more seals then it must imply that there are more fish for them to eat you cannot have one without the other also fish was not put in the sea by god as food just for people they are there for the food chain that includes us but not only us.

 

The reason there are more seals is quite simply that the culling has been stopped.

It was not too many years ago when seals were hunted and utilised in this country,there will still be people alive who were involved in it.

The culling has stopped because they are cute looking, same as foxes, that's why people object to it....after all, you don't hear too many people complaining about the horrific death Rats suffer when we poison them do you.

[Sprackles]

not strickly true Sparkles, i have lived near fishing ports for most of my life, here in exmouth we have small trawlers come in , brixham is just down the road, Beer is just up the road i am also a very keen sea angler,

I have seen the reefs off of Budleigh totally trashed with scallop dredging, the reef use to be full of fish, we even had a tope run...... now its a underwater wasteland , with very few fish.

 

you didn't read my post correctly, i didn't say they don't need controlling, i said we all have to answer for our own greed.... as you say..the deep water fish have declined...thats was caused by bigger better nets, boats and technology ..and no control over other countries,, we all went out further...

 

and yes, i have also heard fish discards are being sent to landfill..that is totally bonkers...but it comes down to greed..if they give them away...who will want the fish for sale.

 

its not a point of being green and hugging trees..its a point of realising the way we all live can't go on... the fish will be gone one day.. just today on our local news..Bass stocks are down 1/3rd

 

i have often heard on here...I went out last night and shot 130 rabbits... then , had another 78 last night...... then a few months down the line, we aint go no rabbits down our way... mixi wiped them out

 

OK !!! i know many will be asked to remove all the rabbits..but my point is , once their gone, their gone ..then the shooting, ferreting becomes rubbish..

 

once all the fish have gone, the trawlermen will have no work at all, and the seals will die down in numbers ,

 

Cross posted mate.

 

Heres a link for you to go and have a look at some statistics if you can be bothered, ...theres a lot to trawl through.

 

http://www.marinemanagement.org.uk/fisheries/statistics/annual.htm

 

Its the total fishing effort across the EU including catch statistics by species etc......it will show you where your Bass have gone for instance.

[Sprackles]

Oh and just as a bit of a thread drift.....take a look at this pic of a Bluefin Tuna....one of 2 caught today, other was released.

Caught...................wait for it...................................off Scotland.

 

Stocks can't be as bad as the Greenies make out if these are moving in. Like to sea the Seals try and eat this one...

Edited September 26, 2013 by Sprackles

[four-wheel-drive]

not strickly true Sparkles, i have lived near fishing ports for most of my life, here in exmouth we have small trawlers come in , brixham is just down the road, Beer is just up the road i am also a very keen sea angler,

I have seen the reefs off of Budleigh totally trashed with scallop dredging, the reef use to be full of fish, we even had a tope run...... now its a underwater wasteland , with very few fish.

 

you didn't read my post correctly, i didn't say they don't need controlling, i said we all have to answer for our own greed.... as you say..the deep water fish have declined...thats was caused by bigger better nets, boats and technology ..and no control over other countries,, we all went out further...

 

and yes, i have also heard fish discards are being sent to landfill..that is totally bonkers...but it comes down to greed..if they give them away...who will want the fish for sale.

 

its not a point of being green and hugging trees..its a point of realising the way we all live can't go on... the fish will be gone one day.. just today on our local news..Bass stocks are down 1/3rd

 

i have often heard on here...I went out last night and shot 130 rabbits... then , had another 78 last night...... then a few months down the line, we aint go no rabbits down our way... mixi wiped them out

 

OK !!! i know many will be asked to remove all the rabbits..but my point is , once their gone, their gone ..then the shooting, ferreting becomes rubbish..

 

once all the fish have gone, the trawlermen will have no work at all, and the seals will die down in numbers ,

You are spot on there the problem is all down to inappropriate over fishing years ago we had lots of little fishing boats each one making a good living for all of the people who worked on them but then people got greedy and made bigger boats larger nets sonar to find the sholes and they scooped up everything and now all we here is them winning that there are no fish so they want to blame the seals the wales everything but themselves.

[karpman]

Oh and just as a bit of a thread drift.....take a look at this pic of a Bluefin Tuna....one of 2 caught today, other was released.

Caught...................wait for it...................................off Scotland.

 

Stocks can't be as bad as the Greenies make out if these are moving in. Like to sea the Seals try and eat this one...

If seals are causing a particular problem in particular areas I can't see a problem really. My routes should of been well rooted in fishing as my grandad was a skipper of a trawler out of Lowestoft. But my father ended up in the midlands training to be an engineer at 15.

 

Karpman

 

Edit: meant to say were tuna not that infrequent on our shores some time ago before herring stocks took some hammer? This ain't a global warming thing is it?

 

More to do with rise in food stuffs for the tuna.

Edited September 26, 2013 by karpman