overandunder2012 Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 but of course it fails to take into account that its only the ones who actually pay tax who contribute rather than overall loss and the black economy via the low skilled immigrant workers who thrive in it, and who send their spoils straight out of the country with no contribution to our society, lots of brits abroad send their cash straight out of the county Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Catweazle - you are missing the point - accidentally or on purpose. The Financial Times hasn't got a clue about the black economy - full stop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
100milesaway Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Catweazel you are very fortunate to live in an area virtually unaffected by immigration. I don't even recognise my nearest town to where i was brought up and white people are in a minority with many no go areas. I am greatly saddened by what I see. from Auntie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overandunder2012 Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 (edited) Catweazle - you are missing the point - accidentally or on purpose. The Financial Times hasn't got a clue about the black economy - full stop. nobody has its a secret anyone want to buy some fags? Edited January 2, 2014 by overandunder2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catweazle Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Catweazle - you are missing the point - accidentally or on purpose. The Financial Times hasn't got a clue about the black economy - full stop. I'm sure they would value your input But seriously, the FT provides information that the movers and shakers use, and if the black economy is a significant part of it then they'll be considering it. They're not mugs. Catweazel you are very fortunate to live in an area virtually unaffected by immigration. I don't even recognise my nearest town to where i was brought up and white people are in a minority with many no go areas. I am greatly saddened by what I see. from Auntie. I recently moved from Kent, and spent my whole working life in London. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Catweazle - in terms of the black economy and immigration - mugs is exactly what they are. I don't need your sneering comments about my input. I'm sure it would not be on their agenda. You can turn a blind eye to what the effects on the country are. You will be in good company with the other "movers and shakers". I love that phrase - assuming it means pretentious people who believe they are a cut above the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
100milesaway Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 I'm sure they would value your input But seriously, the FT provides information that the movers and shakers use, and if the black economy is a significant part of it then they'll be considering it. They're not mugs. I recently moved from Kent, and spent my whole working life in London. You, like me, are very fortunate to be able to move away from it. Many people can't. from Auntie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pegasus bridge Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Regardless of an article in the FT, I challenge anyone to visit an area or region that has seen large influx of migrants and honestly say they still believe the net benefit BS. It's a case of the emperors clothes . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old rooster Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 we are heading for trouble by ignoring our unemployed as the younger ones cannot get work and rely on benefits the ni contributions get less the tax collected gets less these young unemployed become older unemployed and more youngsters leave school and cannot get jobs because the older people are made to work longer to get their pensions.Most of the previous job providers in the eighties and nineties which provided apprenticeships have long gone and the jobs are not there anymore factories replaced by housing paid for how? a jobs time bomb is ticking lowering the retirement age to free up jobs? one retiree one new trainee no welfare. your comments please We will never see a return to the days when young people got the chance to learn a trade through an apprenticeship, legislation to make it a massive burden on any employer to take them on plus the destruction of our manufacturing industries has seen to that. I'm not sure why some see all employers as tyrants and blatant profiteers; they have usually sunk a fair amount of their own cash into the business, have in many cases taken out loans as well and have to make a profit at the end of the day otherwise why take the risk in the first place? Employers cause employment and without them we are well and truly stuffed! As previously stated, we have to produce goods to sell in competition with the rest of the world, a fair part of which operates under horrendous employment conditions. People have in some cases enjoyed lifestyles beyond their means, encouraged by the Bliar administration over far too long a stint at the helm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catweazle Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Catweazle - in terms of the black economy and immigration - mugs is exactly what they are. I don't need your sneering comments about my input. I'm sure it would not be on their agenda. You can turn a blind eye to what the effects on the country are. You will be in good company with the other "movers and shakers". I love that phrase - assuming it means pretentious people who believe they are a cut above the rest. Firstly, there is no sneering comment, I thought the "winking" smiley would have made that clear. Secondly, "movers and shakers" denotes the people who actually do things, people who actually run corporations, make decisions, and do so based on the best information available. They are a cut above the rest in terms of gathering and using information. You accuse me of being someone who believes himself to be a "cut above" whilst you dare to claim that you are better informed than the FT, No comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjh Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Regardless of an article in the FT, I challenge anyone to visit an area or region that has seen large influx of migrants and honestly say they still believe the net benefit BS. It's a case of the emperors clothes . Australia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Catweazle - just what is this "dare to claim" garbage? Grow up. I am better informed than the Financial Times, if they think immigration is beneficial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catweazle Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 As previously stated, we have to produce goods to sell in competition with the rest of the world, a fair part of which operates under horrendous employment conditions. People have in some cases enjoyed lifestyles beyond their means, encouraged by the Bliar administration over far too long a stint at the helm. I don't see how we will ever be able to compete with the third world in the cheap labour market, our only chance is to focus on the hi-tech end, but even there we have a steep hill to climb. Our economy is currently fuelled by Brits spending their savings, the balance of trade deficit is at it's worst state for 24 years: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/britains-deficit-soars-to-its-highest-for-24-years-9018001.html Scary times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overandunder2012 Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 I am better informed than the Financial Times, if they think immigration is beneficial. classic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old rooster Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Australia Good luck with trying to convince the aborigines on that one mate! Things ain't looking too good for them right now and they represent perhaps one of the longest standing, largely unchanged, indigenous races on the planet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catweazle Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Catweazle - just what is this "dare to claim" garbage? Grow up. I am better informed than the Financial Times, if they think immigration is beneficial. I don't know whether they think immigration is beneficial, they merely reported the findings of two independent studies. You seem to think the surveys are innacurate, but I see no evidence from you to support your view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overandunder2012 Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 im dying to see this to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pegasus bridge Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 (edited) Australia 😂 ok yes, I'm talking about the uk, which unlike Australia allowed people to migrate in, bringing **** all, paying nothing in , and taking Advantage of free healthcare , benefits and schooling . Edit - I know three people who migrated to Australia , all worked hard, had trades / skills that enabled them to do it. They have all fully settled, none are sending money back here, none are expecting the Australian people to pander and adjust to them ( infact it's the opposite). Edited January 2, 2014 by pegasus bridge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psyxologos Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 This made me chuckle today... A banker, a Daily Mail reader and a Romanian immigrant sit down with a packet of 12 biscuits. The banker takes 11, turns to the Daily Mail reader and says: 'Watch out, that Romanian wants your biscuit!' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old rooster Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 I don't see how we will ever be able to compete with the third world in the cheap labour market, our only chance is to focus on the hi-tech end, but even there we have a steep hill to climb. Our economy is currently fuelled by Brits spending their savings, the balance of trade deficit is at it's worst state for 24 years: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/britains-deficit-soars-to-its-highest-for-24-years-9018001.html Scary times. Scary times indeed, we used to be the most innovative race on earth but too many of the brainy folks were lost to other countries in the brain drain, due to lack of investment in this country. We still have the ability I'm sure but trying to get anywhere with the tangled web of garbled legislation we now have to work under puts some people off. I've personally never wanted to expand my own business to include taking on personnel and have subcontracted out hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of work over the past few years rather than do it in house. I can say that all that work went to other UK companies but nowadays people in manufacturing of end products buy a lot of parts from third world countries because of costs. Those countries don't have the employment and health and safety legislation we are burdened with to cost into the equation or minimum wages to consider. No easy answer and it isn't true that uncontrolled immigration is the only problem, it is, as has been shown, a very serious problem in it sown right though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Catweazle - write to your favourite publication and ask them about the good work that some immigrants have done. Perhaps they could confirm my own experience. The prison population has been massively enhanced by immigration - keeping up full employment for prison staff. Similarly, hospitals should be grateful for the increased trade. Perhaps pharmacists - for all the extra medicine. The local car wash - manned mainly by Iranians in my locale - who obviously pay taxes etc. One nearby crashed an expensive motor at the car wash - employee ran off - owner claimed he didn't know him. Begging has become a growth industry. Traffic light windscreen cleaners - none of them demand money - they just smile and do it for free. Many Police Forces have experienced workload increases - ask in Staffordshire if immigration has reduced policing. Interpreters - for Police Stations and Courts. Schools where English is not the first language of the majority of the class. Immigration Tribunals - brought in shedloads of work for briefs. I could go on, but rather than tax my brain, I will buy the Financial Times and join the movers and shakers with their head in the sand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjh Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Catweazle - just what is this "dare to claim" garbage? Grow up. I am better informed than the Financial Times, if they think immigration is beneficial. its all true the FT is staffed with a load of second rate journalists and economists from the likes of Harvard, LBS, Stanford, ***, direct links to the City and financial institutions world wide, do me a favour they don't know ****, if i had a couple of million to invest i would be straight into the Bolton Evening News ok yes, I'm talking about the uk, which unlike Australia allowed people to migrate in, bringing **** all, paying nothing in , and taking Advantage of free healthcare , benefits and schooling . Edit - I know three people who migrated to Australia , all worked hard, had trades / skills that enabled them to do it. They have all fully settled, none are sending money back here, none are expecting the Australian people to pander and adjust to them ( infact it's the opposite). Knightsbridge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old rooster Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 I don't know whether they think immigration is beneficial, they merely reported the findings of two independent studies. You seem to think the surveys are innacurate, but I see no evidence from you to support your view. ok yes, I'm talking about the uk, which unlike Australia allowed people to migrate in, bringing **** all, paying nothing in , and taking Advantage of free healthcare , benefits and schooling . Edit - I know three people who migrated to Australia , all worked hard, had trades / skills that enabled them to do it. They have all fully settled, none are sending money back here, none are expecting the Australian people to pander and adjust to them ( infact it's the opposite). Slightly different situation perhaps when you consider that prior to us and other European countries using Australia as a penal colony the aborigines were thy only human inhabitants to speak of. Australia as far as the European lifestyle settled immigrants are concerned is a very young country and as such more able to adapt, added to that is the vastness of the country and relatively low population density compared to ours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overandunder2012 Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Catweazle - write to your favourite publication and ask them about the good work that some immigrants have done. Perhaps they could confirm my own experience. The prison population has been massively enhanced by immigration - keeping up full employment for prison staff. Similarly, hospitals should be grateful for the increased trade. Perhaps pharmacists - for all the extra medicine. The local car wash - manned mainly by Iranians in my locale - who obviously pay taxes etc. One nearby crashed an expensive motor at the car wash - employee ran off - owner claimed he didn't know him. Begging has become a growth industry. Traffic light windscreen cleaners - none of them demand money - they just smile and do it for free. Many Police Forces have experienced workload increases - ask in Staffordshire if immigration has reduced policing. Interpreters - for Police Stations and Courts. Schools where English is not the first language of the majority of the class. Immigration Tribunals - brought in shedloads of work for briefs. I could go on, but rather than tax my brain, I will buy the Financial Times and join the movers and shakers with their head in the sand. do we have stats for this lot a nice pie chart or something like you get in the ft maybe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FalconFN Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Catweazle - write to your favourite publication and ask them about the good work that some immigrants have done. Perhaps they could confirm my own experience. The prison population has been massively enhanced by immigration - keeping up full employment for prison staff. Similarly, hospitals should be grateful for the increased trade. Perhaps pharmacists - for all the extra medicine. The local car wash - manned mainly by Iranians in my locale - who obviously pay taxes etc. One nearby crashed an expensive motor at the car wash - employee ran off - owner claimed he didn't know him. Begging has become a growth industry. Traffic light windscreen cleaners - none of them demand money - they just smile and do it for free. Many Police Forces have experienced workload increases - ask in Staffordshire if immigration has reduced policing. Interpreters - for Police Stations and Courts. Schools where English is not the first language of the majority of the class. Immigration Tribunals - brought in shedloads of work for briefs. I could go on, but rather than tax my brain, I will buy the Financial Times and join the movers and shakers with their head in the sand. Again and again you are focusing on just one type of immigrant, why not look at the high net worth immigrants and the doctors, lawyers, scientists, engineers, business leaders? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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