canada geese nuisance

[kent]

For pities sake don't mix .22 lr at night and water when there are caravans occupied all over the place!!!! They can be shot or they can be scared or netted, though my reckoning is the caravaners if polled might like to have them around- alienate them at your own risk.

 

If they get killed, fine as long as its safe and legal but try and look for reasons not to kill them as the benefit to the sight could possibly higher than the risk of ill will (or stray rounds skimming off the water )

[CharlieT]

I would have though shooting them under the lamp would be illegal as far as I am aware only feral pigeon can be shot in such a way.

You are indeed correct.

[figgy]

Why not lure them away from the caravan site with food.

 

Keep letting your dog get among them,they will eventually leave by being harassed.

 

Give the older kids on site some bangers or fire crackers.

 

 

Figgy

Edited July 16, 2014 by figgy

[Davyo]

If the caravans are occupied then your options are limited as I doubt the guests will be too chuffed if someone turns up with a gun.

Have you asked the management why they are reluctant to address the problem? They'll address it if revenue is lost due to people getting fed up of trailing through goose ****, but on the limited knowledge of the situation I would suggest they've left it too late, unless of course the geese turned up after the 'vans were occupied.

Discreet lamping with a moderated .22rf after dark? If the geese are on the lake they would need to be retrieved after being shot. Dead geese floating around wont go down well with holiday makers and their children, no matter how fed up they are of stepping in ****.

Best option in my opinion would be to let the management sort it; it's their problem.

I hope your not advising to fire a rimmy over water,but thats low it reads?

[Kes]

Why not lure them away from the caravan site with food.

 

Keep letting your dog get among them,they will eventually leave by being harassed.

 

Give the older kids on site some bangers or fire crackers.

 

 

Figgy

This is the best way forward IMHO. I would also explore the possible use of an untrasonic device. I suspect the hearing of wildfowl is a s different as that of dogs and UHF sound may deter them - worth a try before shooting. Also have you tried Kites as in those which use the wind ? shaped like a bird of prey and big enough, that might help to achieve what Finny is suggesting.

[Scully]

I hope your not advising to fire a rimmy over water,but thats low it reads?

Good grief. In the past, as part of pest control, we have fired rim fires, centre fires and shotguns over water. You have to give people credit for making their own decisions, and to suggest that caravans are used as backstops (as was implied in a previous post) is ludicrous. I don't give a monkies chuff what others regard as the 'done thing', if the shot is deemed to be safe by me, to the extent that no one can be hurt, then that's all I need to consider. If you re-read my post, there is a question mark at the end of it as I wasn't sure of the legalities, but if it isn't legal to lamp, then do it in daylight.

The shooter views the target, as we all do; considers the backstop and whether it is adequate. If not the shooter moves to a better place, and then gets so close that the possibility of a miss is greatly reduced, and takes the shot. If it's not deemed to be safe, you don't take the shot. Simple.

To give you more food for thought, we also shoot branchers with rimfires, as do many others around here. Richard Brigham wrote an article about it in Sporting Gun as he does also, no doubt you'll be writing to him?

[Kes]

We are all prone to give advice where none is asked for or needed. If we dont assume an experienced shooter knows what he is doing in his area and on his land then perhaps the police have an excuse for their own rules whenever they think it appropriate ?

You cant complain about postcode variations and also assume no-one but you knows about safety ----- possibly.

Edited July 16, 2014 by Kes

[Dekers]

Good grief. In the past, as part of pest control, we have fired rim fires, centre fires and shotguns over water. You have to give people credit for making their own decisions, and to suggest that caravans are used as backstops (as was implied in a previous post) is ludicrous. I don't give a monkies chuff what others regard as the 'done thing', if the shot is deemed to be safe by me, to the extent that no one can be hurt, then that's all I need to consider. If you re-read my post, there is a question mark at the end of it as I wasn't sure of the legalities, but if it isn't legal to lamp, then do it in daylight.

The shooter views the target, as we all do; considers the backstop and whether it is adequate. If not the shooter moves to a better place, and then gets so close that the possibility of a miss is greatly reduced, and takes the shot. If it's not deemed to be safe, you don't take the shot. Simple.

To give you more food for thought, we also shoot branchers with rimfires, as do many others around here. Richard Brigham wrote an article about it in Sporting Gun as he does also, no doubt you'll be writing to him?

 

 

Totally agree, the shot is down to the individual specific situation, the presence of water, caravans, nursery school, shopping centre, old people home, centre for the blind, etc etc is no automatic bar to shooting any firearm!

 

Hell, I shoot in pocket handkerchief back gardens all the time which many would simply slag off as dangerous without seeing the situation, and just as likely be saying at the same time, a rimfire has no place on foxes and I should be using a centrefire!

Edited July 16, 2014 by Dekers

[kent]

There are very few circumstances indeed were shooting a rifle towards and into water could be deemed safe, I have a friend who shoots beaver like this but his nearest neighbour is a long drive away and there are no livestock as such the only living things at any risk is the beaver and him. As the suggestion was made to do it under the cover of darkness when the caravan owners are all tucked away and wont see you at it sort of makes me wince. The thing with water and liquids is the angles of the ricochet are even more unpredictable than usual, as such you can give it no allowance for a safe zone. You can even see (do not shoot at water) specifically printed on many ammo boxes, its not there without good reason.

Every accident impacts every shooters right to hold and use firearms and safety is everyone's business, if you think you can assess such an action as ok on an occupied caravan park then it might be time to think on

[Dekers]

There are very few circumstances indeed were shooting a rifle towards and into water could be deemed safe, I have a friend who shoots beaver like this but his nearest neighbour is a long drive away and there are no livestock as such the only living things at any risk is the beaver and him. As the suggestion was made to do it under the cover of darkness when the caravan owners are all tucked away and wont see you at it sort of makes me wince. The thing with water and liquids is the angles of the ricochet are even more unpredictable than usual, as such you can give it no allowance for a safe zone. You can even see (do not shoot at water) specifically printed on many ammo boxes, its not there without good reason.

Every accident impacts every shooters right to hold and use firearms and safety is everyone's business, if you think you can assess such an action as ok on an occupied caravan park then it might be time to think on

 

 

So it isn't entirely unsafe, as many have said, blanket statement such as yours are meaningless, tell me what is ever a 100% safe shot!

 

Each shot is a calculated risk, if the risk is considered low enough we take it, if it isn't we don't, which part of that says never shoot on water?

 

When we are issued with a FAC we are deemed capable of making that decision, so It might also be time for you to stop second guessing everyone else's situation!

Edited July 16, 2014 by Dekers

[kent]

Correction FACs are regularly handed out to those who can prove good reason and secure storage. There is no set safety std and most FEOs wouldn't know a safe shot from an unsafe one let alone be able to ***** a candidates ability in that regards at least two of my FEOs over the years have admitted never even having shot.

 

You wouldn't be welcome to shoot around my home, family and animals if you carry the view stated. Yes people die falling when putting their underpants on (nothing is risk free) but only a fool does it at the top of a flight of stairs and that in my opinion equates quite well to shooting a rifle at water on an occupied caravan park.

[Dekers]

Correction FACs are regularly handed out to those who can prove good reason and secure storage. There is no set safety std and most FEOs wouldn't know a safe shot from an unsafe one let alone be able to ***** a candidates ability in that regards at least two of my FEOs over the years have admitted never even having shot.

 

You wouldn't be welcome to shoot around my home, family and animals if you carry the view stated. Yes people die falling when putting their underpants on (nothing is risk free) but only a fool does it at the top of a flight of stairs and that in my opinion equates quite well to shooting a rifle at water on an occupied caravan park.

 

You still can't see can you, the view stated is that every shot is risk assessed and then appropriate action taken!

 

That doesn't automatically rule out anything, even you said you have a mate that shoots on water SAFELY!

 

..and you keep saying shooting AT water, who said anything about that, the shot was potentially at a Canada on water!

 

.....and so what there are caravans on site, where are they?

 

Give your assumptions and tunnel vision a rest!

Edited July 16, 2014 by Dekers

[Davyo]

Leave the geese alone its only a bit od ****, if they start breaking into caravans then fair do,lol

[kent]

 

You still can't see can you, the view stated is that every shot is risk assessed and then appropriate action taken!

 

That doesn't automatically rule out anything, even you said you have a mate that shoots on water SAFELY!

 

..and you keep saying shooting AT water, who said anything about that, the shot was potentially at a Canada on water!

 

.....and so what there are caravans on site, where are they?

 

Give your assumptions and tunnel vision a rest!

 

On a site of caravaners means uncontrolled persons, Quarry is never backstop and it certainly aint backdrop as we all have freak occurrences like a mount or moderator coming loose . I was a river keeper quite a while many times I have been tempted and although I have finished a cripple on the water many times fowling never with a dog in the water or another person within any sort of range firing rifles at quarry on water (happy) is not clever on a caravan park at night you cannot guess were a ricochet off water can go or were a caravaner might be - its freaky how water can effect a round and it can draw little energy from the round (look at skimming a stone further than one might throw it)

[Scully]

Like I said, it's up to the individual to assess the situation and decide what is the best option, and the person who is responsible for the shot is best placed to decide what that option will be. You have claimed you have a mate who shoots over water and you yourself have just admitted shooting 'into' water, no doubt you were in the best position to know what was safe.

It has now been established that lamping geese is illegal so it's a moot point.

I don't care who is lamping what at night or whether it's over water or not, it is the responsibility of that person to ensure as far as is practically possible that what they are doing places no one in danger. If you're unsure of your backstop when lamping, or at any other time, shooting over any terrain, then don't take the shot. It really is that simple.

[Dekers]

So, we only have freak occurrences on water hey, and only uncontrolled persons on "caravan parks" at night?!

 

Who the **** is talking about dogs or people in the water and using caravans as backstops. Your tunnel vision, assumption and lack of comprehension seem to be shining once again!

 

 

You still can't see can you, the view stated is that every shot is risk assessed and then appropriate action taken!

 

Edited July 16, 2014 by Dekers

[cjm]

Dekers dont waste your time hes an idiot

[Kes]

Dekers dont waste your time hes an idiot

There is one person at least who thinks we could all learn something from Kent.

[kent]

Like I said, it's up to the individual to assess the situation and decide what is the best option, and the person who is responsible for the shot is best placed to decide what that option will be. You have claimed you have a mate who shoots over water and you yourself have just admitted shooting 'into' water, no doubt you were in the best position to know what was safe.

It has now been established that lamping geese is illegal so it's a moot point.

I don't care who is lamping what at night or whether it's over water or not, it is the responsibility of that person to ensure as far as is practically possible that what they are doing places no one in danger. If you're unsure of your backstop when lamping, or at any other time, shooting over any terrain, then don't take the shot. It really is that simple.

not with a rifle

[Scully]

not with a rifle

Yes, it is. It couldn't be simpler. Only you can make the decision, no one else. It really couldn't be any simpler than that.

[Kes]

not with a rifle

Kent, you must realise this is simply not true - why are there such things as open certificates?

[kent]

Open certs are given to first time applicants without experience in some areas, in others you can get one by pester power. There are over 1000 views on this thread and 45 posts (I hope some of them are FEOs judging from comments made) 1. you cannot predict ricochet angles at the best of times BUT water is the most freaky 2. rifles such as .22lr have a potential ricochet range off water that is downright terrifying, shotgun is 300 yds at best off a ricochet I doubt it will make half that once it has contacted water but it can non the less form some surprising angles. 3. Quarry as backstops is plain mental 4. Don't shoot were people have uncontrolled and regular access at all hours unless you 200% know your safe, shooting on water is not safe and shooting at night is certainly increasing the risk (and also illegal)

My post here is for those viewing not those posting BTW

[Scully]

Come on Kent, get a grip. Do you not realise just how pompous this post is? You have a mate who shoots over water and you yourself have admitted shooting into water, and are now even giving figures as to how far shot will travel after hitting water, but here you are criticising others and telling folk not to do it! 'Shooting on water is not safe'; your words, yet you admit to having done it! Your hypocrisy would be hilarious if it weren't unbelievable. I'll tell you what Kent; you get on with doing things the way you do it and stop telling folk what they should and shouldn't be doing, and I'll get on with doing things the way I do it.

[kent]

I don't get you at all, Lapland forest miles from anywhere or anyone don't compare to a caravan park or nearly all the UK landmass. Shotgun with total clear carriage range of 300 yards used again away from caravan parks and other people and a .22 lr with potential for 1 k . I think many of us have been hit by largely spent shotgun pellets how many have been hit by a .22 bullet this side of 800 yds +

 

No hypocrisy at all, I cant think of any water body here were such actions as firing .22 lr into it are ok (there might be one but there wont be no caravans or public access)

[Scully]

You don't need to 'get me', you just need to stop being so damned pompous.

If you read my initial post I asked a question, I didn't make a suggestion. Do you, in all honesty, reckon the OP will go out and line up his crosshairs on a goose with a family having dinner outside their 6 berth caravan as a backstop? Really? As it turns out lamping geese is illegal (every days a school day) but shooting them on water isn't. Maybe it should be, but it isn't. I'm not condoning it, but I'm not condemning it either, unlike you, who has done it but is now condemning it. That's where the hypocrisy comes in.

The person on the ground is in the best position to make the call, and it is their responsibility, not mine and not yours. Like I said, you do it your way, and we'll do it ours.