First Attempt

[Cyrus1988]

Hi why is there an indentation on one of the crimp folds ? Have you got some shot or other debris up inside the tooling stopping the full travel ?

 

I've noticed that on almost all of the cartridges I've loaded but I just thought it was normal. I'll have a look and see if there's anything up there that shouldn't be.

 

Cheers.

[turbo33]

Hi why is there an indentation on one of the crimp folds ? Have you got some shot or other debris up inside the tooling stopping the full travel ?

 

Very good point Paladin

[Floating Chamber]

He needs to take off the press body,* empty the reservoirs and look up the crimper. A thin 'pick' should be used to pop out the offending pellet.

 

* pull apart the two handles to release the press body from the spigots.

[Paladin]

On commercial loading machines this is a common fault with shot shaking and becoming lodged in the various tooling. Get a piece in the spinner and you end up with a flat turnover.

It's worth a look because the Lee can be capable of good reloads.

[Cyrus1988]

On commercial loading machines this is a common fault with shot shaking and becoming lodged in the various tooling. Get a piece in the spinner and you end up with a flat turnover.

It's worth a look because the Lee can be capable of good reloads.

 

Thanks very much for pointing this out, I would of never known. You can see the offending piece of shot near the top of the picture.

 

 

I loaded a round using one of my black used cases afterwards to see if it would make a difference and it definitely has.

 

 

Thanks for the heads up, it's made a big difference.

[Paladin]

Glad you found it, it just looked as if you hadn't got enough travel to form a decent crimp.

[Uncle Albert]

I've been following this thread as, like you, I am new to reloading. I have to hand it to the guys on here, there is a wealth of experience and it is freely given. Like you, I had trouble at the start but it is going well now. The question I have is simply why are you using new cartridge cases and not used ones. Most clay grounds are general more than willing to let you help yourself to the empties.

 

I started off reloading the cartridges I shot clays with but found that the case is quite soft and would only take one reloading before I threw it away. I'm now using Fiocchi hulls which seem to be much thicker plastic and reload well. That is 28 grm and 32 grm loads. I use my Load-All for all stages but do check charge weights and load weights as I go. The powder I'm using drops well and is quite consistent so I only need to check 1 in 5 charges. The loads are less consistent and needs up to 4 or 5 shot extra. The crimps come out well.

 

You seem to be getting through quite a lot of new cases so I would try using used hulls but be selective. Try to stick to one brand if you can. I take a sack to the clay ground with me and fill up when I go. I now have the damn things coming out me ears and my man cave is overflowing. When you get them home sort them and discard any you are unsure about. If the bins or hulls are wet then leave it till another time as water may have got into the hull.

 

The Load-All is a good machine and is simple to use. It does produce good cartridges given the right recipe without the need for a spinner. I see you got your spinner from John at F.E.S. Kent. You won't go far wrong getting your supplies from F.E.S. Kent. I, like you, was put onto him by Cookoff who helped me get started and he is a wealth of information, cheap too. I got a good deal from him when I went down there.

 

Stick with it as it does get easier as you learn.

 

Dave.

[Cyrus1988]

I've been following this thread as, like you, I am new to reloading. I have to hand it to the guys on here, there is a wealth of experience and it is freely given. Like you, I had trouble at the start but it is going well now. The question I have is simply why are you using new cartridge cases and not used ones. Most clay grounds are general more than willing to let you help yourself to the empties.

 

I started off reloading the cartridges I shot clays with but found that the case is quite soft and would only take one reloading before I threw it away. I'm now using Fiocchi hulls which seem to be much thicker plastic and reload well. That is 28 grm and 32 grm loads. I use my Load-All for all stages but do check charge weights and load weights as I go. The powder I'm using drops well and is quite consistent so I only need to check 1 in 5 charges. The loads are less consistent and needs up to 4 or 5 shot extra. The crimps come out well.

 

You seem to be getting through quite a lot of new cases so I would try using used hulls but be selective. Try to stick to one brand if you can. I take a sack to the clay ground with me and fill up when I go. I now have the damn things coming out me ears and my man cave is overflowing. When you get them home sort them and discard any you are unsure about. If the bins or hulls are wet then leave it till another time as water may have got into the hull.

 

The Load-All is a good machine and is simple to use. It does produce good cartridges given the right recipe without the need for a spinner. I see you got your spinner from John at F.E.S. Kent. You won't go far wrong getting your supplies from F.E.S. Kent. I, like you, was put onto him by Cookoff who helped me get started and he is a wealth of information, cheap too. I got a good deal from him when I went down there.

 

Stick with it as it does get easier as you learn.

 

Dave.

 

 

Hi Dave, yes the guys on here are unbelievably helpful, I've had so much support from so many people and I just can't thank them enough. I would be miles away from the stage I'm at now was it not for these guys.

 

In regards to the new cases; I do have some used ones that I will be loading now, but I don't get out that often to really use a great deal up. I stupidly thought that using brand new cases would be easier and the crimp would look better at the end, how wrong was I. I now have 400 of the stupid things which I'll just have to get through I suppose. I think I might head along to the local clay ground tomorrow and see if I can pick used cases up as well.

 

F.E.S. is amazing too, I spoke to John for about half an hour and the amount of information he gave was crazy, I should of had a pen a paper ready. I only wish it was closer, I'm really struggling to find a supplier of Vectan AS locally. The closest place I've found which is just over an hour a way wants to charge £36 for 500g, that's almost double compared to the likes of F.E.S./Clay & Game.

 

I'm going to have a go at loading some more today so will get some pics up later of the finished results.

 

Cheers.

[Guest cookoff013]

The best way to thank us is simple.

 

Teach a new guy in a few years or so. Reloading is unfortunately a dying sport in itself.

[Cyrus1988]

The best way to thank us is simple.

 

Teach a new guy in a few years or so. Reloading is unfortunately a dying sport in itself.

 

 

I'll definitely be doing that.

 

Managed to get my hands on some 20gauge cards that are 1.5mm thick, so did a experiment; #1 cartridge with no card, #2 cartridge with 1.5mm card and #3 cartridge with 2mm card. These were all placed in the bottom of the wad cup with the shot on top. Results below:

 

From left to right: No card, 1.5mm card, 2mm card.

 

I then went on to load a full box of 25 with no cards in the wads.

 

 

 

Hopefully use these on some local crows. Need to sort out my pillar drill once I get payed next week and get this spinner in action.

[fortune]

Hi I don’t mean to be picky but the crimp isn’t correct. Yes you’ve got all the stuff in there and the tube has formed up to the correct shape but the outer edge of the crimp hasn’t been formed deep enough which as resulted in a flat outer edge. It needs to be deeper so that the edge is rolled down lower. If you take a new cartridge and look at this you will see what I mean. This might be caused by trying to get too much stuff in the tube or an adjustment. Yes, they will go bang and they will knock stuff down but they could be better which will make for a better cartridge performance. I use a Mec sizemaster in 28 and a Mec 9000 and there are a lot of adjustments that can be made to the punch and die settings to control this sort of thing such as the slight twisting of the crimp petals in the centre. I’ve never had any dealings with a Lee machine so I don’t know what or if there are adjustments that you can make to alter these things on the one that you have got. Keep at it, as it is a learning curve. I started out many years ago with a Tayside reloader set which was all individual hand tool bits and you made a cartridge one at a time from start to finish.

[Uncle Albert]

 

 

Hi Dave, yes the guys on here are unbelievably helpful, I've had so much support from so many people and I just can't thank them enough. I would be miles away from the stage I'm at now was it not for these guys.

 

F.E.S. is amazing too, I spoke to John for about half an hour and the amount of information he gave was crazy, I should of had a pen a paper ready. I only wish it was closer, I'm really struggling to find a supplier of Vectan AS locally. The closest place I've found which is just over an hour a way wants to charge £36 for 500g, that's almost double compared to the likes of F.E.S./Clay & Game.

 

 

Cheers.

 

+1 for John at FES Kent. He is a mine of information. I found that by going down there I actually save money on supplies and you can actually discuss your cartridges with him. He will make time for you and is very helpful. I haven't found anywhere cheaper than him. I started off using Red Dot which was about £35.00 for 500grms. AS is about the same but per kilo and the shot is well below the price asked by others. Then again the wads are £19.00 per 1000 which is much less than others. Can't find a better reason not to go down there. Maybe there is someone else near you so you could go down there together and split the petrol. You will certainly save in the long run.

 

Why not keep the new hulls till you get more experienced and can skive them to get a better result. Used hulls are easier to use as long as you are selective and sort the best. Try to stick to one make and make the most of them. I am reloading twice and then chucking them. You may be able to go further but always err on the safe side of things until you are more experienced. I don't know yet, you may be able to reload them more. I have heard of some people reloading up to six or more times but I'm not going that far after all for 5 mins work you can fill a bucket up with your chosen brand.

 

Yes Cookoff I will certainly help others start if I can with my very limited knowledge. I have two mates considering reloading but they both work and are limited with time. Being retired, I have plenty of that and it saves me getting square eyes, plus I am finding it quite relaxing.

 

Dave

Edited October 11, 2014 by Uncle Albert

[fortune]

I’ve had another look at the cartridges in your pictures and in the first picture #135 >> the first cartridge has no card but if the crimp was to be pushed down at the outside it would flatten the petals lower and the outside edge would form more of a roll over type step. Again if you look at a factory cartridge you will see what I mean.

Edited October 11, 2014 by fortune

[Cyrus1988]

Hi I don’t mean to be picky but the crimp isn’t correct. Yes you’ve got all the stuff in there and the tube has formed up to the correct shape but the outer edge of the crimp hasn’t been formed deep enough which as resulted in a flat outer edge. It needs to be deeper so that the edge is rolled down lower. If you take a new cartridge and look at this you will see what I mean. This might be caused by trying to get too much stuff in the tube or an adjustment. Yes, they will go bang and they will knock stuff down but they could be better which will make for a better cartridge performance. I use a Mec sizemaster in 28 and a Mec 9000 and there are a lot of adjustments that can be made to the punch and die settings to control this sort of thing such as the slight twisting of the crimp petals in the centre. I’ve never had any dealings with a Lee machine so I don’t know what or if there are adjustments that you can make to alter these things on the one that you have got. Keep at it, as it is a learning curve. I started out many years ago with a Tayside reloader set which was all individual hand tool bits and you made a cartridge one at a time from start to finish.

 

 

I’ve had another look at the cartridges in your pictures and in the first picture #135 >> the first cartridge has no card but if the crimp was to be pushed down at the outside it would flatten the petals lower and the outside edge would form more of a roll over type step. Again if you look at a factory cartridge you will see what I mean.

 

 

I totally agree, they're not right yet but I'm hopefully getting closer as I go on. As far as I'm aware there is no adjustments to be made on the Lee but I am going to experiment some more using a washer on the last stage of the crimp. I'm hoping though, that the addition of a spinner after the final crimp will tidy it up nicely and get to the level of a factory cartridge. Thanks for the info.

[Cyrus1988]

 

+1 for John at FES Kent. He is a mine of information. I found that by going down there I actually save money on supplies and you can actually discuss your cartridges with him. He will make time for you and is very helpful. I haven't found anywhere cheaper than him. I started off using Red Dot which was about £35.00 for 500grms. AS is about the same but per kilo and the shot is well below the price asked by others. Then again the wads are £19.00 per 1000 which is much less than others. Can't find a better reason not to go down there. Maybe there is someone else near you so you could go down there together and split the petrol. You will certainly save in the long run.

 

Why not keep the new hulls till you get more experienced and can skive them to get a better result. Used hulls are easier to use as long as you are selective and sort the best. Try to stick to one make and make the most of them. I am reloading twice and then chucking them. You may be able to go further but always err on the safe side of things until you are more experienced. I don't know yet, you may be able to reload them more. I have heard of some people reloading up to six or more times but I'm not going that far after all for 5 mins work you can fill a bucket up with your chosen brand.

 

Yes Cookoff I will certainly help others start if I can with my very limited knowledge. I have two mates considering reloading but they both work and are limited with time. Being retired, I have plenty of that and it saves me getting square eyes, plus I am finding it quite relaxing.

 

Dave

 

I wish he was closer but it's over a 2 hour drive there. I just can't justify it at the moment, my girlfriend would kill me.

 

Yeah I'm going to keep the new ones in the box for a while until I can get a proper crimp going. Thanks again Dave.

[Cyrus1988]

Sorry to keep this thread going but it's easy for me to see if I making any progress looking back through all the posts.

 

I hadn't reloaded for a while, mostly because I had ran out of used cases but also I've been thinking what else I can try to get these crimps closer to factory finish.

 

Quite a few people had mentioned about using a 1 cent coin or washer earlier on in this thread and I had tried it out but only on shells that had been through both the pre-crimp and final crimp stage. I had theory that maybe if I carried out the pre-crimp stage as normal but then placed the coin/washer on the top of the semi folded petals on the final crimp station and then completed the crimp, that it might work. Here's a pic of what I mean:

 

 

So I tried it out. Dropped the powder, placed the wad in by hand, not using the press to push it down any further, dropped the shot and completed the pre-crimp. I then quickly moved it to the final station, balanced the washer on top of the cartridge (as above) and lowered the press. I then slowly let the handle raise up and inspected the finished cartridge.

 

 

I've said this quite a few times on this thread but I think this is the best crimp I've managed so far.

 

I then thought about the new unused cases I have and wondered if it would work on them...

 

 

What do you guys reckon?

[sitsinhedges]

I reckon they're great.

 

Now go and shoot them

[pestcontrol1]

there looking good but try crimping them as normal then place the washer over the crimp and recrimp

But they are good and very userble

[Andy H]

There we go , Now lightly lube the top of a crimped cartridge put the washer on and apply some super glue to it and crimp again so as the washer sticks to the crimp ram , If you have already ordered the spinner a quick wizz and they should be perfect.

Edited October 16, 2014 by Andy H

[Cyrus1988]

I reckon they're great.

 

Now go and shoot them

 

Hopefully some crows will be getting a good scare soon, work permitting.

 

there looking good but try crimping them as normal then place the washer over the crimp and recrimp

But they are good and very userble

 

I had tried that earlier but it just seemed to push the middle of the crimp down and didn't really give a nice edge.

 

There we go , Now lightly lube the top of a crimped cartridge put the washer on and apply some super glue to it and crimp again so as the washer sticks to the crimp ram , If you have already ordered the spinner a quick wizz and they should be perfect.

 

I just ordered the drill tonight so hopefully by next week I'll be spinning these to perfection...

[sitsinhedges]

You can actually spin them straight from the pre crimp stage if you want to.

[Cyrus1988]

You can actually spin them straight from the pre crimp stage if you want to.

 

John from F.E.S. mentioned that when we spoke, is there any advantage of doing them like that?

 

Cheers.

[sitsinhedges]

 

John from F.E.S. mentioned that when we spoke, is there any advantage of doing them like that?

 

Cheers.

 

Maybe only if you're doing a different size shell than normal to save readjusting the press. Best to just finish them off with a RTO in my opinion, or even just use straight off the press if they're good enough.

[Cyrus1988]

 

Maybe only if you're doing a different size shell than normal to save readjusting the press. Best to just finish them off with a RTO in my opinion, or even just use straight off the press if they're good enough.

 

Ah okay, that makes sense.

[Guest cookoff013]

this is great news.....

 

coo