john faul Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 ((((Not worth starting the HMR slagging match off again)))), however its personal choice, and i have a .22lr and .223 and have no wish at all for something in between. i second that!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 what about rooks magpies and general vermin. Would you use the 223? seems a bit overkill and expensive. I find my HMR so versatile as any vermin to 150 yards is simply dead, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 what about rooks magpies and general vermin. Would you use the 223? seems a bit overkill and expensive. I find my HMR so versatile as any vermin to 150 yards is simply dead, what about vermin @ 250 300 yards? also in my opinion there is no such thing as overkill, just making sure its a humaine kill, cost wise, i think you will find my handloads dont work out an awful lot more than HMR given the extra range they give me. Not to mention the amount i spend on guns and travel 25-30p a shot is nothing in the scheme of things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browning Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 This is an interesting thread, and I can see it bouncing backwards and forwards between the two camps forever.....so I thought I'd throw in my 'two penneth'. I have owned and shot .22lr for over 20 years, and had my feet firmly in the 'I'll never buy an HMR' camp....... until I used one on a few vermin control trips. I then bought one and used it extensively for all my vermin control jobs........I have now sold my .22lr. In my opinion they are absolutely the dogs danglies for accurate, hard hitting vermin control up to 150 yards, once you've got used to them and stay within the limitations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 I keep a rifle with me in the truck every day, all day long. I need a rifle that will cope with just about every situation I am likely to come across. I could take any caliber with me but what do I chose............a .17 HMR. Nothing else comes near it for accuracy and ability. Charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 this is why i was so interested to see the HMR's at work at bisley and no offence to the HMR lads, but in a maybe 5mph wind they were struggling to keep 1.5! at 100 yards, and ive seen some of the groups these guys can shooting in the still, but the centerfires were all shooting much better, and at 150 yards they will walk all over them. horses for courses, if im going to make noise im going to do it properly, if im not then again im going to be very quiet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammy1800 Posted August 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 ye ye ye all fair enough but still CZ or Savage i want some comments on thread subject now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 ye ye ye all fair enough but still CZ or Savage i want some comments on thread subject now CZ barrels are very good, however ive not seen a HMR savage, the .22lr semi savage i saw was not nice tbh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammy1800 Posted August 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 chek savages website they now have a whole range of 17 hmrs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 im aware of this, im simply saying its not one i have experiance with Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazza Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 I have both the 22 and 17 CZs. A good friend of mine has a 22 and a 243 Savage. His 22 has problems extracting the bullets and its less than 12 months old and has had new extractors. Personally, I'm not keen on savage rifles, because they don't feel right for me. So if you ask me, I'd say CZ with the addition of a brookes trigger. however,there are people on here with Savage rifles and get on fine with them. It comes down to personal choice. Before you spend your money, see if you can handle both and then make your own mind up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammy1800 Posted August 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 ok thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rec-baller Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 ok thanks just to realy throw the cat amongst the pigeons ( only joking !!!) i to am looking at a Savage .17hmr BVTS , BUT there are non in the country till September !!! ive tried all my local gun dealers in Lancashire and gave up, i rang the Savage main rep to be told- we are getting 100 .17hmr,s in september!!! . so you may be in for a wait to look at one - same as me shaun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammy1800 Posted August 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 ye but it definatley worth looking at at the lower price than the CZ or alternative, any idea how much they retail for in UK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oly Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 If your looking at the price of a new savage you should sack that idea and go for the best...an Anschutz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tikkamark Posted August 8, 2007 Report Share Posted August 8, 2007 ye but it definatley worth looking at at the lower price than the CZ or alternative, any idea how much they retail for in UK I dont think your going to find much lower priced than a cz they are fairly cheap the savage are a good rifle and they have a trigger thats the best out of most rifles these days i think its called the accu trigger ment to be a great job I have a marlin myself its in that price range and is very accurate 7mm groups at 100yrds busted a lot of vermin with it too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P03 Posted August 9, 2007 Report Share Posted August 9, 2007 CZ 452 heavy barrelled varmint every time.......IMO. But ask Pin he's got one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammy1800 Posted August 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2007 ok what are the prices of the: marlin cz varmint 452 savage fvss or bvss in england not dollars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tulkyuk Posted August 9, 2007 Report Share Posted August 9, 2007 ok what are the prices of the: marlin cz varmint 452 savage fvss or bvss in england not dollars take a look around the interweb and you'll find good deals on them all - but best place to try would be either York Guns or The Sportsman Gun Centre. http://www.yorkguns.com/rifles.htm http://www.sportsmanguncentre.co.uk/produc...es/pagestart/0/ If you give either a ring they can source any gun for you. Also try Minsterly Ranges - they are pretty good too!! http://www.minsterleyranges.com/firearm.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browning Posted August 9, 2007 Report Share Posted August 9, 2007 ye ye ye all fair enough but still CZ or Savage i want some comments on thread subject now Sorry for getting off thread Jammy. My shooting pal bought a Savage .17HMR a couple of months ago. It certainly looks the part from afar. When comparing it directly with my CZ .17HMR I would say the CZ has it in terms of close up quality. (Remembering that they are both low cost rifles). The Savage trigger was better than the standard CZ trigger, but once you give the CZ a Brooks kit (£12.50) it surpasses the Savage trigger. The Savage stock was not inlet quite so well, and would need a chunk of material removing to properly float the barrel. All in all I have to say I prefer the CZ. Only problem with this is they only do blued barrels and wooden stocks at the moment (As far as I know) so that may be a limitation if you're looking for stainless/synthetic. My pal didn't get on with the Savage (or maybe he just didn't like it after he bought it) and swapped it for an Anschutz this week. If you fill in your profile you may get better answers regarding prices of gunshops that are closer to your area. Can't comment on Savage prices, but I paid £295 for my CZ Varmint 16" from Rugby Guns. Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted August 9, 2007 Report Share Posted August 9, 2007 this is why i was so interested to see the HMR's at work at bisley and no offence to the HMR lads, but in a maybe 5mph wind they were struggling to keep 1.5! at 100 yards, and ive seen some of the groups these guys can shooting in the still, but the centerfires were all shooting much better, and at 150 yards they will walk all over them. horses for courses, if im going to make noise im going to do it properly, if im not then again im going to be very quiet. Were the .22lr's doing any better than 1.5" at 100 at that range I'd bet they aren't. You can't compare the .17 to a centrefire as it is very different but why would you want to use a centrefire for small vermin control. Compared to the .22lr it runs rings round it both from a safety aspect and simply in doing the job. You accept its limitations if its windy limit the range for a rimfire its a very good gun and I'm seeing a lot more people now who read the press and were vehmenently against them now going out and buying them. The noise issue really doesn't have much impact in the real world you don't seem to scare rabbits that are feeding in groups. last night I emptied a magazine with one bunch and then had to re load to take the remaining 2 all within 40 yards of each other. Loosing your centrefire off at them I'd be surprised if the same could be said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted August 9, 2007 Report Share Posted August 9, 2007 this is why i was so interested to see the HMR's at work at bisley and no offence to the HMR lads, but in a maybe 5mph wind they were struggling to keep 1.5! at 100 yards, and ive seen some of the groups these guys can shooting in the still, but the centerfires were all shooting much better, and at 150 yards they will walk all over them. horses for courses, if im going to make noise im going to do it properly, if im not then again im going to be very quiet. Were the .22lr's doing any better than 1.5" at 100 at that range I'd bet they aren't. You can't compare the .17 to a centrefire as it is very different but why would you want to use a centrefire for small vermin control. Compared to the .22lr it runs rings round it both from a safety aspect and simply in doing the job. You accept its limitations if its windy limit the range for a rimfire its a very good gun and I'm seeing a lot more people now who read the press and were vehmenently against them now going out and buying them. The noise issue really doesn't have much impact in the real world you don't seem to scare rabbits that are feeding in groups. last night I emptied a magazine with one bunch and then had to re load to take the remaining 2 all within 40 yards of each other. Loosing your centrefire off at them I'd be surprised if the same could be said Depends on your situation, i shoot rabbits mainly at 80yards sometimes as far as 100 sometimes as close as 25yards with the .22lr, having seen the groups the HMr produces with a mild wind im not certain that it can be used in any sort of wind past 120 yards for chest shots. My needs only require a .22lr ive shot enough HMR's the last few years, ive seen some shooting great groups in the right conditions, however at the end of the day it isnt a centerfire, and it isnt subsonic. Both of these points are why im not interested in them. You try getting within 150yards of a bunch of crows that you have been shooting all day. They get very warey, you simply cant. Admitadly the HMR is a very safe round compaired to the .22lr, and i think that would be the only reason i could ever want one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted August 9, 2007 Report Share Posted August 9, 2007 I'd agree on the distance but then the .22 is quite badly affected by wind itself. I can take 80 yard shots with mine whatever the weather at that range its no issue at all, it just gives you the ability to shoot way beyond that when the conditions are right. We lamp from a vehicle usually so it means you can cover a lot of our ground from the tracks which is very useful when its too wet to get on the ground. Its all down to personal preference but I know I've not wanted to shoot a .22 since getting mine I just can't get used to the little round zinging off into the distance when the ground is hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted August 10, 2007 Report Share Posted August 10, 2007 In my local shop the CZ and Savage are only about £20 apart, the Savage being a little cheaper. I'd go for a CZ every time, they're built so much better than a Savage in my opinion. When my FAC finally arrives I'm going to buy either a CZ Varmint or CZ American in .17hmr with a 16" barrel. The comments on a hmr are pretty spot on I think. It's not a centrefire by any means, and is also not quiet. In many situations it's a poor half way house between the .22lr and a small centrefire. In my situation it gives long range on rimfire only ground, can shoot close foxes better than a .22lr, and is much safer than a .22lr. HMR has its place, in my opinion especially for inexperienced shots. The trajectory is flatter, and if a back stop isn't as good as it should be due to lack of knowledge you're less likely to come unstuck than with a bouncy .22! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammy1800 Posted August 10, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 10, 2007 ye what is difference in the two barrel lengths as range is concerned Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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