BASC to cease legal expenses cover wef 31 July 2020

[lancer425]

2 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Of course, I understand that, litigation is there to prevent matters getting to court by resolving the matter outside of it, but that isnt what we are talking about here.
There isnt any litigation, there is an organisation that has had its members challenged/encumbered, and it has basically asked its legal team 'How much is a challenge to this going to cost 'us' potentially ?' (Note the 'us' )
Then a sharp intake of breath later, and ' Ooh ! , that much ? , best leave it then' 

Rinse and repeat.

And if they had decided to go for a challenge and lost, you would have been baying for blood along with all the other usual suspects.

BASC can not win, do nothing WRONG. Do something fail WRONG.

Do something Get it right. OH! well done BASC. But generaly with the caviat of Pitty they did not do so well with X OR Y. .

 PS sorry to use the XorY here. but i did ask you guys for examples but any forthcoming the doctors letters example we easy answered.

 Any more for any more. What did they do.?

[Rewulf]

1 minute ago, lancer425 said:

And if they had decided to go for a challenge and lost, you would have been baying for blood along with all the other usual suspects.

Actually , no I wouldnt.
Id rather them lost, than give in without having a go.

2 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

Any more for any more. What did they do.?

BASC categorically oppose a lead ban.......BASC feel a lead ban is the only way forward.

BASC oppose any more controls on private firearms ownership....Lever release and  MARS systems banned...50 cal nearly, 70 people in the UK rejoice they can keep them.

BASC lobbys for 10 year licencing , as a counter to more grant/renewal restrictions......Gets nothing.

Need more ?

[lancer425]

10 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Of course, I understand that, litigation is there to prevent matters getting to court by resolving the matter outside of it, but that isnt what we are talking about here.
There isnt any litigation, there is an organisation that has had its members challenged/encumbered, and it has basically asked its legal team 'How much is a challenge to this going to cost 'us' potentially ?' (Note the 'us' )
Then a sharp intake of breath later, and ' Ooh ! , that much ? , best leave it then' 

Rinse and repeat.

The NRA keeps its core values and yields results, thats why they have the membership they have.
To say they are struggling is complete rubbish.

The US also has the 2nd , but you left that bit out for some reason...

But it is not rubbish, the US is losing its grip on gun ownership, The black guns are under scrutiny and the state system mean its not all states but a gradual erosion over time. and The NRA in the states comes under just as much criticism over there  as BASC does here if not more so.

the second amendment its self has been questioned of late something never envisaged in the history of America.

They are in a much stronger position than we ever have been, and a long long way to go to reach out level of despair. But not without a growing critique, that is making more of an impact now there than it ever has historicaly.

[clangerman]

16 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

 

Basc can challenge what they stand a chance of winning, to expect them to go against their legal advice to challenge the doctors letter etc. is unrealistic.

 

 

hands up any shooter who didn’t want legal action on the gp letters farce please 

[lancer425]

4 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Actually , no I wouldnt.
Id rather them lost, than give in without having a go.

1. BASC categorically oppose a lead ban.......BASC feel a lead ban is the only way forward.

2. BASC oppose any more controls on private firearms ownership....Lever release and  MARS systems banned...50 cal nearly, 70 people in the UK rejoice they can keep them.

3. BASC lobbys for 10 year licencing , as a counter to more grant/renewal restrictions......Gets nothing.

Need more ?

1. be great full they tried, you can not defend the indefensible. Lead is toxic and its WELL DEAD.

2. we live in harsh times, be great full 50 cals did not go too.

3. He shoots he did not score. HAPPENS.

Bring more LOTS MORE. 

[Rewulf]

5 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

But it is not rubbish, the US is losing its grip on gun ownership, The black guns are under scrutiny and the state system mean its not all states but a gradual erosion over time. and The NRA in the states comes under just as much criticism over there  as BASC does here if not more so.

You dont really know what youre talking about do you ?

 

6 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

the second amendment its self has been questioned of late something never envisaged in the history of America.

Of late ? Its been questioned since inception.
Yet gun ownership goes up, and recreational / legal gun use has had new life breathed into it, by NRA inspired training and competition.
To compare BASC to the NRA is like comparing a rubber dinghy to a battleship.
One bobs about and does nothing much, the other gets the job done, and doesnt get messed with.

[lancer425]

8 minutes ago, clangerman said:

hands up any shooter who didn’t want legal action on the gp letters farce please 

I deffinatly did want BASC to take action, but they went with their legal advice and fair play to them. we are where we are and not down to BASC or its lack of action, but down to the powers of the police and the legislation / guidance they are using and how they are interpreting it.  no one has an answer to the police problem no one.

[Rewulf]

1 minute ago, lancer425 said:

1. be great full they tried, you can not defend the indefensible. Lead is toxic and its WELL DEAD.

2. we live in harsh times, be great full 50 cals did not go too.

3. He shoots he did not score. HAPPENS.

Bring more LOTS MORE. 

OMG youve countered my argument so err effectively , youve shot me down in flames man..the humanity !
You.Have .Lost .The .Plot.

Im done with you.Cheers.

[lancer425]

2 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

You dont really know what youre talking about do you ?

 

Of late ? Its been questioned since inception.
Yet gun ownership goes up, and recreational / legal gun use has had new life breathed into it, by NRA inspired training and competition.
To compare BASC to the NRA is like comparing a rubber dinghy to a battleship.
One bobs about and does nothing much, the other gets the job done, and doesnt get messed with.

No sir it is indeed you who has no idea what he is talking about.

 Playing verbal tennis with some geriatric half whit on a pigeon shooting forum trying to educate the same pork is hard work. forgive me if i offend here but if the cap fits ya wear it. .

5 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

OMG youve countered my argument so err effectively , youve shot me down in flames man..the humanity !
You.Have .Lost .The .Plot.

Im done with you.Cheers.

Roll over suits you fine.

[grrclark]

1 hour ago, lancer425 said:

This is the case BASC folowed their legal advice.

We are where we are ,  "DUE to the incompetence of the POLICE" in their handling of simple straightforward cases From Ryan  hamilton and Atherton and others others.

 They had all they needed to prevent these atrocities, but the POLICE fail, demand more laws knee jerk reactions of ill thought out amendments to  the 68act  the 89 etc. we are where we are today. .

 BASC or anyone else is in a no win situation with the Firearms licensing in this country today .  There is no answer to the police / firearms licensing issue. We are where we are accept it and go as long as the police allow us too.

 no shooting organisation in the world can deal with the UK police they are just too power full .  No way out i am afraid.

 

We will certainly get nowhere unless we try.

There are many proceedings taken up against the police from all quarters and tht action is what drives change, quietly giving in achieves nothing.

The defence for BASC, then appears to be, it's a bit difficult so best not to try.  In the meantime let's publish a glossy magazine and talk big about what we could do, we have a 7 figure fighting fund by the way.  (Caveat, we wont probably wont fight anything unless we are certain we can win)  Let's support a campaign of potato crisps that taste of game, that is what the voice of shooting should be heard to talk about.

[lancer425]

4 minutes ago, grrclark said:

We will certainly get nowhere unless we try.

There are many proceedings taken up against the police from all quarters and tht action is what drives change, quietly giving in achieves nothing.

The defence for BASC, then appears to be, it's a bit difficult so best not to try.  In the meantime let's publish a glossy magazine and talk big about what we could do, we have a 7 figure fighting fund by the way.  (Caveat, we wont probably wont fight anything unless we are certain we can win)  Let's support a campaign of potato crisps that taste of game, that is what the voice of shooting should be heard to talk about.

They did what their advice said. not saying i like that or disagree as such, but they did what they did and had the legal advice to support their actions.

  could be a good use for any fighting fund, ASK them. i would dearly love to see the police licensing tail feather trimmed. but IS IT POSSIBLE? suggest it to BASC, or ask for a more detailed explanation.

[grrclark]

44 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

And if they had decided to go for a challenge and lost, you would have been baying for blood along with all the other usual suspects.

BASC can not win, do nothing WRONG. Do something fail WRONG.

Do something Get it right. OH! well done BASC. But generaly with the caviat of Pitty they did not do so well with X OR Y. .

 PS sorry to use the XorY here. but i did ask you guys for examples but any forthcoming the doctors letters example we easy answered.

 Any more for any more. What did they do.?

The doctors issue was easy answered, really?  Do you actually think your reponses are worth anything at all, being a blind apologist?

By saying that BASC didn't fancy the fight that makes it OK?  Their members wanted them to take on the fight and they are a members organisation, their entire purpose is to represent their members and yet they fail to time and time again.

It's all OK though, BASC said it might be a bit tricky so best not to even try.  We, the voice of shooting, best not try and stand up to the big bad policeman, he is just far too powerful.  You can stand up to him though individual shooter by refusing to give in an pay for a doctors letter, that is what we the "voice of shooting" advise.

 

[Mickeydredd]

2 hours ago, Gordon R said:

I think I would need to see the barristers opinion before agreeing with that. Ask ten barristers the same question and I will be astonished if you get more then a couple to agree.

BASC should have tested the water.

Well many have requested the actual advice but BASC were not forthcoming.

I assume it was internal advice.

[grrclark]

2 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

They did what their advice said. not saying i like that or disagree as such, but they did what they did and had the legal advice to support their actions.

  could be a good use for any fighting fund, ASK them. i would dearly love to see the police licensing tail feather trimmed. but IS IT POSSIBLE? suggest it to BASC, or ask for a more detailed explanation.

Again a total and utter cop out.

BASC have had the funds (members subscriptions) to take on a fight at any time, they have just ring fenced 7 figures of that after all for a fighting fund.  The irony is not lost surely?

The question was asked and the explanation was that it was a tricky fight and they didn't fancy it much, so we threw you under the bus.  That's it plain and simple.

All talk from the sidelines, there are even posts from BASC reps on PW saying "we advise you not to give in and don't pay" yes you might not be able to keep your guns, but make a stand lone shooters.  We the voice of shooting are a bit frit for this fight, but we'll hold your coat for you.

BASC are a self serving organisation that like to dress themselves up as being some upstanding and worthy body representing shooting and it is clear that they very much do not.  Long on rhetoric and short on real world value.

1 minute ago, Mickeydredd said:

Well many have requested the actual advice but BASC were not forthcoming.

I assume it was internal advice.

Even worse if it was.

They can write a good angry letter about people saying not nice things on Facebook though, yay BASC.

[Rewulf]

41 minutes ago, grrclark said:

BASC are a self serving organisation that like to dress themselves up as being some upstanding and worthy body representing shooting and it is clear that they very much do not.  Long on rhetoric and short on real world value.

Even avery and his WJ cronies have the measure of BASC.

'BASC is probably under considerable pressure from its membership to ‘do something’ about Wild Justice’s potential further legal challenges of the general licences and actual legal challenge to gamebird releases. But there’s not a lot they can do except huff and puff.'

https://markavery.info/2020/02/26/basc-is-a-hapless-bystander/

[clangerman]

2 hours ago, lancer425 said:

I deffinatly did want BASC to take action, but they went with their legal advice and fair play to them. we are where we are and not down to BASC or its lack of action, but down to the powers of the police and the legislation / guidance they are using and how they are interpreting it.  no one has an answer to the police problem no one.

and who do you think got my tickets back and grovelling apologies on more than one occasion the tooth fairy? no it was  me and on one occasion a official reprimand for the clown i seen pictured shaking hands at basc head quarters talk about sold out 

[lancer425]

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

Even avery and his WJ cronies have the measure of BASC.

'BASC is probably under considerable pressure from its membership to ‘do something’ about Wild Justice’s potential further legal challenges of the general licences and actual legal challenge to gamebird releases. But there’s not a lot they can do except huff and puff.'

https://markavery.info/2020/02/26/basc-is-a-hapless-bystander/

They "WJ" just need to be important and be recognised. That  how they exist, they have to stay centre stage .

Shame on you for ever giving them air time here. you are exactly what those vermin need to keep afloat.

some mupet like you dishing A pro shooting organisation, By promoting their case.  You are a disgrace. 

[Rewulf]

Just now, lancer425 said:

You are a disgrace. 

Im beginning to think you have some kind of mental issue, for that I feel sorry for you.
Otherwise, I would try to curtail your insults, or you might well find yourself quietened.

[Mickeydredd]

Avery is correct however, there is nothing anyone can do as the JR is a legal process that a judge will rule on.  The whole WJ approach is based upon legal challenge.

[lancer425]

1 minute ago, Rewulf said:

Im beginning to think you have some kind of mental issue, for that I feel sorry for you.
Otherwise, I would try to curtail your insults, or you might well find yourself quietened.

 That is a direct threat.

[lancer425]

5 minutes ago, Mickeydredd said:

Avery is correct however, there is nothing anyone can do as the JR is a legal process that a judge will rule on.  The whole WJ approach is based upon legal challenge.

And costs a great deal of money to counter such challenges, money BASC can not afford to waste on elements in their sevices Like the subject matter of this very thread.

[Rewulf]

16 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

 That is a direct threat.

Give me strength ! 

[holloway]

12 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

 That is a direct threat.

When the mods see this they will lock this thread or ban the poster or both  ,i have no idea why they didnt do it days ago personal insults and threats used to be frowned upon on this forum a sign that standards have slipped.

[Teal]

There are currently other topics running on BASC - this topic on legal expenses cover has been locked as it is derailed, and descended into other disputes.