New Zealand covid cases up 300%

[ordnance]

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My wife is on the front lines at the hospital.  She will tell you as will her nurse friend.  Wear a mask if you want, or don’t.  Doesn’t matter.  Life goes on or doesn’t.  The hospitals aren’t nearly as strained as the news are saying.  They are saying they are to keep the government money flowing.  And son that money is flowing! 

Yeah, they were just treating the patients in ambulances here queuing outside the hospitals because they thought it would be a nice change for the staff and patients, and it would maybe get a few extra quid for the hospital. 

  

Quote

7 minutes ago, JDog said: Then you have shown yourself to be an ignorant and irresponsible person. Why? 

If i have to explain that to you, its pointless. 

Edited February 15, 2021 by ordnance

[NoBodyImportant]

Just now, ordnance said:

Yeah, they were just treating the patients in ambulances here queuing outside the hospitals because they thought it would be a nice change for the staff and patients, and it would maybe get a few extra quid for the hospital. 

  

If i have to explain that to you, its pointless. 

That’s because the stupid rules that the hospital has to follow to get the government money.  Example:  one of the infirmary rooms at the hospital is designed for 6 beds.  But under the new regulations they can only have 1 bed.  So now you have less capacity.  It’s stupid I know but it looks good on paper when you hospital is at 100% capacity when you effectively lowered your capacity to get to the 100%.  Plus my wife used to care for 8 patients while on the floor.  Now you have one nurse per Covid patient. (Covid patient means they may have been exposed or showing one or more symptoms, you don’t need a positive test)  So if your floor used to have 80 patients you staffed 10 nurses.  Now you need 80.  So the news report is hospital stretched so thin they need 70 more nurses.  

[Konor]

3 hours ago, NoBodyImportant said:

Yes,  that’s exactly what I’m saying.  My grandmother said, “I’m 90 years old,  I’d rather live my last few months visiting my grandchildren then live my last two years alone”

Its not just 90 year old grandmother's who are dying perhaps your perspective would change if you were unfortunate enough to lose a young relative or multiple members of your family to covid. 

2 hours ago, NoBodyImportant said:

That’s because the stupid rules that the hospital has to follow to get the government money.  Example:  one of the infirmary rooms at the hospital is designed for 6 beds.  But under the new regulations they can only have 1 bed.  So now you have less capacity.  It’s stupid I know but it looks good on paper when you hospital is at 100% capacity when you effectively lowered your capacity to get to the 100%.  Plus my wife used to care for 8 patients while on the floor.  Now you have one nurse per Covid patient. (Covid patient means they may have been exposed or showing one or more symptoms, you don’t need a positive test)  So if your floor used to have 80 patients you staffed 10 nurses.  Now you need 80.  So the news report is hospital stretched so thin they need 70 more nurses.  

Not a situation we are faced with here thank goodness. 

[Konor]

3 hours ago, NoBodyImportant said:

My wife is on the front lines at the hospital.  She will tell you as will her nurse friend.  Wear a mask if you want, or don’t.  Doesn’t matter.  Life goes on or doesn’t.  The hospitals aren’t nearly as strained as the news are saying.  They are saying they are to keep the government money flowing.  And son that money is flowing! 

Why? 

The medical and nursing staff are more professional here in their role caring for vulnerable patients thankfully.

Are you saying that the opportunity for hospitals  to cash in  by manipulating government handouts for the treatment of patients over rides the importance of the welfare of those patients? Sorry I get the feeling that you haven't a clue what you are talking about and are keen to promote a conspiracy theory rather than acknowledge reality. 

 

[NoBodyImportant]

It is what it is.  Would you feel better if I lied and said my wife and her nursing friends are terrified and strained to the limits? They even opened the elective and cosmetic surgery center back up be cause the massive influx never came.  The shut down elective surgery floors down to use them as sick bays,  but after a month or two they opened them back up.  My wife wears her mask in the patient rooms the same way she did before Covid.  After work she sometimes get dinner with her nurse friends and twice last week she got crewed out because she wasn’t needed.  They have a list to sign up if you want to be off or go home early.  The pandemic hasn’t got here yet.  Maybe it will come but we have seen it except for toilet paper shortage and non ammo on the shelves.  

[udderlyoffroad]

1 hour ago, Konor said:

Not a situation we are faced with here thank goodness. 

Nonsense.  NHS hospitals have had to reduce overall capacity in order to permit greater distancing.

And if you truly believe NHS managers won't do stupid/counter productive things to get more money, then I've got a bridge to sell you.

 

1 hour ago, Konor said:

The medical and nursing staff are more professional here in their role caring for vulnerable patients thankfully.

Bit of a sweeping statement...Just because Nobodyimportant's wife's lived experience differs from yours, you resort to trash posting like that.

She'll be following the guidelines laid down by her employer, same as NHS staff over here. 

Pure speculation on my part, but if she fell short of the required standard, I suspect she'd be 'released to the employment market' far quicker than she would over here...

 

30 minutes ago, NoBodyImportant said:

Would you feel better if I lied and said my wife and her nursing friends are terrified and strained to the limits?

Probably. 

If it wasn't already obvious, some people have sought comfort in the new piety that is lockdown.  Self-flagellate and deny yourself freedom, and all will be better...What's that you say, things aren't getting better?  We must deny ourselves more.  Burn the heretics!

If and when my kids ask how supposedly intelligent people could take part in witch trials and burnings, I'll have plenty more recent examples to cite. See the recent threads on Amanda Holden (nope, never heard of her till this morning either) and 10yrs in prison for lying on a form.

Back on-topic:

If they can't manage to keep the case-load low in NZ, then there really is no hope.

Not only is LOTR-Land currently in the middle of summer, but I'm given to understand that as well as immigration controls with teeth, they always had bio-security controls to protect native flora and fauna - and therefore implementing controls was something their existing airport infrastructure was equipped to handle far better.

Further, New Zealand is the back-a**e of nowhere, and at the end of people's travel destinations, not the middle.  Unlike, say, Western Europe or the lower 48.

Plus, anyone ever met a fat, wheezing, benefit-scrounging, 40-fags a day (that's cigarettes, nobodyimportant...) Kiwi?  Nope neither have I.

[Konor]

59 minutes ago, NoBodyImportant said:

It is what it is.  Would you feel better if I lied and said my wife and her nursing friends are terrified and strained to the limits? They even opened the elective and cosmetic surgery center back up be cause the massive influx never came.  The shut down elective surgery floors down to use them as sick bays,  but after a month or two they opened them back up.  My wife wears her mask in the patient rooms the same way she did before Covid.  After work she sometimes get dinner with her nurse friends and twice last week she got crewed out because she wasn’t needed.  They have a list to sign up if you want to be off or go home early.  The pandemic hasn’t got here yet.  Maybe it will come but we have seen it except for toilet paper shortage and non ammo on the shelves.  

Whether your wife is terrified or not is not the point. She should be adhering to professional standards that should ensure her safety ,the patients safety and her colleagues safety. 

[Konor]

5 hours ago, NoBodyImportant said:

 

Some are getting it some are not.  My wife works with COVID-19 patients at the hospital so they originally said that hospital employees would have to get the vaccine.  My wife and so many others said they would give their two week notice so the hospital backed off.  To be honest if it would have been just made available she probably would have gotten it.  But when your told you have to get something then that triggers something in most Americans.    My wife’s aunt works at a different hospital than my wife and had the first one shot vaccine.  She then caught COVID and gave it to my wife’s grandmother.  She is in the hospital now.  But now they are giving a more effective two shot vaccine but my wife still opted out of it.  

Anyone working with Covid 19 patients ,their test specimens and their urine and faeces high risk specimens are working to a higher standard than using no protective equipment or not being vaccinated . 
 

[NoBodyImportant]

2 minutes ago, Konor said:

Whether your wife is terrified or not is not the point. She should be adhering to professional standards that should ensure her safety ,the patients safety and her colleagues safety. 

She does,  she has to wear a mask at work.  And wash her hand before and after leaving the patients room.  Which is the same thing she was required to do before the COVID-19.  But when she is off work we live our life.  Will we get Covid?  Absolutely I believe my wife will bring it home from the hospital or my son will catch it from school as he has already had a few kids in his classroom get it.  Will anyone die from it?  Maybe.  My wife grandmother probably will because she is positive right now, 90 years old and has severe dementia and they moved her from the hospital to a nursing home.  

[Konor]

13 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

Nonsense.  NHS hospitals have had to reduce overall capacity in order to permit greater distancing.

And if you truly believe NHS managers won't do stupid/counter productive things to get more money, then I've got a bridge to sell you.

 

Bit of a sweeping statement...Just because Nobodyimportant's wife's lived experience differs from yours, you resort to trash posting like that.

She'll be following the guidelines laid down by her employer, same as NHS staff over here. 

Pure speculation on my part, but if she fell short of the required standard, I suspect she'd be 'released to the employment market' far quicker than she would over here...

 

Probably. 

If it wasn't already obvious, some people have sought comfort in the new piety that is lockdown.  Self-flagellate and deny yourself freedom, and all will be better...What's that you say, things aren't getting better?  We must deny ourselves more.  Burn the heretics!

If and when my kids ask how supposedly intelligent people could take part in witch trials and burnings, I'll have plenty more recent examples to cite. See the recent threads on Amanda Holden (nope, never heard of her till this morning either) and 10yrs in prison for lying on a form.

Back on-topic:

If they can't manage to keep the case-load low in NZ, then there really is no hope.

Not only is LOTR-Land currently in the middle of summer, but I'm given to understand that as well as immigration controls with teeth, they always had bio-security controls to protect native flora and fauna - and therefore implementing controls was something their existing airport infrastructure was equipped to handle far better.

Further, New Zealand is the back-a**e of nowhere, and at the end of people's travel destinations, not the middle.  Unlike, say, Western Europe or the lower 48.

Plus, anyone ever met a fat, wheezing, benefit-scrounging, 40-fags a day (that's cigarettes, nobodyimportant...) Kiwi?  Nope neither have I.

I fail to see how pointing out the obvious from personal professional experience is trash posting 

[12gauge82]

5 hours ago, JDog said:

Then you have shown yourself to be an ignorant and irresponsible person. 

Pot calling the kettle black! 

[NoBodyImportant]

9 minutes ago, Konor said:

Anyone working with Covid 19 patients ,their test specimens and their urine and faeces high risk specimens are working to a higher standard than using no protective equipment or not being vaccinated . 
 

Since they opened elective surgery back up she works surgery 2-3 days a week and sick floors 2-3 days.  Even before Covid she had to wear gloves, mask, and sanitize before and after entering the rooms.  So I’m not saying they aren’t taking precautions.  They most definitely are.  I’m saying the mass graves apocalypse never manifested. And it seems that the normal precautions they take with all infectious people works pretty well. Even pre Covid a face shield is worn when bodily fluids are beings handled/ changing catheter bags, taking blood samples.  When Covid first started my wife would strip her scrubs off at the door and instantly showered and washed her scrubs.  All the nurses took it pretty serious at first.  Now not so much.  

Edited February 15, 2021 by NoBodyImportant

[udderlyoffroad]

Just now, Konor said:

I fail to see how pointing out the obvious from personal professional experience is trash posting 

Let me break it down for you...You assume the actions of a third person, as reported by a 2nd person, fall below their required professional standard, based on...what?  And then, seek to compare the entire professional body of one country with another and call that sub-standard, despite the (obvious) fact they will be following different rules laid down by different bodies of experts.

Yep, trash posting.

If you think only one approach is valid, and this is what the 'science' says - you are either willfully or naively misguided.  There is scientific consensus on Newton's  laws, the laws of thermodynamics, and er....that's about it.  There isn't even agreement amongst physicists on how an aeroplane wing generates lift...

[Konor]

1 minute ago, udderlyoffroad said:

Let me break it down for you...You assume the actions of a third person, as reported by a 2nd person, fall below their required professional standard, based on...what?  And then, seek to compare the entire professional body of one country with another and call that sub-standard, despite the (obvious) fact they will be following different rules laid down by different bodies of experts.

Yep, trash posting.

If you think only one approach is valid, and this is what the 'science' says - you are either willfully or naively misguided.  There is scientific consensus on Newton's  laws, the laws of thermodynamics, and er....that's about it.  There isn't even agreement amongst physicists on how an aeroplane wing generates lift...

It falls below the professional standards practised in the Hospital I work in.

[NoBodyImportant]

And a year ago I saw quite a few people wearing mask, social distancing canceling vacations, ect.....We took it seriously for a month or so.  I haven’t  personally wore a mask except for when my work mandated it.  After a day or two everyone started wearing them around their chin and after a week they kinda disappeared.  But even to this day we have a few here and there wear them.  Nobody makes fun of them, we respect their right to wear them.  It seems like Asians and elderly are more likely to wear them.  But we feel like it’s   personal choice.  

[12gauge82]

6 hours ago, ordnance said:

Yes they are getting on fine, just around half a million dead. 

Its not just for my benefit, its for the doctors nurses etc that have to deal with the fallout of peoples inconsiderate and selfish behaviour. 

I just think it's a bit simplictic to blame people like that, life is not black and white sometimes. You've got families that can't see elderly people in nursing homes who may die before lock down ends. You have people genuinely suffering with mental health issues. To blame people that don't fit in with your viewpoint is a bit too narrow for me. 

P.s I wear a mask everywhere, it doesn't affect me. 

[JDog]

16 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

Pot calling the kettle black! 

?

[NoBodyImportant]

1 minute ago, Konor said:

It falls below the professional standards practised in the Hospital I work in.

Wearing mask, gloves, washing hands?  What else would you ask the nurses to do?  She does that at work as she did pre Covid.  That has always been standard practice.  The standard practice of infectious patients has always required those precautions.  How is that sub standard?  Recovery rooms are single patient now so that’s probably helps.  What am I missing?  I am legitimately what to know where you are coming from.  

2 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

I just think it's a bit simplictic to blame people like that, life is not black and white sometimes. You've got families that can't see elderly people in nursing homes who may die before lock down ends. You have people genuinely suffering with mental health issues. To blame people that don't fit in with your viewpoint is a bit too narrow for me. 

P.s I wear a mask everywhere, it doesn't affect me. 

At first my grandma got so depressed she would call us crying.  She said she didn’t care so we started visiting again. 

[Konor]

8 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

Let me break it down for you...You assume the actions of a third person, as reported by a 2nd person, fall below their required professional standard, based on...what?  And then, seek to compare the entire professional body of one country with another and call that sub-standard, despite the (obvious) fact they will be following different rules laid down by different bodies of experts.

Yep, trash posting.

If you think only one approach is valid, and this is what the 'science' says - you are either willfully or naively misguided.  There is scientific consensus on Newton's  laws, the laws of thermodynamics, and er....that's about it.  There isn't even agreement amongst physicists on how an aeroplane wing generates lift...

Having worked for nigh on forty years in a clinical microbiology laboratory with microorganisms with varying safety requirements including Mycobacterium  leprae, Mycobacterium tuberculosis, Bacillus anthracis and Salmonella typhi, I don’t think you are in a position to lecture me on professional standards concerning infection control.

[udderlyoffroad]

10 minutes ago, Konor said:

It falls below the professional standards practised in the Hospital I work in.

 

Just now, Konor said:

I don’t think you are in a position to lecture me on professional standards concerning infection control.

Your professional standards are about as relevant to a Nurse in North Carolina as the NC rules are to you in Scotland.

I notice you've rather ignored all my other points?

If I may borrow a term from American Football...Just take a knee and run out the clock on this one.

[Konor]

1 minute ago, udderlyoffroad said:

 

Your professional standards are about as relevant to a Nurse in North Carolina as the NC rules are to you in Scotland.

I notice you've rather ignored all my other points?

If I may borrow a term from American Football...Just take a knee and run out the clock on this one.

The principles for infection control are universal. The bacteria and viruses being dealt with the same.

Stick to the catch phrases you don’t seem to have either specific information or personal experience to draw on to contribute any insight.

[NoBodyImportant]

5 minutes ago, Konor said:

The principles for infection control are universal. The bacteria and viruses being dealt with the same.

Stick to the catch phrases you don’t seem to have either specific information or personal experience to draw on to contribute any insight.

So what precautions on top of gloves, mask, hand sanitizer, and face mask when dealing with body fluids would your hospital have?  Because here they do that for all infectious diseases as they did before Covid.  People have to be taken care of.  That’s what my wife is paid to do.  It is an accepted risk. 

Edited February 15, 2021 by NoBodyImportant

[Konor]

10 minutes ago, NoBodyImportant said:

Wearing mask, gloves, washing hands?  What else would you ask the nurses to do?  She does that at work as she did pre Covid.  That has always been standard practice.  The standard practice of infectious patients has always required those precautions.  How is that sub standard?  Recovery rooms are single patient now so that’s probably helps.  What am I missing?  I am legitimately what to know where you are coming from.  

At first my grandma got so depressed she would call us crying.  She said she didn’t care so we started visiting again. 

I’d ask the nurses not to advise co workers to not wear masks as you stated in your earlier post and for all nursing staff to be vaccinated to decrease the risk of cross infection and I would think more of you if you valued other people’s lives more than your personal entertainment.

[udderlyoffroad]

Just now, Konor said:

The principles for infection control are universal. The bacteria and viruses being dealt with the same.

I'm really glad you know all there is to know, and that your particular environment you work in has perfected it, to the extent that without knowing others standards, you can criticise them.

You might have 40 years experience, but you certainly haven't learnt all there is to know - nobody ever does.

And let's not get started on the NHS' resistance to sharing best practice...we all know that discussion won't end well.

3 minutes ago, Konor said:

Stick to the catch phrases you don’t seem to have either specific information or personal experience to draw on to contribute any insight.

As it happens, I work in an international environment, and I learned long ago not to immediately spout off condemning different practices or approaches until I understood where they had come from, and why they were in place.

The principles may well be the same, but the rules for a hospital lab in Scotland, or a post-op ward in NC will be different, with good reason.

 

[Konor]

18 hours ago, NoBodyImportant said:

We are over it.  Some of us will die,  some of us will not.  

Your postings have moved away considerably from your posting of 18 hours ago that I took exception to.