The Heron Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 Me and her indoors have just had an exchange of views I said that William was good in his day but has been superceded by better authors for example Fredrick Forsyth, J K Rowling and Harper Lee. Any thoughts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 Shakespeare, whoever he really was, crafted the language rather than told stories. Its hard to understand how a fairly uneducated country bumpkin could have had the historical depth of knowledge to write many of his plays with such insight. We will never know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 I can see why the stories have endured, I just don't get the theatrical and historical adoration by which they are held. There are many other authors I would read.....Hardy, Dickens, and many others right up to modern day, that I would much rather read than Shakespeare. I would one day like to think the works of Pratchett would be held with some adoration akin to that of the so called bard. 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjpainter Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 (edited) No, for me Shakespeare still sets the mark. He moved language and theatre on far more than any of our modern contemporaries have done. The debate over whether he wrote them will never be settled, but there are no more credible possibilities than Will. Bacon, Oxford, several men not one, whomever you pick there are massive flaws in the theories. There are too many stylistic difficulties to make someone of high court feasible. The vast majority of Shakespeare's plays all have an elemental feel of the maverick (the controversial (to the time) politics, the treatment of religion, the complete dereliction of the unities etc) about them that point to someone educated but not of the establishment. And there's no coherent logic behind saying it could have been more than one. Stylistically, the plays fit too well and the ones where we know there's collaboration immediately stick out in the text and subtext of the narratives. A single author whose works and style matured over time makes more sense 14 minutes ago, Scully said: I can see why the stories have endured, I just don't get the theatrical and historical adoration by which they are held. There are many other authors I would read.....Hardy, Dickens, and many others right up to modern day, that I would much rather read than Shakespeare. I would one day like to think the works of Pratchett would be held with some adoration akin to that of the so called bard. 🙂 I think he'd have agreed with you, to be honest. I love Shakespeare and hoovered it up at school and uni, but there's an absurd reverence about his work that actively harms enjoyment of it. I've seen the best Shakespearian actors of our day do his stuff, but none beats a production of Twelfth Night done by a local to Reading professional drama house I saw. It was bawdy, irreverent, chaotic and absolutely brilliant - and probably closer to what to what it would have been like in the 17th Century than any RSC production given to an audience drunk on its own self importance. Edited September 9, 2021 by chrisjpainter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 The late Tom Clancy for starters and I could make a list but of course there is money to be made out of Shakespear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pushandpull Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 Shakespeare is damned forever for some of us by being force fed at school. However, when you are at a good production the language simply flows over you. Every so often there is a a phrase or figure of speech which we still use today, and you realise that this was the first time anybody said it ! Comparison with a modern (and excellent) novelist such as Tom Clancy is just not appropriate. It's like comparing Bach's B Minor Sanctus with Stairway to Heaven - both great but one is not "better". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 Sorry, but I found all his stuff to be boring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjpainter Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 3 minutes ago, Pushandpull said: Shakespeare is damned forever for some of us by being force fed at school. However, when you are at a good production the language simply flows over you. Every so often there is a a phrase or figure of speech which we still use today, and you realise that this was the first time anybody said it ! Comparison with a modern (and excellent) novelist such as Tom Clancy is just not appropriate. It's like comparing Bach's B Minor Sanctus with Stairway to Heaven - both great but one is not "better". Bach. Euch. If it ain't baroque, don't fix it. Give me Beethoven any day of the week Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pushandpull Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 Chris, I approach music with an open mind and enjoy as much as I can. This afternoon in the workshop encompassed the Chieftains, Bruch, and Peat and Diesel. My late uncle dismissed string quartets as "that wheezy music". The best stockman I have ever known but how much he missed in life ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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