nabbers Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 I have a nice little side by side with no makers name or serial number except for '3'. its unusual because it is sprung assisted opening. Just wondering if anyone recognises the design or can give me any information on it. Long shot I know! I took it in part ex, a friend had it and bought it from a shop and the description is still online, it reads as follows..... BELGIAN SIDE BY SIDE TOP LEVER SPRING ASSISTED OPENER .410 DOUBLE BARREL SHOTGUN. .410 Side by Side double barrel shotgun with hold open top lever opening. No actual makers name stamped. As with so many shotguns like this the Belgian proof stamps are about the only clue as to origin. This is a none ejector double trigger with fixed choke 28 1/8th barrels. Cylinder and full with 2 ½” chambers. It is actually quite a nicely made little shotgun. Spring assisted opening. Though bores are not as bright as I would like there is no major pitting as so often found in older .410 shotguns. The plain action is bright finished and sports a manual safety. Quite a nice straight grained, reasonably figured 14 ¼” stock. That finishes with a metal but plate. Chequering, though not described as sharp, is still well defined. Not quite sure if the actual gun number is as low as 3 but both the action and barrel are stamped as such and if not it’s an NVN candidate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 thats looks a bit different to the run of the mill stuff ...bung up a few more pics if you can... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wisdom Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 That's very nice indeed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enfieldspares Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 (edited) On the internet you can find Belgian proof marks. http://www.hallowellco.com/proof_date_codes.htm These will help you fix an approximate make for the gun. The problem that you may then have is that (I've owned various Belgian guns) is that the final vendor of the completed guns seem to have been very "shy" and never seem to put their name to the work. There may be various markings on the barrels of action but unlike the well known list of Spanish maker's codes - such as AC for Arietta or FS for Sarriugarte and UI for Ugartechea I've never seen such a list for Belgian makers. Edited March 12, 2023 by enfieldspares Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabbers Posted March 12, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 Thanks for the replies! Some more photos as requested, I'll dig it out of the cabinet and find the proof marks! 0D81BE65-10B5-4744-9580-3B1CBB4ACB5B.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 47 minutes ago, nabbers said: Thanks for the replies! Some more photos as requested, I'll dig it out of the cabinet and find the proof marks! 0D81BE65-10B5-4744-9580-3B1CBB4ACB5B.mov If it is Belgian marks it needs to say P.V. or it is black powder just like many older Belgian .410’s (most of which have been firing nitro cartridges for a hundred years!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy H Posted March 18, 2023 Report Share Posted March 18, 2023 That's a lovely gun but the problem id'ing a belgium manufactured gun of that time is the various makers made them as part of a co-operative to sell to a very large market so unless there in an actual makers mark on it apart from the proof mark to date it and identify which proof house it comes from you are fighting a losing battle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabbers Posted March 25, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackpowder Posted March 25, 2023 Report Share Posted March 25, 2023 Yes that is very nice. 60 years ago I would have given anything to own that! Blackpowder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabbers Posted March 28, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2023 On 25/03/2023 at 16:04, Blackpowder said: Yes that is very nice. 60 years ago I would have given anything to own that! Blackpowder On 12/03/2023 at 17:10, London Best said: If it is Belgian marks it needs to say P.V. or it is black powder just like many older Belgian .410’s (most of which have been firing nitro cartridges for a hundred years!). I'm not seeing a PV! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted March 28, 2023 Report Share Posted March 28, 2023 18 minutes ago, nabbers said: I'm not seeing a PV! Me neither on your photos. PV stands for Poudre Vite, fast powder, ie smokeless. Most old Belgian .410 guns don’t have the mark, but have withstood 120 years shooting smokeless. Obviously, it’s you call, but I wouldn’t worry too much myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy H Posted April 1, 2023 Report Share Posted April 1, 2023 (edited) PV under rampant lion is there , It is in proof marks picture no 4 rotate the photo 180 degrees ie upside down. Edited April 1, 2023 by Andy H Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted April 1, 2023 Report Share Posted April 1, 2023 1 hour ago, Andy H said: PV under rampant lion is there , It is in proof marks picture no 4 rotate the photo 180 degrees ie upside down. Great news, well spotted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy H Posted April 1, 2023 Report Share Posted April 1, 2023 I Also think it was at the proof house prior to 1924 but I cannot correcly identify the date code. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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