WGD Posted December 3, 2007 Report Share Posted December 3, 2007 I am new to game shooting and have the opportunity to join a rough shooting syndicate which is mainly walked up pheasant/woodcock, with some duck and ground game. I intend looking for a part trained semi-mature dog and I have narrowed the choice of breed down to either an ESS or a Lab. I’ve never worked a dog before, but have had pets all my life – we have a Lab at the moment and have had Labs in the past, I would prefer to stick with a Lab on the basis that I know (generally) what I’m getting in terms of the breed characteristics but I’m concerned over the Lab’s ability to hunt and flush game. If I thought a lab could hunt to a reasonable standard - acknowledging that it will not compete with an ESS - I would have no hesitation, but at the moment I am unsure. Any advice appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul in North Lincs. Posted December 3, 2007 Report Share Posted December 3, 2007 I am new to game shooting and have the opportunity to join a rough shooting syndicate which is mainly walked up pheasant/woodcock, with some duck and ground game. I intend looking for a part trained semi-mature dog and I have narrowed the choice of breed down to either an ESS or a Lab. I’ve never worked a dog before, but have had pets all my life – we have a Lab at the moment and have had Labs in the past, I would prefer to stick with a Lab on the basis that I know (generally) what I’m getting in terms of the breed characteristics but I’m concerned over the Lab’s ability to hunt and flush game. If I thought a lab could hunt to a reasonable standard - acknowledging that it will not compete with an ESS - I would have no hesitation, but at the moment I am unsure. Any advice appreciated. in a n ut shell................springer...........especially if you are walk up rough shooting where your quarry will have to be bushed and flushed for cover.... the springer is designed for this purpose! ps welcome to the watch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dustyfox Posted December 3, 2007 Report Share Posted December 3, 2007 Labradors are my favorites, but I wont say no to a ESS, if they are trained already Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wookie Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 I'm biased (hyave a springer) so I would say Springer. But... Labs are superb dogs too and, to be honest, you won't go wrong with either of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pavman Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 as the old saying,,,,,, A Lab is born half trained A Spaniel dies half trained or another,,,,,,,,Life is too short for Carp fishing or training Spaniels, need I say more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dusk2dawn Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 as the old saying,,,,,, A Lab is born half trained A Spaniel dies half trained or another,,,,,,,,Life is too short for Carp fishing or training Spaniels, need I say more Good stuff PAV, I thought that one had died out. Its Labs for me everytime although a good trained dog will be very hard to come by. Good luck with the search but make sure its from working stock whichever way you decide to go. D2D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 as the old saying,,,,,, A Lab is born half trained A Spaniel dies half trained or another,,,,,,,,Life is too short for Carp fishing or training Spaniels, need I say more Exactly, if you have plenty of time and patience go for the springer if not get a Lab. Springers are fine as walked up dogs but it takes a very good one to sit on peg if you're doing driven game shooting. The number you see whining their heads off and trying to pull the corkscrew out of the ground is quite comical Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oly Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Springador!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wookie Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 There's always the GSP/GWP breeds... I know one that is an excellent rough shooting dog. I still reckon that the whole thing with Springers not being trained enough is rubbish. They are intelligent dogs and there's no reason why they can't be trained. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millomite Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Springador!! No No No Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oly Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Springador!! No No No Why The ones I've seen have beaten off the competition at the likes of Lowther Show, great temperment (of the lab) yet has stamina (of the springer), great working dogs, pets and good looking too IMO. Yes Yes Yes!! :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackbart Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 as the old saying,,,,,, A Lab is born half trained A Spaniel dies half trained or another,,,,,,,,Life is too short for Carp fishing or training Spaniels, need I say more These sayings were obviously invented by someone who has never had a spaniel. I have both at the mo and the lab was born half stupid half ignorant I have had springers since i was in single numbers and find them very easy to train. In thick cover and brambles etc the best lab in the country will be made to look stupid by a mediocre spaniel. Springers are for flushing game,labs are for retreiving game and as you say most of your shooting is walked up you therefore need to flush the game first so a springer is the way to go Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potshot Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 You could always cross a labrador with a pheasant plucking machine - then it could retrieve oven ready birds. Why don't we have thread where we can suggest the best crosses and the stupidist ones :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 There's always the GSP/GWP breeds... I know one that is an excellent rough shooting dog. I still reckon that the whole thing with Springers not being trained enough is rubbish. They are intelligent dogs and there's no reason why they can't be trained. don't stitch him up he's worried a springer will be too difficult Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oly Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 You could always cross a labrador with a pheasant plucking machine - then it could retrieve oven ready birds. Why don't we have thread where we can suggest the best crosses and the stupidist ones :lol: So what cross-breed are you Potshot? No guesses for which category you'd be entered in!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nildes Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Labrador, every time. Springers are just too dizzy and you're taking on twelve years of frustration. Four of them will be spent pulling Burr Docks out of its hair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millomite Posted December 5, 2007 Report Share Posted December 5, 2007 Springador!! No No No Why The ones I've seen have beaten off the competition at the likes of Lowther Show, great temperment (of the lab) yet has stamina (of the springer), great working dogs, pets and good looking too IMO. Yes Yes Yes!! :angry: Why mess with years of selective breeding to get something you cant be sure of? Modern dogs are bred to be biddable and easily trained, why cross them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oly Posted December 5, 2007 Report Share Posted December 5, 2007 Why mess with years of selective breeding to get something you cant be sure of? Modern dogs are bred to be biddable and easily trained, why cross them? The same reason you don't marry your sister (that said...I've have been to Millom & know what you people are like!! ). And it can't be said that many 'pure bred' dogs haven't, over the generations, been bred a little too close to home. By selectively breeding from good working lab and good working springer stock you generally end up with the best of both - same as all good breeding should be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted December 5, 2007 Report Share Posted December 5, 2007 thats why Pedigrees come with a 5 generation pedigree oly so you can check how closely they've been bred. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
v-max Posted December 5, 2007 Report Share Posted December 5, 2007 Oly you also get all the bad from both breed's with it.Lab's & spaniel's both have there down's now a day's with hip's/elbow's & eye prob's & best monitored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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