pavman Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 (edited) I thought last nights programme was very interesting. It’s very easy for HFW to stand in front of those families on that estate and encourage them to eat free range and shop locally but if I were in a different situation than I am now and needed to support a family on a tight budget then I’d be down that supermarket getting my two chickens for £5. Simple as that, I wouldn’t let my family go without. very well put Jonsey Lets hope the work in promoting game by BASC can perhaps benefit by this exposure and get folk interested in free range game birds Edited January 8, 2008 by pavman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 Spot on Jonsey. The other day on the wireless they had someone from the campaign against Tesco on. Saving the high street is a worthy but doomed cause as the presenter commented because everyone knows they should support their high street but look at the complete and utter success story that is Tescos. Everyone knows what will happen but do they change their shopping habits? No, they don't - they vote with their pockets end of. Joe Public can't afford the luxury of shopping anywhere else. Whilst all of this focuses on "food retail" I was reminded that I snuck into Asda last week to fill my car up and have a nose round - .99 p a litre petrol and jeans for £3. If someone suggested I should support my local independant petrol station and pay £1.10 a litre and my local clothes shop and buy box standard jeans at £35 a pair I would tell them to poke it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 Unlikely at £6.50 for 450 grams of game bits for stew in my local waitrose £5.50 a pigeon etc etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandersj89 Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 As I said above it will be interesting times ahead, food is cheap now but it wont be cheap for ever. On the organic front, it is already at a premium cost wise, it is going to get very expensive in my view. If that happens you will see it drop away from the shelves very quickly. Factory farming on the whole has also reduced in scale in the last 10 to 20 years. Welfare rules in most areas have forced the changes, for instance veal crates and farrowing crates, but the chicken industry is still a little behind though things are changing slowly. The key though is people are used to cheap food and have come to expect it. They have also disassociated what they eat with where it comes from. A piece of plastic wrapped meat on the shelves in a supermarket chiller is just that, a lump of meat. It is not a joint from an animal they could associate with or understand what has gone into producing it. Personally I would not buy those 2 for a fiver chickens, instead I would prefer to buy a barn reared chicken from a known source. Pound for pound it will be more expensive but I bet I get more meals of it than those fast food chickens. Don’t forget a lot of what you are paying from in the cheap option is water, they are pumped up with water to make them moist when cooked. Also the breeding of the birds focuses on producing breast meat. A barn reared bird will have better meat coverage over the entire carcase. I bet you once you start with decent meat and learn how to cook it properly and use all the meat over a number of days you will find it better value the “cheap†meat. (If any one is interested in looking for a decent supplier of chicken can I suggest they look at Creedy Carver, they have a website. This is where I buy all my chicken. It works out cheaper than the supermarket and I am getting a product that is better from a welfare view point and better from a taste viewpoint as well. I have no connection with this firm other than being a happy customer and have been one for over 5 years). We, the human race, are by nature a lazy beast. That is the second reason we shop at supermarkets. The high street is past saving as far as food shopping is concerned, which is a same, but our lifestyle and lack of time means we cant invest the time required to shop on a daily basis as our parents, grandparents used to. But there are other ways to shop for food, the internet is a fast growing way to buy food, see my example above or organisations such as Riverford Organics, etc. It needs a little effort to find sources you are happy and needs a little discipline to keep doing it but you will benefit financially and on the grounds of taste. I do use the supermarket but not for food in the main. Meat I but on line, shoot or get from a local butcher. Veg I grow myself or buy from a local greengrocer. Good luck to Hugh for trying to raise the awareness of how chicken is produced. I doubt he will be able to claim a victory when we look back in 6 months time but I will support anyone promoting well produced food. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 I can get two corn fed free range chickens from my local butcher for £5. They're a little smaller than the Tesco ones, but not a lot. I feel bad if I eat a cheap one, and they taste **** too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkield Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 Some good points, but in simple terms it is about raising awareness, most people who buy the factory stuff have no idea what these animals go through. Several people discussing this on the radio today say they are going veggy from now on having seen this and the other program about pigs(?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonsey Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 (edited) Jerry you’ve made an excellent point there about learning how to cook it properly and using all of the meat over several days. We have to learn how to cook again like our parents and grandparents did. Hands up anyone that chucks the chicken carcass out (s’cuse the pun) on a Sunday night because I know I’ve done it many times. If I’m feeling particularly energetic I will use it for stock and freeze or make soup but to be honest it’s not every week. I’m short on time yes, but also I don’t make enough time for things. I’m very guilty of spending whatever time I have left of an evening relaxing. As you say, it’s investment of time and like most people I want to sit and be still when I can. Due to the nature of my work I also count time in terms of cost. Sad I know and I’m being brutally honest here but I think, hmmm how many man hours will that be and at what cost just to save a couple of pounds? I won’t be the only person to think that either. It’s the way that we have changed, or allowed ourselves to change perhaps. We are also very lucky on this site in that we shoot things for the pot and know the true value not only to our health but pocket of free range birds, rabbits etc. It’s education by hobby for most of us which is a privilege in my opinion. Pavman, I read in the paper before Christmas that game is more popular than it has been for years. Largely due to the exposure it gets from the TV Chefs I suspect. Again going back to learning how to cook, I suspect the vast majority of people aren’t sure what to do with game rather than disagree with how it’s procured. As long as the TV Chefs keep showing recipes then I think it’ll carry on it’s rise in popularity. The only thing I will criticise the Chefs for is using ingredients that aren’t found in the average Joes store cupboard. We need them to keep recipes simple. Mungler don’t sneak around you have the right to spend your stash however you like. I like to have choice don’t you? I’m very fortunate in that I can afford a choice but as you say some people can’t. Arh see now going veggie because of what they have seen. It's too shocking a thing for them to watch. I get it I really do, people don't want to brought down with a bump and see several thousands birds all cramped in together and then killed 39 days later. That's not getting people to make an informed choice about how they buy their food it's shocking them into making another ill informed decision. EDIT P.S Fretted all the way home on the train that any vegetarians may think I think it's an ill informed decision to be one. I did not mean it to sound that way. Apologies for any offence. Edited January 8, 2008 by Jonsey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lewis Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 (edited) when fern killed that chik because it was too weak will give the antis ammo also looking forward to the next programme . looks like he kills a few more for eating hmm but that was really good, hope it opens peoples eyes Lew Edited January 8, 2008 by lewismac1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myuserid Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 I would love to stick that fat woman in one of those sheds, if she didn't eat so many mars bars she would be able to afford an extra 50p ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 she had an element of a point, those conditions weren't bad and there will always be a certain mortality whatever method of production you follow. Its also worth adding that it was filmed in the summer in winter with grotty outside conditions they won't want to go outside as much. What will be an eye opener is when they are much bigger and they are "harvested" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 All hammed up for the cameras. Hugh blubbing because he rang two chickens' necks. Hang on a minute - there's an *-off large shed full of a couple of thousand chickens that from start to finish (a mere 39 days) will all be sent for "processing". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 you are so much more eloquent than I mungler but that was what I was meaning Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nildes Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 All hammed up for the cameras. Hugh blubbing because he rang two chickens' necks. Hang on a minute - there's an *-off large shed full of a couple of thousand chickens that from start to finish (a mere 39 days) will all be sent for "processing". Yep that p'ssed me off. Hugh blubs seconds later, right on cue comes the stats about how many birds are slaughtered before they reach the end of the process. Does he skin that bird and make stock from it? No he bins it. His ham acting is still in danger of hiding the real story hes trying to put across. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinbum71 Posted January 8, 2008 Report Share Posted January 8, 2008 Hi guys. I'm pretty new to these forums, but I thought I'd join in. I found Hughs program interesting. Yes, he's hamming up for the cameras. Yes, he has his own agenda (good tv, river cottage training days etc) but the basic point is to be appluaded. Last year my eldest daughter declared her intention to become a veggie because of animal welfare issues. We did research as a family and decided to change our eating habits. We have stopped using supermarkets for nearly all of our weekly shop. We use locally sourced meat from our local butcher and have found this to be cheaper as well as tastier! We now have our own chickens running free in our paddock, as well as geese and a turkey (for Easter) Our first "crop" of 6 cock birds are due for despatch in 4 weeks time, and we're really looking forward to it. The problem as I see it is that people expect to eat meat every day. Free range chickens aren't expensive, they're the same price chicken used to be. It's just that intensive chickens are being driven down in price by supermarket price wars. Consumers don't demand £2 chickens, Tescos do! Use leftovers, cook meals from scratch, buy locally and we'll all be happier and healthier while keeping British farmers in business. Right, I'm off my soap box now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 (edited) Yes, he's hamming up for the cameras. Yes, he has his own agenda (good tv, river cottage training days etc) A very interesting point. Did we all catch the clip of Hugh's new shop which sells organic produce which just happened to be opening in the same week as his TV series on battery chicken farming was being filmed and the meeting in the local Town hall was scheduled. Wow, with a massive team of researchers and a BBC production team, that kind of accidental overlap and coincidence would ermm have to be ermm..... planned. Ppppffffff! Edited January 9, 2008 by Mungler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wookie Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Spot the cynic! It could be all coincidence you know.... Still a good program and something that needs to be shown to people about where their food comes from. People need to know that more than anything else. Mind you, farmers also need to be paid a decent amount for the food they produce too, but that goes hand in hand with the supermarket buying power/mass production argument. I did have all that straight in my head, but I've only had two cups of tea so far this morning and it just fluttered away from my mind like a placcy bag in the wind. Wookie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkield Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Yes we are all a bit cynical aren't we (and that's rich coming from me!) Well it has had an impact, I thought we only ate free range chickens, turns out we don't, but we will be from now on. I agree with comments about the 'big boned' lady, she needs a good slap, even her kids can see it Wookie 10/10 for not making any 'fat tounged mockney' comments, I would have put a months salary on you doing that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salisburykeeper Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 The big fat gobby woman is like the human equivalent of the intensivly farmed chickens, = obesly fat ,waddles along,obviously eats out of bordom! i hated the way she has taken it upon herself to boss the other people around on that allotment, if it where me camera there or not i would tell her where to go! i can understand from her point of view about the intensivly farmed chickens because from her point of view she shares exactly the same lifestyle as those chickens staying in with no exercise and eating for the sake of it! I hate the way people like her have such an opinion on everything yet she is a single parent with probably a council house that the state pays for, coming onto the tv saying im a single mom and i cant afford an extra 50p per head for a free range chicken! and she keeps saying i can only buy cheap food.looking at the size of her *** i would guess she could afford a lot better food for her kids if she cut down on her eating ! She should get up off her fat *** and get a job if not anything else she could bend over and provide parking for motorcycles! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LEFTY478 Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 ................I hate the way people like her have such an opinion on everything............... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Several people discussing this on the radio today say they are going veggy from now on having seen this and the other program about pigs(?) It does make you wonder what impact this series will have. Looking at the adverts on Jamie's forthcoming programme, its going to be very interesting. I am sure we all understand that this series is about raising awareness and promoting the idea to people that intensive farming should be stopped. What I don't understand is why people would go veggie, because of it. As for the 'big boned' lady, well she does have good reason. Wether you agree is not the point. I personally don't and already buy free range chicken and barn eggs. But it does show how divided, opinions are. As I said, I don't agree but why would anyone in her situation (i.e single mum, loads of kids, living off the state) buy a free range corn fed chicken from the supermarket at a higher price, when she could buy 2 for a fiver? The problem is that people in her situation are most likely to shop at a single supermarket, buying all the blue and white striped products to ensure they get fed for the week and to make sure they have enough for the electric and gas keys. As for the others and this has already been said, I wonder how keen they will be to breed their own chickens come the winter when its cold, wet, muddy and just damn right miserable? Not to mention that the BBC and Hugh have packed up and left them to fend for themselves. Tough challenge I think, but you have to commend them for trying. Watching Hugh cry on tele was odd. My first reaction was I don't believe it. False or not, i'm sure he felt dreadful having to cull the birds. His message though, clearly came through. Good on 'em! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myuserid Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 The thing that annoyed me was that big/fat woman wouldn't admit which barn was best, I think she knew that the free range farm was better but wouldn't admit it as that would mean she would have to buy free range chickens. If you were a chicken/human and had the choice which barn would you prefer to live in, the one with no light/intensive or the free range able to move etc?? its not a difficult question and I dont see why she found it difficult to answer, well my first sentence probably answered that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Has anyone else signed up to the cause? http://www.chickenout.tv/index.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 The fat woman did have a slight point about the birds knowing no different, but there really needs to be a bit more thought on it. Barn rearing for eggs is perfectly acceptable and seen as far better than battery hens of course. So does it come down to stocking density, the free range side of the barn is the best at the moment but come winter it will be a slightly different story with the hens getting muddy and bringing the damp and mud back into the barn so I'm not sure what they would look like then. Personally i've not seen anything shocking on it yet the issues over slow growing or deformed birds happens anyway when you're looking at thousands of birds and they are best off humanely despatched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wookie Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Stuart... I thought about it, but in this case I have to give the scooter riding mockney tw4t a bit of credit. He stands a fair chance of pi55ing off a company that's given him over a million quid to advertise their products and that means that he's grown a pair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisNicholls Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 It does make you wonder what impact this series will have. I feel sure it will have some impact. This morning my wife received a letter from Sainsburys, not the usual offer sheet but a letter solely about chickens and what they in particular sell in their stores. They must be taking it very seriously indeed to go to such lengths, and so they should. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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