Youth 'sped up' at rail crossing

[dustyfox]

why is it that young people today when they past their driving test they think they can do what they want.

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/highla...nds/7294392.stm

 

As a result this young new driver managed to kill his friends by crossing a rail crossing when the barriers were down. He has got to live with that for the rest of his life.

 

DF

[cappy0766]

This sounds a helluva lot like a 'fast and furious' reanactment to me.

What a bloody idiot!

 

But how can that be punished?

[Big_Sam]

It seems to be a recurring problem with inexperienced drivers taking friends in their cars.

 

A few years ago a chap I worked with went off the road killing himself and a passenger, chap had little experience.

 

This chap, doing 108mph in a fiesta is another reason why cars should be fitted with speed limiters (70mph) for inexperienced drivers.

 

They just don't seem to realise how quickly it all goes wrong at that speed.

 

 

As for trying to jump a crossing.... more people lose than win in that game, it ain't worth even trying.

[Big_Sam]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Y8Tu6uPQfk

 

That's what happens.....

[col s10]

This sounds a helluva lot like a 'fast and furious' reanactment to me.

What a bloody idiot!

 

But how can that be punished?

chop his balls off : :o

[Poacher]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Y8Tu6uPQfk

 

That's what happens.....

 

Not much chance of getting out of that alive :o

[pin]

With the complete change of dynamic, kids these days compared to my generation, I personally feel they should raise the driving age to 21.

 

With some notable exceptions the vast majority of 17 year olds are far too immature and irresponsible to be trusted with driving a car.

 

Combine that with "smack on the wrist" punishments, where's the incentive to behave?

[J@mes]

No sympathy for him at all.

 

The family of the loved ones, the officers who let him go the first time around and were on the scene (although 108mph two days after passing your test, I would have said they have been slightly negligent in not arresting him for dangerous driving) and the poor train driver who will probably see this incident every time he closes his eyes for the rest of his life.

 

raising the age is not the answer i feel, but much more education on driving and similar laws to other countries where you are on a curfew and not allowed to carry a certain amount of passengers at certain times - IE more than one passenger after 9pm.

 

Systems of limiting power of vehicles as used on bikes could be good, although there obviously are people out there who are mature and responsible enough to drive powerful vehicles - I for example bought a 320BHP 3000GT Twin Turbo for my 21st birthday, and I am still here 3 years on. Discussed it with my father beforehand (IAM/ROSPA trained as well as being a motorcycle instructor) and he was of the opinion that I was sensible enough and had the driving ability to handle the car, and I did without issue.

 

I do not agree with speed limiting, there are occasions where exceeding the speed limit is required to remove you from a dangerous situation (for example if you move to overtake but misjudge it and the person behind you has closed the gap you were in, you are forced to carry on passing.) If you suddenly ran out of power, you will be left with nowhere to go.

 

But as usual, the minority may spoil it for the majority!

[gibby]

With some notable exceptions the vast majority of 17 year olds are far too immature and irresponsible to be trusted with driving a car.

 

I completely disagree with this. I think it's only a minority of 17 year olds who are too immature and irresponsible to drive. Ok you hear of these stories coming up now and then, but it's just the same as experienced drivers who fall asleep at the wheel who can cause just as much havoc.

Be sure this chap will see more then a "slap on the wrist". I think there's plenty of incentives out there to behave, i know that if ever i got into any trouble i'd be kissing my uni degree goodbye, along with any chance of a successful job aswell as 12 years of private education, thats more then enough to keep me in line and scared of stepping out of line.

 

Yes this chap was an absolute plonker and i thank god that none of my friends or myself would be stupid enough to do something like that, but don't tar us all with the same brush.

 

Gibby

Edited March 13, 2008 by gibby

[pin]

Ok chap, I was just stating my opinion.

 

I should probably have been more specific, I'm more talking about the "chav" masses.

 

I did caveat with "notable exceptions". Someone with 12 years of private education that keeps his nose clean isn't likely to go and behave like this.

 

My comment is more a social observation, at one time kids were frightened of authority and it kept them in line, now every hoody wearing ****-jewelry clad chav knows the criminal justice act inside out and is acutely aware of just how far he can push it.

 

I stand by my comment, I think 17 is too young to be trusted with a car. I am sure when I was 17 I'd have screamed blue murder at someone like me suggesting I couldn't have a car, at least I recognise that 1990 me would kick 2008 me in the nuts for saying that :o

[bob300w]

Ok chap, I was just stating my opinion.

 

I should probably have been more specific, I'm more talking about the "chav" masses.

 

I did caveat with "notable exceptions". Someone with 12 years of private education that keeps his nose clean isn't likely to go and behave like this.

 

My comment is more a social observation, at one time kids were frightened of authority and it kept them in line, now every hoody wearing ****-jewelry clad chav knows the criminal justice act inside out and is acutely aware of just how far he can push it.

 

I stand by my comment, I think 17 is too young to be trusted with a car. I am sure when I was 17 I'd have screamed blue murder at someone like me suggesting I couldn't have a car, at least I recognise that 1990 me would kick 2008 me in the nuts for saying that

I'm with you blue. :o

[digger]

When I was 11, three days before Christmas in 1979, my mum was killed on a level crossing. She didnt jump the barrier, there was a fault with the system and she was gone. So from a slighlty different angle I would gladly go toe to toe with that kid and wipe him from the face of the earth.

[Big_Sam]

I got my licence at 17 and I'm still here. Yes we all do stupid things when learning, but I avoiding doing dangerous stupid things.

 

Funnyly enough since getting the SGC I have stopped speeding altogether.....

[pin]

I got mine at 17, 2 days after my 17th as it happens (pop was a driving instructor).

 

I had a nasty crash 3 months after passing my test, wasn't enough to deter me from driving too fast and several years later I wrote off 30k's worth of Evo. Solo, no passengers, no other people involved. Finally learned my lesson.

 

My point is based on bitter personal experience. I am sure if I looked hard enough I could find thousands of totally safe 17 year old drivers, I bet I could find far more unsafe ones though :o

Edited March 13, 2008 by pin

[dustyfox]

Ok chap, I was just stating my opinion.

 

I should probably have been more specific, I'm more talking about the "chav" masses.

 

I did caveat with "notable exceptions". Someone with 12 years of private education that keeps his nose clean isn't likely to go and behave like this.

 

My comment is more a social observation, at one time kids were frightened of authority and it kept them in line, now every hoody wearing ****-jewelry clad chav knows the criminal justice act inside out and is acutely aware of just how far he can push it.

 

I stand by my comment, I think 17 is too young to be trusted with a car. I am sure when I was 17 I'd have screamed blue murder at someone like me suggesting I couldn't have a car, at least I recognise that 1990 me would kick 2008 me in the nuts for saying that :o

 

I agree with pin,

 

I say if they have caused trouble as a child they should push the age limit up for that person. And reward the ones that are doing well in school by lowering there age limit to 16 years to drive. This will hopefuly make them get good grades at school and make more of them behave.

[paulf]

"Someone with 12 years of private education that keeps his nose clean isn't likely to go and behave like this."

 

I dont see what public or private education has to do with this.

 

There are a small minority of bad young drivers just the same as the minority of elderly drivers that shouldnt be on the road. fatal Incidents involving youngsters simply get more coveradge.

 

Part of the reason a lot of acidents are fatal is the young drivers canot afford to insure larger vehicles and are therfore driving older small engined cars with probable corosion that dont resist impacts as well as for instance a modern saloon.

[col s10]

When I was 11, three days before Christmas in 1979, my mum was killed on a level crossing. She didnt jump the barrier, there was a fault with the system and she was gone. So from a slighlty different angle I would gladly go toe to toe with that kid and wipe him from the face of the earth.

this post mate has really brought me down with a bump.and i know where you are coming from.

[tiercel]

I do not agree with speed limiting, there are occasions where exceeding the speed limit is required to remove you from a dangerous situation (for example if you move to overtake but misjudge it and the person behind you has closed the gap you were in, you are forced to carry on passing.) If you suddenly ran out of power, you will be left with nowhere to go.

 

If the car was limited, then you would not be tempted to overtake in the first place.

 

 

Part of the reason a lot of acidents are fatal is the young drivers canot afford to insure larger vehicles and are therfore driving older small engined cars

 

If they can inflict that sort of damage with a Fiesta what the hell would they do with a powerful car?

 

I have made comment on those two quotes.

Truthfully I think that no matter what your background, there is always someone that thinks he / she is Hanna Mikkola. It will never change and that is why we will always hear about the tragedies and not the majority of good young drivers.

 

 

TC

[Big_Sam]

One way to get them to drive more slowly is to take the windscreen out.

 

Driving open style at 60mph is quite memorable.......

[Pushkin]

I believe there are fewer low powered motorcycle accidents since the inception of the limited CC for age and experience style licensing laws - but would accept this was wrong if one of you could show me statistics to say differently?

 

If this is factual, then surely that shows where we need to go in helping people to save themselves. A legally enforced system of having to show the letter P for still in the first year of a new licence or N for Novice would go a good distance towards helping slow folks down - to heck with the image thing - better alive than dead!

 

Also, a free method of limiting all engine capacities/power for those who are in that category - supplied, fitted and monitored by the Government and incorporating some kind of tamper proof seal so that it is evident if the Police stop you to check - if you have tried to alter things. We already pay more than enough in taxes to cover the cost of this. This device would be something that could be adjustable to open up more power the better your driving is judged to be (See below).

 

Far too often the problems for young folks are the fact that a) they can easily modify engines, they can easily buy a powerful car without having to show they can handle it c) the increased insurance costs proves we are losing the sensible "don't do this" message to young folks so all we are doing is lining the insurance companies pockets and d) you have to pay a bond each year to cover a practical test that determines what power of motor you are allowed to have your motor/power lifted to the following year - and this equates to the hungrier you are for more power the more you pay.

 

Bring on the bleeding heart liberals amongst you. :o

 

Pushkin

[Big_Sam]

All too often kids have just got their first car and they want to know what it does, you can hardly get away with tripping the rev limiter in a driving school car!

 

What made the difference for me was that my instructor was an ex rally driver, oh yes! :o He taught how to drive a car, how to respect what it can, and cannot do. He taught me how to drift in snow and control skids and power slides.

 

And he taught me how to hand brake turn!

 

And from that I know how easy it is to lose it on a corner, and if I do lose it how best to try and get it back under control. Too often kids are just taught to drive in the 'correct' style which does not take into account the fact that they are not going to keep driving like that once they pass their test.

 

But he also taught me the rules of the road, and taught me to respect my licence, and the fact that I would lose it if I did anything stupid.

 

And since I passed my test, a mere 3 crashes. One caused by someone overtaking me and hitting me as they passed, one caused by a diesel spill on a country road, and one when I knocked the wing mirror off (the only one that was my fault) reversing into the driveway.

 

But the problem is that my insurance don't care who was at fault, it still goes down that a 'young' driver had a crash. And thus we all get tarred with the same brush and called 'dangerous drivers who should not be allowed to drive'.

 

 

I was flying Cessnas a whole YEAR before I was allowed on a road behind the wheel of a car. How come then if all teenagers are irresponsible can one be allowed to fly a plane at 16? Yet I did safely and legally, all £120,000 worth of plane! The most expensive vehicle I will every be in control of.

 

The trend seems to be then that a young driver on their own has less accidents, yet when they have people in the car they take more risks. In that case why not set a limit of 6 months driving before they can take passengers? Or say that one of the passengers has to be over 21 and hold a full licence (like a provisional licence).

 

2p

[SidneyG]

The justice system in this country is a joke on times. When I was in colege away from home back in 1996, I got a lift with a fellow student in his mini to go into town as my car had broken down, the bloke drove like a complete *****, asked him to slow down several times, he just laughed and kept his foot in. Sure enough He lost it round a left hander, went up an embankment then rolled over and over down the road at about 80 mph. My head went out the sunroof and hit the road. Had head injuries with 40 stitches accross my head, damaged shoulder and knee, broken sternum and three broken Vertabrae in my back. Left Me paralysed.He had no serious injuries The police examined the scene and the car, He got a few hundred quid a slap on the wrist and four points. 3 of which for a defective tyre!! Turned out his car was also insured by his mother, but they'd forgotton to add his name! They let him off for this. Not posting this for sympathy, just to show how lightly offenders get away with things. He had also injured a girl in a previous accident it turns out, but I beleive that could not be used in court to predjudice the outcome but I could be wrong. Unless we get real and dish out proper punishments that fit the crimes it will carry on getting worse.Many young drivers dont seem to have any fear of getting into trouble, back in my day (not that long ago!) :o If our local country copper caught you driving like a ****, chances are he would ruff you up the first time. He was a big scary bloke! It did the trick!

[Big_Sam]

Sorry to hear that Sidney, some people are just total *********.

[SidneyG]

****s hapens mate, long time ago, not an issue to me any more,as I said not looking for sypathy or giving a sob story but just illustrates well the stupid state this country has got into. Id probably get more for that If a camera caught me doing 90 cruising up a deserted motorway in perfect conditions at night. Laws are only as good as the fear of the punishments that go with them. :o

Edited March 14, 2008 by SidneyG

[Pushkin]

Sid G, sorry to hear that you are one of the statisitics to come out of young folks reckless driving. (respect mate).

 

I agree that it seems more prevalent when the person has passengers and that is why i say motors should be goverened as to their output - until a period of time has passed to allow you to get used to driving on your own and then with passengers and being able to show you can handle the power available - only then can you move up a power band. But you can instantly be brought down a power band if you have an accident and lose your bounty.

 

 

Pushkin. :o