pigeon master Posted November 20, 2004 Report Share Posted November 20, 2004 Hello guys, Well its all gone pear shaped with Amber, “just my luck” my first pheasant drive with Amber as mentioned in a previous post has gone to the rats on the second. The day started with me tying the dog in the back of a pick up truck while I went for a cuppa with the shoot organizer, after a few minutes I thought I’ll check on the dog through the window and all I could see was the lead over the edge of the pick up. I flew out of the house half expecting to find my dog hanging dead; luckily the lead was long enough for her feet to touch the floor. “ A very big lesson learned” never do that again. :*) Well she made me pay for it because she didn’t listen to me all day after that and I struggled to even call her in. I guess I’ve had my first lesson of thinking your dog is doing great then it all changes. I must admit after last week she’s had no whistle training until today so I’ve paid the price, I didn’t realise how quick these dogs forget simple commands. The dogs that were getting judged were something special when on retrieves, something to aim at in the future me thinks. Well I thought I would just let you all know that this dog of mine seems to have hit her teenage years within a week. Some things never go as planned do they. The PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyni Posted November 20, 2004 Report Share Posted November 20, 2004 Toooo much tooooo soon me thinks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vermin Dropper Posted November 21, 2004 Report Share Posted November 21, 2004 Toooo much tooooo soon me thinks I'm sure that makes PM feel better..........Not PM, just take it easy mate, I'm sure she'll come good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lurcherboy Posted November 21, 2004 Report Share Posted November 21, 2004 PM, Join the parenthood class sunbeam. Seriously, thats curs for you, dont give up on your baby yet. It will happen lots of times in the future. LB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted November 21, 2004 Report Share Posted November 21, 2004 I agree with jonnyni, "too much too soon". Thats not being negative, thats just stating an honest opinion based on experience. 6 months old is too young to take an ESS beating on a pheasant shoot. Many a dog has been spoiled by being rushed. Back to basics and take your time, good luck, the best is yet to come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browning Posted November 22, 2004 Report Share Posted November 22, 2004 I'm with Jonnyni & Cranfield here, too young to be on beating line, but given time I'm sure you'll get her back PM. Best of luck with her. One other thing, by way of a warning to other dog owners, a pal of mine a few years back tied his Jack Russell up in the back of his pickup, the dog jumped/slipped/fell over the side and hanged himself. A very unfortunate accident that could have been avoided. :( Please beware about where and how dogs are tied up if being left on their own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeon master Posted November 22, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2004 Cheers Vermin Dropper, you got that spot on mate. Come on guys, too much too soon? What is the difference between taking your dog for a walk through the fields and woods and going beating with your dog. Theres no difference apart from gun fire in the next fields. If I take my dog through the woods she is following sents and searching the undergrowth, surely you dont have to wait untill the dogs 18 months before you let her do that. She isnt behind the gun line doing retrieves she's running through the fields enjoying her self. I'm sure we all know what our dogs are capable of and its about taking advice from people and making your own choices, she had a bad day thats all so I dont think I need to go back to basics as she is already only doing the basics. I'm not saying I'm not listening to what your saying as I take in all information from many sources but I spend a lot of time with this dog and train her most days so from my point of view she just got a little excited but all is fine. Thanks for your views The PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyni Posted November 22, 2004 Report Share Posted November 22, 2004 Pigeon Master, Go to this web site and ask the question there, the replies/advise you will get will be for your benefit and your dogs. These people are professional gundog/dog trainers and will help. (I not saying the regular gundog boys on here can't help but its just somewhere else to get an opinion) Gundog training forum Bad habits can be a bitch of a thing to correct trust me I know :*) When I said too much too soon i should have elaborated. I think its too much excitement for a 6 month old dog to take in and expect to be under control. You could be undoing all the good work you have done by letting her run about a pheasant shoot. Sorry about the blunt reply the last time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted November 22, 2004 Report Share Posted November 22, 2004 PM, nobody is dictating to you, or being critical, its your dog and you must (and will) do what you want with her. Having owned two of the best ESS bitches born, I can appreciate the pleasure and pride you have in your dog and you have many years of fun ahead of you, just don't rush it. The differences between taking the dog for a walk through the fields and woods, when naturally she "works" and being on a beating line, are CONTROL and DISTRACTIONS. By your own admission she lacked control and the reason was, the distractions. The dog is innocent, give her time. :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeon master Posted November 22, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2004 Hello Guys, point taken. I think it was the short reply that raised a few hairs on the back of the neck but like I've said it's my first dog and I only took her last week because she was responding to all my commands. This time things were a little different and I didnt have the control that I had the week before so it through me a little as to why she would act like this but she is very young and still only a pup. I think I'll rethink my next steps with her as I wouldnt want her to get used to ignoring me everytime we go out as thats no way to go. Thanks once again for your responce as all comments are very welcome. The PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugene molloy Posted November 22, 2004 Report Share Posted November 22, 2004 PM, surely you dont have to wait untill the dogs 18 months before you let her do that. Yupp. And a lot longer if the dog needs it. In ESS I've trained myself (as opposed to bought in) I try and avoid beating at all in the first working season. I just shoot over the dog myself a couple of times and do a lot of picking up. Beating is the first and fastest way to render a springer out of control (but you've found that out already!) JonnyNI's advice to get on the Gundog Forum is sound, in particular Jegy and Molly are very helpful. Nil Carborundum! Eug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeon master Posted November 27, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2004 My little Amber was out again today beating and she is back on song, she just had a bad day I think last week after nearlly getting choked but she has forgiven me now and did me prowd again today. I was walking with the gun on the beating line and taking any birds that went back over, this was the first time Amber has encountered fire behind her and it didnt phase her one bit. Lots a rabbits about on the drive and she has developed a whine when she is on the scent of one which is great as this allows me to call her off any but she did have fun chasing a few before I did. Sorry guys but I couldnt stop Amber from working on the beating line because I'm convinced that she will be a better dog for it when she gets to 18 months. There are a few dogs on the drives and all were beating before 8 months i'm told, all these dogs are spot on and are very good at retrieving or working the cover. So all you guys who are adament of waiting, I say give your dog a chance first then gauge if your rushing your dog or not. The PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ollie Posted November 28, 2004 Report Share Posted November 28, 2004 well said P.M. I'm glad the dog is back working well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PEREGRINE Posted November 29, 2004 Report Share Posted November 29, 2004 I'm very pleased for you PM but it would be interesting if when she is 18 months old you could give us all an update and let us know if she is truly a better dog for this early start! Peregrine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeon master Posted November 29, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 29, 2004 I'll do that Peregrine because I think I've given my Amber enough praise now. I know I keep going on about her lads but its because I'm a very happy chappy with my first gun dog thats all. I will keep you updated with her progress, but it would be interesting to see the difference between a dog that has worked for 12 months more than a dog that has waited untill 18 months old. I think there would be no contest to be honest, but I may be eating my hat in 12 months. :thumbs: Hope not though. The PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren m Posted November 29, 2004 Report Share Posted November 29, 2004 Nice one PM -- i think i'll trade Jack(lab) in for a spaniel , they just seem so much more successful on here . its not fair :thumbs: . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ollie Posted November 29, 2004 Report Share Posted November 29, 2004 Nice one PM -- i think i'll trade Jack(lab) in for a spaniel , they just seem so much more successful on here . its not fair :thumbs: . A spaniel is more difficult to train than a labrador. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeon master Posted November 29, 2004 Author Report Share Posted November 29, 2004 Darren, I'm sure he is OK. I bet you wouldnt change him for the world, think if you had a dog that didnt give a toss or did'nt show willing to get in there then you would be worried. I think I've been lucky with Amber but I do spend all my time with her barring when she gets her head down so that must have something to do with it, also some good tips from the dog people on this forum, but its important to do what you think is right for your dog and only select from other people what works for you. I have Amber searching cover for frozen dead pigeons which she finds and brings them back to me and lets go on command, she has been doing this for some time now but it was madspringer who said that the weight of the frozen birds could make her hard mouthed. That makes good sense to me and I now only use fresh birds, I check the meat after a few retrieves and have already found she is putting less pressure on the birds.. Very good advice which has saved a bad habit. Give it a try, just make sure he dont see where you put it and drag it a few yards across the grass for a scent trail, then hide it. Loads of treats after a find. The PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren m Posted November 29, 2004 Report Share Posted November 29, 2004 he's ok at retrieving dead game , its more a case of steadiness around live game thats the problem , he gets so intense and excited and as ran in a few times , thats why i,ve not took him for a couple of weeks , i need to try and cure this problem , that and keeping is attention on me , rather than every thing else. some days he does it just right , and others he's a total ***. i took him to the clay shoot on sunday and was working away from the guns , just retrieving some dummies and he was working great , BUTas soon as some one started to watch what i was doing he started to **** around , making me look a total **** . Ah well , i,m sure he's worth it :thumbs: not!!!. Darren ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PEREGRINE Posted November 30, 2004 Report Share Posted November 30, 2004 Nice one PM -- i think i'll trade Jack(lab) in for a spaniel , they just seem so much more successful on here . its not fair you obviously havent met my spaniel Darren :thumbs: Peregrine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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