Could Britain ever be Great Again

[Harnser]

Mungler ,

How much thought went into the blowing up of hundreds of people in this country by muslim extreamist .were they thinking about how much pain and sorrow they would cause .Dont you think that if they had the majority vote in this country (which incidently is their altermate aim ) they would be looking to deport us all some where or worse . I ncidently the the failed attempt at blowing up glasgow airport was perpertrated by doctors . Any how ,Hows the disco . Harnser .

[Taff Mason]

the the failed attempt at blowing up glasgow airport was perpertrated by doctors . Harnser .

 

that was a major shock to me. i was expecting another attack sooner or later, but you don't think profesional people (especially doctors) would do things like that. it just goes to show how deep these terrorist cells operate.

[Mungler]

Mungler ,

How much thought went into the blowing up of hundreds of people in this country by muslim extreamist .were they thinking about how much pain and sorrow they would cause .Dont you think that if they had the majority vote in this country (which incidently is their altermate aim ) they would be looking to deport us all some where or worse . I ncidently the the failed attempt at blowing up glasgow airport was perpertrated by doctors . Any how ,Hows the disco . Harnser .

 

 

Indeed, I read somewhere that in the UK more people die each year choking on bic pen lids than in terror related attacks.

 

I wouldn't throw 'em all out - I quite like the Chinese.

[col s10]

seven people a year die falling off there chair backwards

[death from below]

A bit off the tangent....were we ever just Britain.......and if so when did we become officially Great Britain

[Nial]

And so this one goes round again.....

 

I think that 95% of people would welcome the return of the death penalty provided convictions could be 101% and unquestionably safe.

 

 

You don't have to that certain.

 

I think it's accepted that the murder rate has increased vastly since capital punishment was abolished, it's

been almost a straight line since then.

 

How many innocent people have died because capital punishment was abolished?

 

What do we say to their families?

 

Is it better to hang 1 innocent person a year or let 100 more people be murdered?

 

Just some food for thought.

 

 

Nial.

[bazguevara]

Is it better to hang 1 innocent person a year or let 100 more people be murdered?

 

How would you feel if that innocent person was your son or daughter? Would you be happy to tell the government 'Fair doos mate you got it it wrong, these things happen' or would you be demanding justice?

[Trussman]

You don't have to that certain.

 

I think it's accepted that the murder rate has increased vastly since capital punishment was abolished, it's

been almost a straight line since then.

 

How many innocent people have died because capital punishment was abolished?

 

What do we say to their families?

 

Is it better to hang 1 innocent person a year or let 100 more people be murdered?

 

Just some food for thought.

 

 

Nial.

 

And what if you were that 'innocent' person?

[Taff Mason]

i'd take one for the team

[dustyfox]

I say it should be as tough as possible while in prison, a few lashes on there back to make them remember that if the do the crime they will get punished.

[Mungler]

Anyone see the documentary about the last two hangmen to work in England? Both pub landlords by day and hangmen in their spare time.

 

One packed it in after 40 years on the job because he realised his work made no difference - no matter how many he strung up people would still commit appalling crimes.

 

Whilst you can prove anything with statistics you will probably find that the murder rate has increased at the same rate as population has increased, or should that be increased at the same rate as immigration

 

The problem with the "you have to break eggs to make omelettes approach" to capital punishment is that the figure will be higher than 1 in 100 being innocent and being happy with the one innocent is all fine unless it happens to be you, someone in your family or your best friend.

 

I think there is room for the odd exception who should get the long drop; the Wests, Sutcliffe, Shipman, Hindley and Bradey etc, however, the argument is that hanging them would not serve as a deterrent - they were each to a man (and woman) mentalists, and mentalists will continue to be mentalists regardless of the capital consequences. Mind you, I would sanction it from an economic point of view in that I fail to see why tax payers should pay for their keep in prison for the rest of their lives.

[MR.LAG]

I agree with dusty quite a bit actually.

As im only 16 and i used to be one of those little chavs in thier hoodies and trackies, and the chavs these days will jump you and give you a good kicking for what... looking in their direction, as i found out the hard way with three 17 year olds kicking the **** of me(But as the old saying goes "what comes around goes around" served its purpose).

 

There will be some way that we can stop and prevent further mindless attacks for very petty reasons.

But not with that bloody tool Gordon Brown at the helm of britain.

Edited November 12, 2008 by Axe
Swearing

[col s10]

I agree with dusty quite a bit actually.

As im only 16 and i used to be one of those little chavs in thier hoodies and trackies, and the chavs these days will jump you and give you a good kicking for what... looking in their direction, as i found out the hard way with three 17 year olds kicking the **** of me(But as the old saying goes "what comes around goes around" served its purpose).

 

There will be some way that we can stop and prevent further mindless attacks for very petty reasons.

But not with that bloody tool Gordon Brown at the helm of britain.

so when and why did you see the light

[tractorboy]

And so this one goes round again.....

 

I think that 95% of people would welcome the return of the death penalty provided convictions could be 101% and unquestionably safe. They are miles off that right now and so I would not vote for it's return.

 

ditto mungler

so now can we close this thread before harnser gets back on his shed roof !!!!!

[Harnser]

Tractor boy ,

There is nothing wrong with shedding and collecting old toot as was proved on an earlier shedding thread . Did i ever tell you all about the day that i accidently came across an old wroxham 10x6 (not the more common 8x6 ) shingle clad all weather allotment shed . If there is enough interest i will relate the whole storey to you . Harnser .

[Jonno243]

If dusty stood for parliament he would get my vote and many many more . Being a realist and patriot and having a view on imigration thats not the same as the bleeding heart liberals dos not make you a racist . Harnser .

 

Harnser,

 

You misunderstand, at no point in my post do I make reference to racism. Furthermore, I would defend to my death the right of anyone to express their views and/or opinions; however the implied statement that immigration is the root cause of the majority of crime in this country is poorly thought out and dangerously misleading, down that path leads to all sorts of misery.

 

I personnaly believe that the policies of successive British governments have been too liberal regarding numerous issues, leading to the inevitable, and to be honest ridiculous, PC nanny state that we live in today.

 

To bring the thread back on track.......I would like to say that yes, corporal punishment should be brought back; but I would be mortified to think that an innocent person could be convicted and hanged. Much better I think to have a prison service that has punishment as its primary goal, with rehabilitation a very distant second. Take away the "easy-street" image that prison has nowadays and make the criminal scum ****-scared of being sent there and I think that you would go a long way towards lowering opportunistic crime.

 

Just my tuppence worth.

[malkiserow]

Rather than just focusing on punishment, if we want Britain to be great again, aren't there other things what would be high on the list as well such as manners, respect including elders, freedom of speech, for each other, for other peoples property etc. A sense of community, common sense and upright trustworthy politicians, a fair and respected judicial system. An education system that actually produces a good all-round education and good new citizens. Valuing areas such as the arts, poets, artists, scientists, engineers, all healthcare workers, the forces, workers in the emergency services and teachers - more than - quaffed sportsmen, "celebrities", WAGS and bejeweled singers. Shouldn't we shake up the journalists who take elements of "stories" that is often based on information from a PR manchine and publish what ends up as utter utter rubbish (eg the Jersey "murders") ??:(?

 

Or am I just on my own with this?

 

P.S. This is not a rant

[tractorboy]

Rather than just focusing on punishment, if we want Britain to be great again, aren't there other things what would be high on the list as well such as manners, respect including elders, freedom of speech, for each other, for other peoples property etc. A sense of community, common sense and upright trustworthy politicians, a fair and respected judicial system. An education system that actually produces a good all-round education and good new citizens. Valuing areas such as the arts, poets, artists, scientists, engineers, all healthcare workers, the forces, workers in the emergency services and teachers - more than - quaffed sportsmen, "celebrities", WAGS and bejeweled singers. Shouldn't we shake up the journalists who take elements of "stories" that is often based on information from a PR manchine and publish what ends up as utter utter rubbish (eg the Jersey "murders") ?:(??

 

Or am I just on my own with this?

 

P.S. This is not a rant

 

 

no your not your own its fair point

[dustyfox]

Harnser,

 

You misunderstand, at no point in my post do I make reference to racism. Furthermore, I would defend to my death the right of anyone to express their views and/or opinions; however the implied statement that immigration is the root cause of the majority of crime in this country is poorly thought out and dangerously misleading, down that path leads to all sorts of misery.

 

 

 

 

Just my tuppence worth.

 

Im not just blaming immigration I said that this country is getting overcrowded and thats why crime is rising, and so immigration does come into it. You put thousands of people into a small area your bound to get more crime and as you squash more and more people in the higher the crime. I am not just blaming immigration I am blaming the government for not planning for the long term future. Build a high rise tower here and there and that will do etc. People like there own space.

[myzeneye]

i agree, prison is NO deterrent, it should be a place of dread, which people fear going to.... lock up, hard labour, no luxuries what so ever... a cell. boredom, a place to reflect upon the bad descisions youve made... regret, and learn from your mistakes...but most importantly, NEVER want to return to.

i work for the council as a heating engineer, i go i peoples houses every day, believe me, so of the alch'ies and smack heads would have better living standards in the nick !

no rent, a decent room with a buddy or two to have a laugh with, 3 meals a day plus tuck shop... gym, games, socialising, play stations and not to mention its easier to get hold of drugs in the nick then it is on the street ! open prisons holidays and rewards etc.... im all for rehabilitation, but educating people doesnt mean they have to get an easy ride.....

we all know the lefties have ruined this country, the media often admits its all gone too far, yet it still goes on, no one listens

 

im not sure if there is one single cause, abuse of the immigration system, religious issues, home grown hoodlums etc.... but the point is, they all contribute to the sad situation were in.

 

what we need is for some of the people who supposedly, represent "the people", to get some back bone..... stand up for the rights of the law abiding citizens, stand up for the tax paying citzens, stand up for the british poeple and fear less the implications of "offending" others or tredding on some ones "human rights"....

but, the lefties have made the way society thinks unable to accept these qualities... to have an opinion like this brands you as a rascist or a right wing radical of some kind.... and no one, sadly, has the balls to stand up to these people....

 

we all know whats wrong, yet no one does anything about it.....

 

whether it be over race, rights or morals...... rivers of blood people, rivers of blood.

[Jonno243]

Im not just blaming immigration I said that this country is getting overcrowded and thats why crime is rising, and so immigration does come into it. You put thousands of people into a small area your bound to get more crime and as you squash more and more people in the higher the crime. I am not just blaming immigration I am blaming the government for not planning for the long term future. Build a high rise tower here and there and that will do etc. People like there own space.

 

In that case mate I offer my apologies for a rather inflamed response to your initial post, I misunderstood your statement.

 

 

Rather than just focusing on punishment, if we want Britain to be great again, aren't there other things what would be high on the list as well such as manners, respect including elders, freedom of speech, for each other, for other peoples property etc. A sense of community, common sense and upright trustworthy politicians, a fair and respected judicial system. An education system that actually produces a good all-round education and good new citizens. Valuing areas such as the arts, poets, artists, scientists, engineers, all healthcare workers, the forces, workers in the emergency services and teachers - more than - quaffed sportsmen, "celebrities", WAGS and bejeweled singers. Shouldn't we shake up the journalists who take elements of "stories" that is often based on information from a PR manchine and publish what ends up as utter utter rubbish (eg the Jersey "murders")

 

As for the above, it is one of the most astute statements I have read for a long time. I agree with every single point you raise

[myzeneye]

 

here here....

[Miroku Mike]

Well this certainly made for interesting reading.

 

Obviously to reinstate something of this magnitude would be impossible in these troubled days.

But I think with alot of the troubles that seem to occur nowadays, a bit of the old school management would stop a whole lot of the **** we keep hearing about. Imagine how many young lads and girls in these so called gangs, carrying knives around with them would actually use them, especially if they had seen a few pair of legs hanging from the gallows. Major deterant I feel, the realisation that you would actually Die for taking someone elses life. Yes it would have to be proven 100% you were guilty. This goes for any murders.

I can see peoples point of view, the way things currently stand, where people take the law into there own hands. God forbid, but if anything happenend to my loved ones I would happily be held responsible for my actions, cause to think they were sat around playing on a playstation or watching tv would kill me. If on the other hand they received the same as they dished out, it would suit me and most of the nation just fine.

Lets be really honest, things do need to change. Where severe crimes warrant severe punishment. All joking aside, if you were to steal money from the state, they throw the book at you. Kill someone mess someones life up and your out in not that long.

Immigration is another matter, rightly stated earlier, if you cram this little country to the brim of course there will be more crime. But if the law stated any crime committed meant deportation, things would certainly change.

To all the youngsters out there who are good kids. Hats off to ya. I was not refering to all the younger generation when i was refering to national service. Three strike rule for all the troublesome youth, if they cant curb there own behavior then the goverment should. All those getting on with there life, good on em.

 

Well something on the lines of the above, I personally think would surly make a difference.

[Jonno243]

Well this certainly made for interesting reading.

 

Obviously to reinstate something of this magnitude would be impossible in these troubled days.

But I think with alot of the troubles that seem to occur nowadays, a bit of the old school management would stop a whole lot of the **** we keep hearing about. Imagine how many young lads and girls in these so called gangs, carrying knives around with them would actually use them, especially if they had seen a few pair of legs hanging from the gallows. Major deterant I feel, the realisation that you would actually Die for taking someone elses life. Yes it would have to be proven 100% you were guilty. This goes for any murders.

I can see peoples point of view, the way things currently stand, where people take the law into there own hands. God forbid, but if anything happenend to my loved ones I would happily be held responsible for my actions, cause to think they were sat around playing on a playstation or watching tv would kill me. If on the other hand they received the same as they dished out, it would suit me and most of the nation just fine.

Lets be really honest, things do need to change. Where severe crimes warrant severe punishment. All joking aside, if you were to steal money from the state, they throw the book at you. Kill someone mess someones life up and your out in not that long.

Immigration is another matter, rightly stated earlier, if you cram this little country to the brim of course there will be more crime. But if the law stated any crime committed meant deportation, things would certainly change.

To all the youngsters out there who are good kids. Hats off to ya. I was not refering to all the younger generation when i was refering to national service. Three strike rule for all the troublesome youth, if they cant curb there own behavior then the goverment should. All those getting on with there life, good on em.

 

Well something on the lines of the above, I personally think would surly make a difference.

 

Absolutely right, 100%.

[Maiden22]

.

Edited November 18, 2008 by Maiden22