Shotgun Barrel transport - Legal Question

[HDAV]

I really cannot understand where the problem lies, if you think that I am giving incorrect information on a web site why not give your own Police force firearms dept. a call.

 

The Police do not make laws, Parliament does and the Police uphold them. But some Police forces may want to put section two barrels on a shotgun certificate to suit themselves when it is not a legal requirement.

 

Some posters on here seem to like disputing facts, the last post off HDAV appertains to firearms not shotguns.

 

You lot can argue amongst yourselves if you want I am fed up of trying to talk sense when the other parties do not know what they are talking about.

Sorry blaser i forgot reference Chapter 2 of the guidance:

 

http://tna.europarchive.org/20100419081706/http://police.homeoffice.gov.uk/publications/operational-policing/HO-Firearms-Guidance2835.pdf?view=Binary

 

2.1 This Chapter provides definitions of

firearms, shot guns, deactivated firearms,

readily convertible replica firearms and some

information on antiques (which are covered

more fully in Chapter 8) and firearms

conversion. It goes on to define various types

of firearms and ammunition for which no

certificate is required, including certain types

of air weapons.

2.2 The definitions of “firearm”, “shot gun”

and “ammunition” for the purposes of the

1968 Act (as amended) are given in section

57 of the Act and are set out below. The

definition of “firearm” extends to certain

imitation firearms (see paragraph 2.17 below).

2.3 “Firearm” means a lethal barrelled

weapon of any description from which

any shot, bullet or other missile can be

discharged, and includes any prohibited

weapon, whether it is such a lethal weapon

or not, any component part (see paragraphs

13.69 and 13.70) of such a lethal or

prohibited weapon, and any accessory to

any such weapon designed or adapted to

diminish the noise or flash caused by

firing the weapon. Lethality is a complex

 

13.69 and 13.70 referenced previously above

 

My none professional intreptation is that a shotgun is a subsection classification, all shotguns are firearms, not all firearms are shotguns etc Firearms covers Section 1, 2,5 etc (7?) only sub 12ft/lbs air weapons are not firearms for the purposes of the act?

 

While this is an interesting debate as i and others have stated get clarification from both FLO/POLICE and RFD. I know when i dropped my stock and fore end off for refinishing (i was given the barrels to take away) they were entered on the RFD's register for which he needed my certificate.

Edited December 14, 2010 by HDAV

[BlaserF3]

I know when i dropped my stock and fore end off for refinishing (i was given the barrels to take away) they were entered on the RFD's register for which he needed my certificate.

 

You must be joking spare stocks and fore ends are readily available off ticket, you must have left the receiver attached to the stock then.

[HDAV]

You must be joking spare stocks and fore ends are readily available off ticket, you must have left the receiver attached to the stock then.

It was complete with receiver, obviously the wood bit is just the wood bit. and just a bit of wood..... until you screw it to the receiver..... fore ends with metal work are component parts....

IF you can't post a stock with receiver attached how can you a barrel with breach?

[BlaserF3]

It's not a breech, it's a chamber, it becomes a breech when the barrels are closed on the receiver.

[HDAV]

It's not a breech, it's a chamber, it becomes a breech when the barrels are closed on the receiver.

Dictionary.com disagrees http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/breech

So do others http://oxforddictionaries.com/view/entry/m_en_gb0100780#m_en_gb0100780

 

I'll stop being a pedant now and leave this alone. A good reason for streamlining firearms law in the UK

[spiceychilli57]

All opinions and my own experiences considered, i still wouldnt take the risk of dropping yourself in the **** and make arrangements to take it there yourself the gunsmith may require cert no. just to keep on his own records or to cover his own back

 

Spicer

[palombier]

Blaser F3

 

Just like to add my support to your assessment of the facts. You are 100% correct in your interpretation of the law.

 

Regards

 

P

[gsm1968]

Interesting all the replies. I don't know the answer to the question. I would be cautious of any part that has a proof mark on it, only because of the situation with on/off ticket mod's.

 

:unsure: :unsure:

 

 

Another thread I commented on got some interesting replies from forum members as I commented about not knowing the law "inside out", and this thread just proves how much of a grey area it can be to a lot of shooters. And that was started as a result of someone asking advice.

 

I look forward to the final outcome

 

 

Here's the link to the other thread:

 

http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/144967-slating-off-other-members/page__st__40

[BlaserF3]

Blaser F3

 

Just like to add my support to your assessment of the facts. You are 100% correct in your interpretation of the law.

 

Regards

 

P

 

Thank you all who say that I interpret the law correctly, I would not dream of giving incorrect information to any one.

[Vince Green]

Its clearly a grey area. I would take the view that its very unlikely anything bad would come of it and even if it did, taking the extreme view, where is the intent?

[al4x]

has it been mended and returned already Gary? as that would put this to bed

 

p.s no truth to the rumour you'd had enough sloe gin to not remember denting it

Edited December 15, 2010 by al4x

[welshwarrior]

I read it like Blazer but would now check with my FEO as it's obviously a very grey area.

[BlaserF3]

Last year I rang my local Firearms Licensing Department asked for a Mrs A Jackson who is in charge up here, about spare barrels for shotguns and if they needed to be on your SGC.

 

The reply was, "Some Police Forces want them on your SGC but we "Cumbria" do not find it necessary as it is not a legal requirement".

 

If you want a definite answer why not ring your local department and ask the question to the person in charge?

 

Or is this too hard to do?

[garyb]

Finally got round to sending my FLD an email..

 

Will see what they say...

[Beardo]

talking of which - i see Greg no longer covers us?

[garyb]

Hence why I didn't bother to phone them

[Beardo]

real shame. oh well.

[garyb]

And their reply....

 

Dear Mr Smith

 

Thank you for your enquiry.

It is not an offence for a non certificate holder to possess a section 2 shotgun barrel. However I would suggest that it was a situation to be avoided if possible. I am sure that some dealers would have issues taking it in and I would urge you to check with them first before arranging for it to be transported in that way.

I am certain that no dealer would be prepared to release it back to a non certificate holder following the repair.

This would not be the case if it were a section 1 weapon where the legislation refers to component parts and therefore would not be permitted.

In conclusion I would suggest it would be more desirable to convey the part yourself but as I say if you decide to go down the other route I would clear it with your dealer first.

 

Yours

 

PC Plod

[al4x]

blimey its taken longer to find that out than to just drive to Radlett

[HDAV]

This would not be the case if it were a section 1 weapon where the legislation refers to component parts and therefore would not be permitted.

In conclusion I would suggest it would be more desirable to convey the part yourself but as I say if you decide to go down the other route I would clear it with your dealer first.

Interesting thankyou, for posting the Reply Garyb, seems my interpretation is not that of your FLO. BLaser seems you were correct all along chap.

[garyb]

That does beg another question

 

As I know a well known and respected gunsmith, who will take rifle barrel's via post (non RFD) for screwcutting

[BlaserF3]

I would ring the RFD where you want your mate to take your barrels to, explain what's going on, take a photocopy of your SGC give that to the bloke that's taking the barrels with a covering letter signed by you.

 

He can also bring back some cartridges at the same time.

[BlaserF3]

That does beg another question

 

As I know a well known and respected gunsmith, who will take rifle barrel's via post (non RFD) for screwcutting

 

There's an old saying "What "they" don't know does not hurt them".

[Breastman]

So it's technically legal but not recommended?? Nothing like getting a solid committed definitive answer then!

 

Mark

[al4x]

So it's technically legal but not recommended?? Nothing like getting a solid committed definitive answer then!

 

Mark

 

Sounds like a BASC response

 

 

you've got to love firearms law