Dirty Harry Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 He also said the owner was nowhere to be seen but the woman said her husband was just yards away from the dogs when they were shot! I suggest the farmer might not have shot them if they were. The woman winged on for ages about the fact the dogs were covered in blood, her husband had to bring them back in a wheelbarrow and dig a grave for them blah blah blah. What the hell does she expect? Maybe she will keep her other dogs on a lead from now on or walk them somewhere else. Harry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeds chimp Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 He also said the owner was nowhere to be seen but the woman said her husband was just yards away from the dogs when they were shot! I suggest the farmer might not have shot them if they were. The woman winged on for ages about the fact the dogs were covered in blood, her husband had to bring them back in a wheelbarrow and dig a grave for them blah blah blah. What the hell does she expect? Maybe she will keep her other dogs on a lead from now on or walk them somewhere else. Harry we have a black lab and whenever i take him out he is on a lead...unless i know the area and know now livestock etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenBhoy Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 saw this on local news. took place in next village on from where i have my permission. the dogs were lurchers, from what i saw on news i'd say they were too big to be whippet cross ones though, grey's i think. 3 of them and farmer said if he'd had more than two carts on him then the 3rd dog would be dead too. as has been said, law doesn't state you have to keep dog on lead, though some farmers do ask for it, but do have to be under complete control. i dont want to be seen to be a typical farmer/shooting type (as antis love to pigeonhole us) but when i watched the woman on the tv she really is as you'd imagine, head in the clouds about how rural life is, bit of a tree hugger type. was talking about it down local last night and few people (mainly women) saying it was too extreme, bit harsh. but two cows already aborted, this is the mans livelihood thats at stake. you cant afford to lose £1,600 every time some townie-to-country idiot lets their untrained dogs loose. it is sad that two dogs had to die due to her ignorrance, but hopefully it'll be a wake up call to dog owners up and down the country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little_Dom Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 i've seen first hand what dogs can do to livestock after finding a sheep ripped to bits with the dog standing over it so anyone who wants the law changed shold be made to see what could happen if a dog gets among livestock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soontjen Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 some arrogant people fail to respect that the land is actualy the farmer's property . back yard if you like and think they have a right. why do they think the farmer would like them on the land with the dog's doing what ever they want eg chasing or killing animals ect i wonder if these dog's had killed on his land they would have been round the farm house paying for his stock . i bet the people involved would love the farmer to run his sheep / cow's / pigs across there property on a regular basis to empty there self's and run riot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenBhoy Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 some arrogant people fail to respect that the land is actualy the farmer's property . back yard if you like and think they have a right. why do they think the farmer would like them on the land with the dog's doing what ever they want eg chasing or killing animals ect i wonder if these dog's had killed on his land they would have been round the farm house paying for his stock . i bet the people involved would love the farmer to run his sheep / cow's / pigs across there property on a regular basis to empty there self's and run riot for all intents and purposes they have killed - two calves which aborted. makes me so mad the way people treat farmland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul1966 Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 you can watch the tv news article here until this evening- http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b0160z8j/East_Midlands_Today_21_10_2011/ its about 1 minute in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gav912 Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 We do occasionally have problems at the farm I work on with incomers/tourists who decide to walk dogs/kids in our meadows during the summer. We run a herd of Limousin cross cattle all with calves at foot between March and late October, anyone who knows anything about this breed on here will know that they can be more than a little bit flighty. The three of us who work on the farm have had to exit fields and sheds rapidly in the past when we've tried to get near a calf and mum has seen us. Both myself and my boss are dog owners and we will not take them into the meadows, or if we do have to they will be off the lead and at foot at least that way if the cow takes a dislike we stand more chance of getting away. People think that the cows are big cute fluffy soft animals but truth is they are extremely dangerous, anyone who doesn't believe me can come and watch us wean the calves from their mothers Monday :blink: I did have an arguement with a dog walker where I used to work, a local lady who was walking well off the footpath with her terrier off the lead charging through the game cover beside her. She told me she could walk her dog where she liked, the owner of the farm could go do one as she didn't scare her (she scared everyone else) and that I had no right to speak to her about it....my parting comment was along the lines of don't blame me when your dog gets a .22 bullet in it if the game keeper see's it. On a sporting estate the pheasants are the equivelant to a farmers livestock so they will be protected in the same way. When the owner heard about it, the lady in questioned complained to her daughter about me who worked for the owner, she got a reply she wasn't expecting along the lines of keep off my ******* fields and that what I said was right Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyprus grandad Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 i,m wondering how well it would go down if the farmer brought a couple of his prize bulls into the dog owners back garden and left them there for an hour or two to play with their dogs. paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrispti Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 farmer styles was on , defending his actions and quiet right to , the stupid dog owner whined on about how he had no right , a phone call from a tree hugger who i think lives in a bed sit in central london and never seen a tree and numerous txts saying they support farmer . there was a couple of calls from tuff guys who just wanted to sound hard on the radio , about how the farmer wouldnt dare shoot their dogs . his show does have some good points , but it gets me some funny looks whilst i shout at stupid people on the radio . i listened to it, one person who rang in said "if he shot my dog i would have shot him" a few were on the farmers side and rightly so , it was not the first time ,they were letting them roam the fields all the time and the farmer had asked them to keep there dogs under control many times ,which they ignored ,so he sorted it lawfully ,when he shot them the owners were no where to be seen and by the time they arrived he was already in conversation with the police informing them of his actions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 I'm sure shooting the dogs was the last thing the farmer wanted to do, but when you're making losses of that kind of money something has to give. The owners should have known better and that's that. I'm under instruction to shoot any dog that is worrying the sheep on one area I shoot. In fact the exact words of the farmer when I questioned it were "I don't care about the owner - if you see my dog chasing sheep you will bloody well shoot him and not give it a second thought!" :o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poontang Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 ....with her terrier off the lead charging through the game cover my parting comment was along the lines of don't blame me when your dog gets a .22 bullet in it if the game keeper see's it. On a sporting estate the pheasants are the equivelant to a farmers livestock so they will be protected in the same way. I think the gamekeeper would find himself in a bit of bother for shooting a dog in those circumstances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gav912 Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Not when there's a release pen adjoining it full of pheasants. It was unheard of for our keeper at that time to do such a thing with dogs but the threat was always used by his instruction, one of the neighbouring keepers however and it would be a different story Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coolhead Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 I think the gamekeeper would find himself in a bit of bother for shooting a dog in those circumstances. Poontang is right. Not only is that a firearms offence but; Quote “livestock” means cattle, sheep, goats, swine, horses, or poultry, and for the purposes of this definition “cattle” means bulls, cows, oxen, heifers or calves, “horses” includes ***** and mules, and “poultry” means domestic fowls, turkeys, geese or ducks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 (edited) Dogs will chase other animals, its in their nature. No malice on their part, they just believe its fun. Misguided owhers are the problem, they don't see it for what it is. But if a farmer shoots a dog expect hate mail and people wanting to do you harm. Its not something a farmer should consider lightly. The real problem is this bloody right to roam where people know they can exercise their dogs on farm land where ever they choose. Never saw the sense in it. Edited October 22, 2011 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diceman Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 The real problem is this bloody right to roam where people know they can exercise their dogs on farm land where ever they choose. Never saw the sense in it. And this is the point. The "right to roam" is commonly thought to mean you can go where you fancy but in fact it is much more restrictive than that: "The Countryside and Rights of Way Act 2000 provides for recreational activities on foot such as walking, bird-watching and climbing on the 940,000 hectares of mapped areas of mountain, moor, heath land, down land and registered common land in England and Wales. But it is not is right to walk anywhere you like, this right of access on foot only applies to mapped areas." So the next time some trespasser quotes the "right to roam" as a reason to go anywhere they like on your farm, point them at the Ramblers Association website where this quote comes from and boot them off! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cant hit rabbits 123 Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 (edited) I once found a dog walker about half a mile from the nearest path, upon asking them if they were lost they said no. Just no. Then I asked what they were doing there, and imediately they said 'Right to roam' Nothing else, just barked that at me. Its so frustrating. Edited October 22, 2011 by cant hit rabbits 123 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayne78 Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 I did have an arguement with a dog walker where I used to work, a local lady who was walking well off the footpath with her terrier off the lead charging through the game cover beside her. She told me she could walk her dog where she liked Had a similar experience a month or so ago. I was giving my mate a hand feeding up on the syndicate shoot he runs when we heard two dogs barking in the woods. When we drove back along the track in the woods (well away from any footpath) we found some doris walking 2 terriers off the lead whilst chatting on her mobile and totally oblivious to the fact that her dogs were darting left and right after pheasants. My mate stopped to speak to her and ask if she was lost and was going to point her to the nearest footpath and ask her to put the dogs back on the lead but she just ignored him and carried on walking. After saying 'excuse me' about 5 times she finally stopped and shouted 'What do you want?' when he explained the situation to her and asked her to take control of her dogs he got met with 'why don't you get a life and F off' and with that off she went again, dogs running all over the place. Just after that we came across the kent police dog trainers out with their dogs and mentioned it to them asked what could be done about people like that, they said she could be charged under the wildlife act but you'd need shed loads of evidence The arrogance of this kind of person is unbelievable and no one wants to see dogs shot but when dogs are allowed to follow their natural instincts unchecked by owners I dont see what alternative farmers are left with Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Elvis Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 Dogs will chase other animals, its in their nature. No malice on their part, they just believe its fun Thats a very general statement, smaller dogs yes but bigger dogs, labs and upwards in size will get carried away and kill sheep, a chap I was talking to the other day told me his GWP killed and retrieved a Munty ion the middle of a country park in Brentwood recently....fun? I dont think so. If this farmer had encountered these dogs and made attempts to chase them off before shooting then I totally support what happenned, I probably wouldnt be so patient, especially with "lurcher" style dogs which were essentially "designed" for killing animals anyway!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coolhead Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 Do you know what the law provides for a land owner to deal with trespassing? You can ask them to leave. You can bring an injunction against repeat offenders. Well woo-smegging-hoo! This applies to residential land or commercial property like farms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pheasant Feeder Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 I frequently come across walkers who are off the footpath by a long way, sometimes with dogs. My opening gambit is usualy hello there are you lost? I've had various responses from isn't this a public footpath? - to which I give helpful directions. No - to which I reply, ok what do you want because your only reason for being up here is to be looking for me. No I know where I'm going - oh right so you've trespassed on here before then have you. I always send them back the way they have come even though sometimes they are quite close to the other end of the footpath, that way they will learn that its not worth trying to take a short cut and it educates them as to the right path to take for next time Best one courting couple in a car up a private dead end track, almost half a mile from the nearest road,(done quite well to find such a remote spot), they saw me walking down the track with the shotgun under my arm. The look of suprise on there face, lad appologised saying he was lost - I gave suitable directions to somewhere more suitable and that I'd be locking the gate on my way out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenBhoy Posted October 24, 2011 Report Share Posted October 24, 2011 (edited) Thats a very general statement, smaller dogs yes but bigger dogs, labs and upwards in size will get carried away and kill sheep, a chap I was talking to the other day told me his GWP killed and retrieved a Munty ion the middle of a country park in Brentwood recently....fun? I dont think so. If this farmer had encountered these dogs and made attempts to chase them off before shooting then I totally support what happenned, I probably wouldnt be so patient, especially with "lurcher" style dogs which were essentially "designed" for killing animals anyway!!! dont think that should make a jot of difference to be honest in deciding how many warnings the owner should be given - so a poodle you'd give the owners notice but a lurcher is fair game?? yes, i have a lurcher. she comes to work with me everyday and walks in amongst the sheep, never on lead, never a problem. soon as i see a rabbit, squirrel, fox etc (of course, she only chases the fox away, she wouldn't harm it as she knows the law... ) i say 'away' and she is off like a flash. it's up to the owners to train their dog, break it to stock or keep it on a lead. dont discriminate against a breed or type of dog. Edited October 24, 2011 by BenBhoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shotgun sam Posted October 24, 2011 Report Share Posted October 24, 2011 The farmer was right to shoot the dogs He should also bill them for the aborted calfs and cartridges used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpha Mule Posted October 24, 2011 Report Share Posted October 24, 2011 i,m wondering how well it would go down if the farmer brought a couple of his prize bulls into the dog owners back garden and left them there for an hour or two to play with their dogs. paul. You could sell the film rights for that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted October 24, 2011 Report Share Posted October 24, 2011 A Derbyshire couple have said they want the law changed to make it illegal for dogs to be shot on farmland. The plea from Tony and Susan Dracup, of Hartshorne, came after two of their pets were killed by a farmer. Farmer John Collier said the dogs had "devastated the area" and had frightened his cattle on several occasions at his Hatton farm. Derbyshire police said they had investigated the shooting of the dogs, but were not taking any further action. Farmers are legally allowed to shoot a dog caught worrying livestock. 'Our children' Mrs Dracup, who said she believed their dogs were chasing rabbits, added she was "totally devastated and shocked" when she discovered Tilly and Suki had been killed. "If the dogs were that much of a nuisance to him, why didn't he tell us and complain to us? "But to actually, in cold blood, fire shotguns at them and slaughter them is beyond belief." Mrs Dracup said they had not had complaints from people about their "gentle natured creatures", who were "our children", causing problems in the area. Cattle farmer Mr Collier said he was within his rights legally and morally to shoot the dogs. "I saw the dogs hounding the cattle, two of which had aborted," he said. "On numerous times I've had the cattle chased by the same dogs and several times I've thrown things at them, shouted and chased them off. "We've never seen the owners with the dogs, they were always on their own." He added that he would kill other dogs to protect his cattle in the future. Under The Animals Act 1971 someone who has killed or injured a dog that was worrying or about to worry livestock has a legal defence. "when she discovered they`d been killed?" - where was she during the shooting? was not she present during the shooting? if not? why not? if she was there this could have been resolved. the owner let the dogs down. the farmer stated he`d never seen the owner of the dogs, but has seen them many times and eventually shot them, where were the owners? sounds just like they let them run wild on someone elses property. its a shame the inocent farmer was put in this situation. but the outcome was inevetable (sp?). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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