Seamus Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 Just over a week ago I moved into a new house that has a 5 acre paddock to the rear, and also has a large pond. The previous occupier warned me that he had previously had ducks and chickens, and that the foxes had killed the lot. So far, in 11 days of living there I have lost 5 chickens and a pet rabbit. One chicken was taken this morning in daylight (unfortunately found headless by my 8 year old), just after they were let out. I have seen a large dog fox in my drive on two occasions after dark. I have shotguns, but I am thinking that I need something with a bit more range to take care of this problem, some guidance (and I appreciate this is subjective without seeing the land!) or advice from you experienced fox shooters would be very welcome. The paddock is approximately 320m from my house to the end. As you stand with back to the house and look down the paddock, to the left and rear are open fields (100 acres plus). The paddock dips down to the rear and (to a lesser degree the side) then the field raises up so I would have a safe back drop with full visibility. I know the owner of the fields and believe he will give me permission to shoot over the land. Directly to the right of the house I have neighbours (none to the left); but their gardens end about 50m down my border, from then on it is unused church owned land (absolutely no option for shot etc going that way). I shoot with one of my neighbours around my village, he mostly uses a .22LR, he said he would act as a mentor for me. So after all that waffle, I guess my question, from your experience, is what is the likelihood of me being granted permission to use a rifle on my paddock? Once again I know you have to see it to get the full picture but I would welcome your thoughts. I know I'd be limited on calibre to maybe a .177 and I've read many topics on here about shooting foxes with one, so I don't want to start that debate over again, I'm just after some helpful advice/tips on which way to go. I must also stress that I am completely new to rifles so go gently! Much appreciated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve_b_wales Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 After reading your post, I would think that you have a really good chance of getting a rimfire rifle. You already have shotguns, so you have proved that you are a responsible person. I would apply for a FAC, and have your friend offer to be your mentor. I know someone who only had an air rifle, but has now got both 17HMR & 22LR, without a mentoring condition on his certificate. Steve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajm1979 Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 Hi there is no reason you shouldn't be able to get FAC for at least rimfire and there is no harm in asking for a 22CF aswell, I got both on my first application no problems. I wouldnt suggest offering anyone as mentor unless they ask for it like some forces. If you decide only to go for one rimfire I would suggest the .17HMR as it is easily capable of taking foxes in the right conditions, again however not every force will grant it for fox control. Save yourself money and hassle with variations by applying for as many as you can justify holding, I only put down .22lr and .22CF on my first application, six weeks after getting my cert through my variation was in for my 17HMR. good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garygreengrass Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 I don`t think you will have any problem getting a 22lr or a .177hmr as long as you got the land to use it on as for your paddock?,I would find some land that as been passed for the use of a firearm and apply I have two mates that have had .177hmr`without the need for a mentor. Don`t say that you are going to shot foxes with the 22lr or the .177hmr as some police forces do`nt think it`s a suitable caliber just say for vermin control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 (edited) A .17HMR is ok but there are better options for Fox. They're not .177 - that's an air rifle. Personally I would ask for a .22 Hornet or a .22WMR rimfire and a .22lr. Get the FEO out to have a look and see what he thinks you could get. The .22lr is good for bunnies and the likes with your mate and the Hornet for Fox (that would be my first choice over a WMR if they will allow it). How keen are you to get into rifle shooting? Reason I ask is that if you only want to shoot the Foxes and perhaps tag along with your mate on the bunnies now and again then just a WMR will do the job cheaply and well. However if you want to get into it a bit the WMR isn't available in subsonic like the .22lr is so the bunny bashing won't be quiet, and the Hornet will give you more range on the Fox but at cost unless you home load. As a guide prices and uses are about.... £10 per 20 Hornet (for cheap S&B or Prvi) - 700ft-lbs energy, 200 yard Fox £10 per 50 WMR - 400ft-lbs energy, 100 yard Fox £10 or less per 100 for .22lr - 100ft-lbs energy, 50 yard Fox if you're a good shot and know where to hit it. I wouldn't suggest it a good idea for a beginner. So as you can see if you're going to be keen then two rifles may pay as you can shoot cheaply on Rabbits and pay more to get the job done on Foxes. If not then the WMR will do what you need it to, but the Hornet will do it better if you can afford to pay that sort of money for a bunny outing? Home loading brings the cost of Hornet down to that of the WMR, but that's a whole new ball game and it may be a bit early for that. EDIT... Personally what I would do would be to bait the Fox to a safe position under a dull light every night so you know he's around then sit up and shoot him out of an upstairs window with my Hornet. Edited November 9, 2011 by njc110381 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browning Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 Whatever caliber you decide it is not going to happen overnight, Northants are quoting a 3 month turnaround on new FAC applications at the moment (I am mentoring a young lad who has just applied), which is not going to help your immediate problem. If you need it sorting quickly your best bet is to see if anyone with an open FAC will help you out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratts Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 Can you not bait up/squeek him in and take him with your shotgun? If he's taking chickens in daylight he won't take much drawing into shottie range! Or see if your mates cert says vermin control for his 22lr, give him land authority to shoot on your land, get it cleared by FEO and he can take him out with that at 40 - 50 yards no problem right between the eyes!! :blink: I'd also speak to the farmers either side 1st and try and get their permission too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 (edited) Sounds like a .22 Hornet job to me. Lots of areas won't give rimfire for fox, hornet being about the lightest centrefire would be a good ask with plenty of good reason and get a decent moderator mine is quieter than my HMR ever was. Personally i wouldn't ever choose to shoot a fox with any rimfire, though have shot an absoloute stack of other stuff with them. Think how you gonna feel about things when theirs a wounded fox running round the neighbours house. As for 22 lr the 12 bore shotgun with a healthy load of BB or no1 is gonna do a far better job at similar ranges all be it with a louder bang. Rimfires for rabbits, centrefires for fox there is no shot thats safe with HMR that aint safe with a .22 Hornet Edited November 9, 2011 by kent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.I.A Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 Best solution for now is to set up some bait and wait out for him to show. I've done this when I was loosing chickens and I still haven't shot the ****** mind. I haven't had a problem for months now but I was out the other day around 3pm and it was mooching about without a care in the world! Where are you located? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mereside Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 get a piece of 110mm drainage pipe about three feet long put a bung on one end and a vented top dig it in a couple of feet and fill it with guts and fish heads and get set up high close enough with the shotgun and wait for them to come in it will draw them in it works a treat ,put in for your fac in the meantime,atb wayne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seamus Posted November 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 Thanks for all the responses. It seems like a .22CF is the way to go with the foxes, I do have rabbits on the paddock too so I guess it will do no harm putting in for a .22LR as well? Is it really a 3 month wait in Northants at the moment (I am near Towcester for the chap that asked)? My shotgun cert is due for renewal in 2012 so I guess it's an ideal time to get the FAC ball rolling. I think I'll pick up a box of BB carts for the weekend as well, in the meantime. I've spoken to my friend in the village and apparently no-one shoots the foxes around us that he is aware of; probably explains why there is such a problem. My wife text me an hour ago saying another chicken has gone since this morning, it's past ridiculous now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratts Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 You're gonna be busy then if word gets around you are the only person shooting Charlie You may as well apply for .17hmr, 22rf and .22cf mate while paying your fees Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handy4454 Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 Hi Seamus I'm three miles outside Towcester with an open ticket for 22rf,give me a pm if you need some help,be a lot quieter than a shotgun after dark atb handy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browning Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 (edited) Is it really a 3 month wait in Northants at the moment (I am near Towcester for the chap that asked)? Unfortunately it is Seamus, I'm about 3 miles north of Towcester up the A5. Also, it won't be easy (I won't say impossible) getting the fox condition on your .22LR I'm afraid, I 'keeper a shoot over 3000 acres and they wouldn't let me have it. Northants are pretty strict in that respect. Another thought......Walk your boundary and find out where he/they are coming in, then put some wires out. If you do need a hand drop me a PM. More than happy to come along, help you out, and show you the ropes etc. Edited November 9, 2011 by Browning Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpha Mule Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 (edited) A £3 chicken from Tesco, wired to a stake - near the house, in particular near to an upper floor window, and get set up with your shottie. I asked for and got .17HMR and .22LR no problem (but I have been using an air rifle over the properties for about 3 years), but need a CF for fox and a mentor while using it. FEO was suitably vague about what constitued vermin with the HMR though "Just be responsible and make sure what you shoot at dies immediately!", "After all a .22 cf round will drop anything if you plant it between the eyes at 2 yards". Edited November 9, 2011 by Alpha Mule Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P~MX Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 get a few larsen traps out and sort it yourself for your own satisfaction Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browning Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 get a few larsen traps out and sort it yourself for your own satisfaction It's fox taking his chickens, not carrion and magpies..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P~MX Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 It's fox taking his chickens, not carrion and magpies..... and your point is ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alycidon Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 (edited) Sloppy dog food spread about, then 36 gr of BBs. I am also in Northants and have had dealings with their FEO who covers my patch. He will on no account allow 17HMR for fox, a friend who has about 5 acres of garden and meadows and cant get a FAC on it for anything more than a 22LR, with no fox authorisation but a nod and a wink that 22LR will do. His ground is perfectly safe with a large disused railway bank at the far end of the land. I would recommend you pull someone in who holds an open FAC who can bring a small moderated centerfire into play. As a keeper the guy from Towcester way can probably help and as he offered first then he should get first option. I have a moderated 17 Hornet that does foxes to 150 yards OK if needed but I have little time till january, even on my own ground I am only shooting pheasants at present. I am up near Daventry. Reading your post again then by far the best option is to get the farmer who owns the 100 acres to give you written permission to shoot vermin and foxes. Armed with that you should get a ticket for anything up to a 22.250 on his land and yours and away you go. Mentors are NOT a legal requirement, if you are not already a member join BASC and refuse to accept a mentor, then if they refuse to grant on the basis of no mentor get BASC to fight it for you. It will take 8 weeks plus to get your ticket though. A Edited November 9, 2011 by Alycidon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FOXHUNTER1 Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 Just get it shot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 If this Fox of yours is so keen I think you'd have a good chance of cage trapping him or baiting him. In that case a shotgun will do nicely for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 get a few larsen traps out and sort it yourself for your own satisfaction somebody don't know what a lasen trap is then Thanks for all the responses. It seems like a .22CF is the way to go with the foxes, I do have rabbits on the paddock too so I guess it will do no harm putting in for a .22LR as well? Is it really a 3 month wait in Northants at the moment (I am near Towcester for the chap that asked)? My shotgun cert is due for renewal in 2012 so I guess it's an ideal time to get the FAC ball rolling. I think I'll pick up a box of BB carts for the weekend as well, in the meantime. I've spoken to my friend in the village and apparently no-one shoots the foxes around us that he is aware of; probably explains why there is such a problem. My wife text me an hour ago saying another chicken has gone since this morning, it's past ridiculous now. .22 hornet will sort them also, headshots will leave them fine for the table if you wish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WGD Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 In the short term I would be baiting an area for a few days then sitting out with your shotgun and some heavy loads at dusk, otherwise you won't have any chickens or ducks left by the time you get your FAC. Try to assess where the fox/es are coming from and make sure you are upwind of the likely approach or they will wind you and won't see them. Alternatively, identify routes in an set a few snares - not everyone's cup of tea but in a situation like this they get the job done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vole Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 I second the shotgun approach . Semi auto or pump with 3 BB loads and bushwhack the beggar while waiting for your Section 1 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seamus Posted November 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 In the short term I'm definitely going to have a go with the shottie; I'll pick some BB carts up and have a go with baiting an area. I've got a pretty good idea where they're coming into the paddock, I'm not familiar or confident enough to set traps though and I'm not sure the wife will approve of that approach! As regards a mentor, I would have thought that offering this straight away would have increased my chances of getting an FAC approved, but opinions on this thread seemed to be split, any reason why that is? For info I am a member of BASC and CPSA and have been for several years. I also have a .177 HW100KT that I bought off of here and have been using on the village rabbits for a good while! I guess this can only help the FAC application. Browning, I think we swapped PM's earlier this year and you're right on my doorstep, you have PM (thanks) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.