Any none hunters (or anti hunters) on here?

[Terry P]

 

Not all trophy hunting is as simple as that. The picture of trophy or "big game" hunting in developing countries is a complex one. Where it is well managed, commercial safari hunting in Africa is effectively culling where tourist hunters pay to do a job that might not be financially feasible without them. In many instances the revenue from hunting not only provides a sustainable local industry but pays for long term wildlife management and anti-poaching programmes in countries which might not otherwise be able to afford them. Furthermore many of the animals hunted are a threat to the lives and livelihoods of local poeple. If they were not controlled in an organised manner very often they would be slaughtered indisriminately by locals. And anything that is edible is eaten. So are a good many species which, by western standards, are not. Generally, Africans are not in the habit of wasting potential food.

Safari hunting can and does play an important part in maintaining a balance between a fragile ecology and a rapidly expanding and extremely poor human population. But its not always well regulated or well coordinated across brders to take account of migratory movements.

Personally, I have no problem with well managed trophy hunting as a concept, (though I detest fenced ranches where animals are released to be shot) but I also struggle to comprehend those people who take no interest whatever in the creature they have hunted beyond putting a bullet in it to say they have done it and tick it off their list. But to be honest there are plenty of paying stalkers like that in this country. And most pro stalkers, like most of the trackers and PHs in Africa, don't like them either, but needs must.

Personally I would never shoot big game, but the above post explains it very well, the inhabitants of these countries see elephants as a pest and income just as we see deer and pigeon.

As long as the kill is clean and legal each to their own.

[Dunkield]

I am in agreement with Gordon, what started out as an interesting discussion now has the whiff of trolling about it

[Terry P]

I think people are either misinterpreting what I'm stating or reading what they want into my statements, or perhaps I could be clearer with what I'm saying?

 

I don't have blinkers on. I don't believe the first thing I read nor am I susceptible to propaganda (it's easy to spot that). I tend to read peer reviewed journals or articles from independent bodies, such as charitable trusts or associations.

Can you tell us what peer reviewed journals you've read on pheasant rearing please, and who were the charitable trusts that wrote them.

[Animal Mother]

 

Your second comment says it all.

 

Before you annoy anyone else on this forum could you please elucidate on your experiences in the shooting field so that we have a better idea where you are coming from with some of your more obtuse comments.

 

I honestly don't know what you mean by those two comments.

 

Why does my "second comment say it all"?

 

I don't know why people should be getting annoyed? I believe I've not made any "obtuse" comments nor proffered any unreasonable arguments.

 

I have shot rifles for the last 30 years. Both air and cartridge. I've shot targets and animals (for sport, vermin control and food). I've recently taken up clay pigeon shooting. I also fished for many years (from about 10 to 20 years old), both for sport and food.

 

I'm not a "townie" as I know some people on the forum believe "townies" to know less. I grew up in a semi-rural area and live in a rural area now where I'm surrounded by shooting, fishing and hunting.

 

Anything else?

[Gordon R]

I have shot rifles for the last 30 years. Both air and cartridge.

 

 

Really. :whistling:

[Animal Mother]

Can you tell us what peer reviewed journals you've read on pheasant rearing please, and who were the charitable trusts that wrote them.

 

Charitable trusts tend not to write journal articles. There are plenty of articles out there by wildife groups, BASC have a good article on Driven Game.

[Dunkield]

I wouldn't even go fishing.

 

 

 

I also fished for many years (from about 10 to 20 years old), both for sport and food.

 

 

[oscarsdad]

Beat me to it...I spotted that

[Animal Mother]

I am in agreement with Gordon, what started out as an interesting discussion now has the whiff of trolling about it

 

If you think I'm trolling then I would like to assure you that I'm not. It sometimes seems that on forums, when there are discussions that people feel strongly about, the trolling card is pulled out. I'm sorry if it comes over like I'm trolling.

 

 

 

 

 

Beat me to it...I spotted that

 

Please consider the past and present tense in my comments chaps. Yes I did fish. I wouldn't consider it again.

 

Think of me as a born again naturalist.

Can you tell us what peer reviewed journals you've read on pheasant rearing please, and who were the charitable trusts that wrote them.

 

There are quite a few scientific journals out there on pheasant rearing.

 

Really. :whistling:

 

Yes. I'm not sure why you'd doubt me. I have no reason to lie and I hope you don't have any reason to doubt what I say (except for it being on the internet which is renowned for utter ********! )

[oscarsdad]

If you think I'm trolling then I would like to assure you that I'm not. It sometimes seems that on forums, when there are discussions that people feel strongly about, the trolling card is pulled out. I'm sorry if it comes over like I'm trolling.

 

 

 

 

Please consider the past and present tense in my comments chaps. Yes I did fish. I wouldn't consider it again.

 

Think of me as a born again naturalist.

 

There are quite a few scientific journals out there on pheasant rearing.

 

Yes. I'm not sure why you'd doubt me. I have no reason to lie and I hope you don't have any reason to doubt what I say (except for it being on the internet which is renowned for utter ********! )

What put you off fishing?

[al4x]

probably not catching anything other than a cold

[Mikaveli]

I'm actually a vegetarian and I don't "hunt" or shoot any live game or vermin etc.

 

So, what am I doing on PW? Well, after getting in to clay pigeon shooting, I was looking for an active forum where I could read and talk about guns and (target) shooting. That's what I found and I'm pretty happy to be here.

 

Although some of my views probably make me hypocritical in some areas, I'd like to think I have a reasonably balanced outlook on things. I understand why people shoot pigeons and game, why they go rabbiting and / or foxing and the effect it has on our farming and countryside. I'm not 'anti' any of those things. In my eyes, the worst people are the ones that would denounce game shooting as 'cruel', yet they'll happily eat meat from a factory animal that's suffered months of poor treatment - all the while feeling morally superior because they don't 'kill' animals themselves...

 

I don't like mass-commercial farming. To me, the health and welfare of livestock is important and something we (as a people) should take responsibility for - when most don't. They way some livestock is treated (particularly overseas) is appalling. Many people don't care, so long as they can buy 'beef' burgers for pence and whole chickens for a couple of pounds. For that reason, so far as meat goes, like Duncan Bannatyne "Am oot!".

 

Talk to most of the people on here and they'd never dream of subjecting their quarry to any unnecessary suffering and take a great deal of care that anything getting despatched (whether for food, sport of pest control) is done in a humane and responsible way. That's why I'm happy to post here any don't feel the need to rattle my stick at any thread covering those topics.

[Gordon R]

Yes. I'm not sure why you'd doubt me. I have no reason to lie and I hope you don't have any reason to doubt what I say (except for it being on the internet which is renowned for utter ********! )

 

 

Sadly, I do doubt you.

Edited August 7, 2013 by Gordon R

[JDog]

I think that we have all had enough of Animal Mother.

[Dunkield]

Took up fishing on forums instead

[Animal Mother]

What put you off fishing?

Apart from extreme seasickness off Anglesey I was involved in scientific studies measuring pain and stress response in fish. The results were a bit of a revelation and an eye opener. Some of the experiments (not mine, but ones I have links to) changed some major aspects of ichthyology.

I'm actually a vegetarian and I don't "hunt" or shoot any live game or vermin etc.

 

So, what am I doing on PW? Well, after getting in to clay pigeon shooting, I was looking for an active forum where I could read and talk about guns and (target) shooting. That's what I found and I'm pretty happy to be here.

 

Although some of my views probably make me hypocritical in some areas, I'd like to think I have a reasonably balanced outlook on things. I understand why people shoot pigeons and game, why they go rabbiting and / or foxing and the effect it has on our farming and countryside. I'm not 'anti' any of those things. In my eyes, the worst people are the ones that would denounce game shooting as 'cruel', yet they'll happily eat meat from a factory animal that's suffered months of poor treatment - all the while feeling morally superior because they don't 'kill' animals themselves...

 

I don't like mass-commercial farming. To me, the health and welfare of livestock is important and something we (as a people) should take responsibility for - when most don't. They way some livestock is treated (particularly overseas) is appalling. Many people don't care, so long as they can buy 'beef' burgers for pence and whole chickens for a couple of pounds. For that reason, so far as meat goes, like Duncan Bannatyne "Am oot!".

 

Talk to most of the people on here and they'd never dream of subjecting their quarry to any unnecessary suffering and take a great deal of care that anything getting despatched (whether for food, sport of pest control) is done in a humane and responsible way. That's why I'm happy to post here any don't feel the need to rattle my stick at any thread covering those topics.

 

You've pretty much hit the nail on the head there for me. I agree with everything you say, however, I love bacon too much to give up meat!

[Animal Mother]

 

Sadly, I do doubt you.

 

That's your prerogative. There's no way I can prove it so you'd have to take my word for it.

 

I think that we have all had enough of Animal Mother.

 

Charming.

 

Took up fishing on forums instead

 

Do they exist? Sea fishing (boat) and coarse fishing. I never caught anything at beach casting and never tried fly fishing.

Edited August 7, 2013 by Animal Mother

[oscarsdad]

http://fightingforfishing.anglingtrust.net/tag/prof-james-rose/

 

The research that showed fish feel pain has since been strongly argued against

[Kes]

I thought this thread was about our attitudes but its become propoganda.

Killing for food has been with us since before man became homo erectus, and until a bacon buttie can be made out of lettuce or beans - and taste the same, it will remain. Why engage in debate?

[Animal Mother]

http://fightingforfishing.anglingtrust.net/tag/prof-james-rose/

 

The research that showed fish feel pain has since been strongly argued against

I know, and it's healthy. As long as the arguments are cogent and based on the scientific method.

[Gordon R]

Kes

I think the attitudes posted stand scrutiny, from any anti or otherwise.

It still won't be enough for some. Await cut and paste multi answers.

They are almost always an indication.

[Pole Star]

The vast majority are sold to dealers and then eaten;the remainder are sometimes given to the beaters and are also eaten,but that isn't 'generally' the purpose of a pheasnt shoot. The purpose is to generate revenue from those who like to shoot game birds for sport. The same applies to Grouse and Partridge. The revenue raised by the sale of those shot birds to a dealer is small in comparison to that raised by the sale of let days to guns.

The above applies to commercial shoots,but there are many shoots(ours included)which don't sell any birds, and all are eaten by the guns,beaters or given away to people who would appreciate them.

 

The word sport in game shooting is very missed used Scully the word sport is when you are competing against some one to win especially were there is a prize at the end of it like there is in clay pigeon shooting , you don't get a prize for the most birds shot on a driven game shoot ? . If there is such a thing happening it should be frowned upon because it will bring driven game shooting in disrepute & class it as the old Live Pigeon Trap Shooting which was outlawed in Britain in the 20s I think ?. It still goes on in many parts of the world & the betting is huge money that you would not believe like $20,OOO bets on a hit or miss of one bird ! much of this is as you can guess is done by very very wealthy people , I have shot Live Pigeon abroad years ago but I must admit it did play on my conscience .

Because I got pretty good at it & by the time I gave it up my shooting cost me little & often I went home with a profit , but sport is the wrong word for game shooting & it wont be one until prizes & cups are involved

 

Pole Star

[Animal Mother]

 

The word sport in game shooting is very missed used Scully the word sport is when you are competing against some one to win especially were there is a prize at the end of it like there is in clay pigeon shooting , you don't get a prize for the most birds shot on a driven game shoot ? . If there is such a thing happening it should be frowned upon because it will bring driven game shooting in disrepute & class it as the old Live Pigeon Trap Shooting which was outlawed in Britain in the 20s I think ?. It still goes on in many parts of the world & the betting is huge money that you would not believe like $20,OOO bets on a hit or miss of one bird ! much of this is as you can guess is done by very very wealthy people , I have shot Live Pigeon abroad years ago but I must admit it did play on my conscience .

Because I got pretty good at it & by the time I gave it up my shooting cost me little & often I went home with a profit , but sport is the wrong word for game shooting & it wont be one until prizes & cups are involved

 

Pole Star

GPWM

[-Mongrel-]

GPWM

I had to Google that, for those in the same boat..Good Point Well Made.

 

It's an interesting tactic, a possible anti posting on a shooting forum about antis, lateral thinking for sure!

Edited August 7, 2013 by -Mongrel-

[Gordon R]

the word sport is when you are competing against some one to win especially were there is a prize at the end of it

 

 

So fishing, cycling and surfing are not sports.