whybrow Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Hi, I have a 10 nearly 11 year old and a 9 year old who have visited the supervised stand several times and both are really keen. When they are supervised, the coach (who is fantastic) is assisting them with holding the OU as it is a little heavy for their frame, and he has made reference to them eating lots of steak! I want them to continue and develop but have some independence with their shoot, I have thought this through and understand that perhaps I should wait until their capable of supporting the OU alone, but then thought perhaps if they are remaining on the supervised stand until such time, would they benefit from using a single barrel .410 and therefore independently developing their swing and technique? I thought this wouldn't necessarily be a problem as it wouldn't hold a shooting stand up, just create a slight delay on a 25 shot on a supervised stand. Any thoughts? Other Dad's must have come across this problem surely? How would any of you suggest resolving this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 (edited) HAve a search been covered loads of times a single 20 cut down may be better (not a lot of shot in a .40 to break a moving target) single 20 or perhaps a 28g OU cut to fit with suitable loads (subs) may be the best way forward. https://www.guntrader.co.uk/Guns-For-Sale/results.php?fetch=Results&Filter[NewType][]=Shotgun&Filter[NewMechanism][]=Folding%20single%20barrel&Filter[NewMechanism][]=Break%20Barrel&Filter[NewMechanism][]=Single%20Barrel&Filter[NewMechanism][]=Single%20Shot&Filter[Calibre][]=20%20gauge&perPage=30&sortField=Price&sortOrder=asc £75 and can chop barrel to 24.5" (cylinder choke) and stock to suit perhaps load stock with lead to balance and fit a good recoil pad. What OU were they using? extra £400 gets http://www.guntrader.co.uk/Guns-For-Sale/Yildiz_Shotgun_SPZ-M-Junior_For-Sale_140220105704001 BAkerboy coaches youngsters and has a selection of suitable arms Edited March 15, 2014 by HDAV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whybrow Posted March 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Cheers, thanks for the direction, I will have a search! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norfolk Ern Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Had the same issue last year. My son who was 10 had a go at clays, but found all of the double barrelled 410 and 20 bores he tried to be too heavy. After much searching we settled on a Hatsan 20 bore semi with junior stock. Nice and light, not too much recoil and he gets on really well with it. First outing saw 2 pigeons for 3 shots. He is slightly built and by no means in the upper size class for his year. Having said that, a single barreled 410 would probably suit your situation better given that you also have a younger lad as well. The baikal with synthetic stock seems to be a popular choice. If you end up with a gun which is too heavy, they tend to have to strain and bend their body to hold the weight up, which is not the best way of teaching them a good technique. Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 (edited) Had the same issue last year. My son who was 10 had a go at clays, but found all of the double barrelled 410 and 20 bores he tried to be too heavy. After much searching we settled on a Hatsan 20 bore semi with junior stock. Hatsan junior is not that "light" at 6.5lbs ish which is the same as a 20g OU like the webley junior http://www.guntrader.co.uk/Guns-For-Sale/Webley-Scott_Shotgun_920-JUNIOR-2x-STOCKS_For-Sale_130417195330004 Agree with the banana stance (leaning back sticking tummy out if gun too heavy) Weight is a tricky one as more weight reduces recoil but lighter easier to swing/mount. Balance is the key. Too light and it will kick too much, too light a load they will struggle to hit anything (both of which can be off putting) Edited March 15, 2014 by HDAV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 (edited) I have a cut down single 410 I use for the youngsters who can support my OU 410 or 28s. Edited March 16, 2014 by welshwarrior Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 If I .410 is too heavy then they are physically not yet able. Unless they are super keen hold off or risk dampening their confidence too much IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westley Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 (edited) My Grandkids are at the same stage as your child. They have been using air rifles in my garden. I have a Webley .410 with a short stock and until they are able to hold this unaided, they are sticking with the airguns. They have both 'had a go' with a .410 aided by myself, but I do not believe in rushing them. If they get hurt now, it can take years to recover from that and may even put them off for good. Trust me, I have seen it happen, the 'Lad' is now a married Father of 2 and has no inclination to ever shoot again. Edited March 16, 2014 by Westley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Del T Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 Hmmmnn. I've got a long wait then. Just bought our son a .410 ou to put away for when he's older. A nice huglu, trouble is he's only 16 weeks old.!! So that will give me an excuse to give it a thorough testing before he can use it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 Hmmmnn. I've got a long wait then. Just bought our son a .410 ou to put away for when he's older. A nice huglu, trouble is he's only 16 weeks old.!! So that will give me an excuse to give it a thorough testing before he can use it. The youngster find a stiff action very hard to use you'll have to shoot it abit so it's nicely worn in! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whybrow Posted March 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 Thanks for your input, it really does help. They have been going clay shooting with me and use the supervised stand. They are both really keen and I don't want to dampen that and love the fact that they are letting the Xbox One gather dust and enjoying "real" things. The club has a Yildiz SPZM .410 O/U that they use and a quick search on google tells me that the gun is weighing in at 5lb 5oz. They get it into the shoulder OK, have no recoil problems but it is too heavy for them to sweep the clays. The coach has to help support the forend as they sweep or they perform the banana stance. My logic was to look at getting a shotgun at less weight so that they can still shoot whilst developing for example, Yildiz .410 TK36 which weighs a mere 3lb. That is just over half of the weight they are currently trying to use. It is single shot but the time delay on a supervised stand would be negligible. Any thoughts? Perhaps I am looking at it wrong and should wait? They have the same problem with archery, in pulling back the bow string to the ear and can only manage the cheek. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 That's the single I use once you shorten the stock just rebalance the gun properly front heavy is bad news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whybrow Posted March 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 Thanks for that Welshwarrior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 http://www.bisley-uk.com/product_v3.php?i=LIPCA&c=13 20g 5.5lbs.... it may well be the yildiz is built on an oversize action action considering the same weight the types of carts available and the costs a 20g once they can hold the weight might be a better investment long term. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westley Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 That's the single I use once you shorten the stock just rebalance the gun properly front heavy is bad news. Has recoil ever been an issue in that gun ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted March 16, 2014 Report Share Posted March 16, 2014 No I use 9g 9s in it and work up to 14g 9s. Fit is key to the not hurt but the Isis pad helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilts#Dave Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Sounds to me like they're just too young and not physically strong enough to be clayshooting properly, and whilst it's fun having a go as they are I wouldn't waste too much time and money finding a gun that they can manage just now, as before you know it they will have grown out of it! What they're doing now with assistance is all helping with their gun handling skills anyway. I was using my dads beretta o/u 020 bore when I was 12/13 and before that a bolt action 4.10....only my opinion but I would wait till they can manage a lightweight 20bore with light load/shorter stock, I could never hit anything flying consistently with the 4.10 as they are so hard to shoot with but the very first time I used the 20 bore was hitting close decoying pigeons with some regularity, and being that bit heavier the recoil is negligible too with a 21/24 gram shell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dashman1 Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Agree with above atb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougall Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 single 410 is certainly light...the baikal not lightest but sucks up recoil better than a 3 lb gun will....I know difficult but may have to wait a year or so...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanGogh76 Posted March 27, 2014 Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 If it helps, I ran a corporate day last year and a had a 7 year old (Average size) break clays with a single barrel Yildiz we were using 2 inch carts and yes they were very easy incomers, but the smiles from him and the parents was well worth it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonicdmb Posted March 28, 2014 Report Share Posted March 28, 2014 I have a Baikal single 12 gauge with the barrel cut to 24 1/2" and shortened stock fitted with a cheek pad to bring head up to right height. It has a rubber recoil pad as well. I have a Lee loadall so load 7/8oz low powered loads to start with working up to 24g 7 1\2's Both my younger two have used this gun youngest still does. I feel that this is the best way as a normal load nearly put my lad off it took me making the light load ( and a few months ) to get him to trust the gun again. My daughter loves the gun the grin on her face when I told them it was time to shoot crows nests out and they were doing it. Was worth not taking my gun. It's better to wait than put them off an air rifle from a rest at spinning targets will keep interest in shooting far more than struggling with a shotgun IMO anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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