shootgun Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 I don't need to specify to you, I also don't need some Harry telling me the law. You think I'm stupid enough to state I'm using illegal calibres on deer. I've just bought a 'new' calibre, I'm not new to the game. You need a cold shower pal... Did i ever said you are using illegal calibers on deer? And why asking for advice if know everything and not new to the game? Jeez Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyska Posted October 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) You need a cold shower pal... Did i ever said you are using illegal calibers on deer? And why asking for advice if know everything and not new to the game? Jeez No. I asked for 'opinions' on a handful of calibres, I made it clear I have the calibre for small deer. You've given neither opinion or advice on the calibres I was interested in, only patronised me by quoting law I already know. Read topics before you post. So make a contribution, is the 25-06 a good choice I've the calibres I was considering? Edited October 31, 2015 by kyska Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted October 31, 2015 Report Share Posted October 31, 2015 Kyska, what's the bullet choice like in 25 cal and availability ? I have a mate who shoots a 257 bob but he has a few problems getting his choice of bullets. Must say it looks a good choice to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeadWasp Posted November 1, 2015 Report Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) 25-06, hmm. Heard many good second hand reports about them, but none first hand. Would be interested in some feedback. Good luck with it! Can't find anything to complain about the calibre - it'll do anything you want of it for stalking or pest control. Good selection of ammunition both factory and for reloading. Only one match round available now I believe. Takes many different easily available powders for reloading. Countless ghillies can't be wrong. Edited November 1, 2015 by LeadWasp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeadWasp Posted November 1, 2015 Report Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) Kyska, what's the bullet choice like in 25 cal and availability ? I have a mate who shoots a 257 bob but he has a few problems getting his choice of bullets. Must say it looks a good choice to me. (&^%^%$*&*&!!!!!!! how many times have you shot with me now Dougy .... I can show you (again) tomorrow if you turn up Edited November 1, 2015 by LeadWasp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 1, 2015 Report Share Posted November 1, 2015 Never did understand why the Bob and 250 Savage never took off in Britain, they would be perfect for here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootgun Posted November 1, 2015 Report Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) No. I asked for 'opinions' on a handful of calibres, I made it clear I have the calibre for small deer. You've given neither opinion or advice on the calibres I was interested in, only patronised me by quoting law I already know. Read topics before you post. To avoid embarassing yourself again in the future,read the answers in the topic before you post In your original post you asked opinions about a few deer calibers including the .270. If you look back through the posts, you will see I have given my opinion a few times in this topic regarding the .270, as is my caliber of choice.As for the .25-06, I can't comment about something i had never used. You might require a trip to the Specsavers soon ATB Edited November 2, 2015 by shootgun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rich1985 Posted November 1, 2015 Report Share Posted November 1, 2015 Simple 243 or 6.5 x55. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted November 1, 2015 Report Share Posted November 1, 2015 (&^%^%$*&*&!!!!!!! how many times have you shot with me now Dougy .... I can show you (again) tomorrow if you turn up I just asked because me little mucker mate could not get any 117 grain bullets that he had found a good load for in his Roberts, not sure what they were, I think they were the Nosler Combined Technology. Its a pity I am at work but then again I have taken the scopes off all but one of my rifles, cleaned and oiled the barrels......because they are going away on holiday for a while Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeadWasp Posted November 1, 2015 Report Share Posted November 1, 2015 Worked a load up today for 117gr - I am a little bit pleased with it at the both the bottom and the top end and no pressure signs. Simple little Sierra Gamekings, but the 100's have been great on fallow so I thought I'd see what the 117gr's do. I often been told that this weight is the best diet for the .25. 117gr Sako Gameking and Remmington Core Lokt have been amongst the best factory I've shot. Given today's grouping the future looks bright. I don't think Nosler do a 117gr in 257, I've just checked their website - I got my load from Lee for a generic 177gr. using IMR 4831. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted November 1, 2015 Report Share Posted November 1, 2015 115 silvertip. Clover leaf at 100. But he had difficulty getting some. So the 25.06 is shooting well, just thought, that will do tbe long range gongs ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted November 1, 2015 Report Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) Thanks for all the replies, very useful. I think the 30-06 is in favour due to the versatility if I do start to reload. I wouldn't necessarily agree with that automatically, The 06 has quite a big case volume by modern standards which tends not to suit some of the best modern powders. The .308 in its military form (7.62) was produced by taking the then American service round, the 30-06, and shortening it by half an inch to suit the more modern powders because powder technology had moved on. There is nothing that the .30-06 can do that the .308 can't do easier and usually cheaper. Its really two generations of the same calibre Edited November 1, 2015 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbox Posted November 1, 2015 Report Share Posted November 1, 2015 I wouldn't necessarily agree with that automatically, The 06 has quite a big case volume by modern standards which tends not to suit some of the best modern powders. The .308 in its military form (7.62) was produced by taking the then American service round, the 30-06, and shortening it by half an inch to suit the more modern powders because the technology had moved on. There is nothing that the .30-06 can do that the .308 can't do easier and usually cheaper. Its really the same calibre gen1 and gen 2 Thats an intersting observation. I really like my .270 - basically because I've gotten used to it and feel very confident with it. If .270 suddenly wasn't an option, I think I would have to take a good look at the .308... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeadWasp Posted November 1, 2015 Report Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) Perhaps but surely at the end of then day in the UK it comes down to what the OP fancies. Redgum forgot this too....so maybe the 308 IS X Y or Z but what is wrong with wanting something else - nothing. The powder argument is incorrect - whilst WW2 era IMR's are the mainstay AND they aren't going anywhere - N160 or N560 are excellent in a .25 and supply is more guaranteed. You could do the Swede a disservice by the same argument because it's a Victorian calibre. If you wanted to pip the 30-06 then the 308 is the wrong round - the British proposition was I believe better at the time....as was the TSR2 This whole 'my cartridge pees higher up the tree than your cartridge' thing is a bit dull to be honest. You guys love 270 or 308, some love 6.5 others like .25...I'm sure we'll all get along fine together. It's nice to have a choice on the menu....................... I mean flipping 'eck I even saw Fruitloop take his .243 out of the box today and not just to stroke it! Edited November 1, 2015 by LeadWasp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortune Posted November 2, 2015 Report Share Posted November 2, 2015 I like my 270. I've never understood all of this >> "it's a banger" and "It kicks like a mule" and " It damages meat" stuff. All guns go bang and the powder charges aren't that much different, velocity isn't much different and the bullet dia and construction is similar. Some years ago basc used to have a 270 and published a lighter load which I think (not sure about this figure, so don't use it without checking) was something like 37 grns of H4895 pushing a Speer 130 sp>>> I think that Hodgdon spec is start 42 Grns and max of 45 grns. I loaded the basc spec and it was a really soft quiet load. Perhaps someone else knows of this loading. PS I've got a 243 Manlicher Luxus short stutzen also. now that is a noisy beast but generally they only speak once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 2, 2015 Report Share Posted November 2, 2015 I wouldn't necessarily agree with that automatically, The 06 has quite a big case volume by modern standards which tends not to suit some of the best modern powders. The .308 in its military form (7.62) was produced by taking the then American service round, the 30-06, and shortening it by half an inch to suit the more modern powders because powder technology had moved on. There is nothing that the .30-06 can do that the .308 can't do easier and usually cheaper. Its really two generations of the same calibreI don't see it like that mate. The T51 was designed from the ground up and not a shortened 06. If it did copy anything it copied it copied the 300Savage! The 30-06 will out shoot a 308, especially with high end bullet weights. Does it matter? No not really. As for powders moving on, don't old cases work with them? I can remember when loading data and ammunition was quite hotter than it is generally today. So if powders have moved on, I don't see it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted November 2, 2015 Report Share Posted November 2, 2015 (edited) I don't see it like that mate. The T51 was designed from the ground up and not a shortened 06. If it did copy anything it copied it copied the 300Savage! The 30-06 will out shoot a 308, especially with high end bullet weights. Does it matter? No not really. As for powders moving on, don't old cases work with them? I can remember when loading data and ammunition was quite hotter than it is generally today. So if powders have moved on, I don't see it! Ah somebody who knows their cartridge history! Thats refreshing! The T51 was designed from the ground up only if you believe the American version of events, The development work was mostly around preserving barrel life with the hotter pwders for machine gun use. It just so happened that it ended up having a shortened 30-06 case because the americans wanted their manufacturing plant at Lake City to be able to produce both calibres side by side for an overlap period of ten years on the same machinery. That was how long they foresaw the wash through period and wanted to continue using their Springfield rifles during that ten year period. oad lead Also it was Cold War Era and they had millions of Springfields they couldn't afford to scrap.The 7.62 rifle was only used by the americans initially in the European theatre. They were still using springfields in Vietnam era, along with long since obsolete (officially) M1s Modern powders are cabable of delivering more energy from smaller volumes which is why the smaller but faster calibres have eclipsed the old military warhorses. But almost every calibre in this discussion is decended from the 06. The .270 os a necked down 30-06 , the .308 is identical to the 06 apart from length and the .243 is a necked down .308. Its still a massively popular calibre in the US despite being 109 years old. I don't really see how the .30-06 can outshoot the .308 when it has a lower max pressure than the .308 but both are much higher than most of the other calibres mentioned and its not about that as you sayuth Edited November 2, 2015 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 2, 2015 Report Share Posted November 2, 2015 Hmmm, its main purpose was to obtain some standardisation across NATO members. The operating pressure capabilities are the same the brass being similar thickness in 06 & 308. 300savage is lower and thinner brass. 06 will beat 308 with 200grn bullets. America did use the m60 and I think the m14 in 7.62 NATO. Some miniguns too. The primary reason on the size was to be able to carry more ammo over the traditional sizes of cartridges. Powder performance has little or nothing to do with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossberg-operator Posted November 4, 2015 Report Share Posted November 4, 2015 http://www.countydeerstalking.co.uk/Blog/303-british-for-deer.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 4, 2015 Report Share Posted November 4, 2015 http://www.countydeerstalking.co.uk/Blog/303-british-for-deer.html Nowt wrong with 303. I am surprised it started out as a black powder cartridge! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savhmr Posted November 4, 2015 Report Share Posted November 4, 2015 The only advantage that I can see with 30-06 is that it will handle heavier bullets and can drive a 220gr SP out at close to 2500ft/s in say a 24 inch barrel, which is beyond the 308's realistic capabilities, but I can't think of where that would be any real advantage except for longer range game shooting which seems more the preserve of our USA cousins. One thing that some miss when comparing the two is that whilst the 308 is normally found in short actioned rifles, the 30-06 set the stage for long action rifles with its 3.34 inch cartridge length. This might matter to target shooters where the shorter action is generally considered inherently stiffer. The 308 is considered in some circles to be the more accurate round within the boundaries of its supersonic maximum range, perhaps the short action being part of the equation. For all intents and purposes, there seems little to chose between any of the large centrefire rounds for stalking, so personal choice and ammo availability become the final arbiters of choice. From a military perspective, I understood that the 30-06 fell out of favour during the Cold War when many of the USA's rivals used shorter cased rounds without any real disadvantage over the larger 30-06 and I think it was around 1957 or 1958 when the M1 Garand was replaced with the M14, using the NATO 7.62x51 (308 Winchester). It didn't stay in service that long, as the USA switched to the NATO 5.56 x 45 due to the main advantage of troops on the ground being able to carry more rounds and crucially, the logistics benefits of being able to carry almost twice as much ammo in every air lift to remote outposts in Vietnam at the time. The UK carried on using the 7.62 x 51 well into the 1980s (as with other posters here, it was the calibre that started my soldiering days with the L1A1 SLR). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossberg-operator Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 I was told that it is hard to get ammo for 303 apart from FMJ.. Any sources to buy expanding, pls? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Probably Tim Hanam will have some Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 http://www.henrykrank.com/index.php?main_page=index&manufacturers_id=18&sort=20a&page=7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.