the case for antique gun cases

[ShootyMagee]

Hello

 

I am new to the site so apologies if i have started a topic in the wrong forum.

I have a soft spot for old English SxS boxlocks. Dont know a great deal about them but i am learning as i go. I recently purchased a I Hollis & Sons boxlock in great condition from around 1925. The woodwork is better than any other shotgun I have seen / owned. The gun was sleeved in the 60's i believe but the tell tale marks arent too obvious. Bad news is it detracts from the value a bit, the good news for me is that i can and do shoot without worring about injury.

 

I have come across an I Hollis & Sons a motor case from roughly the same period in ok condition. The seller is asking more than i paid for the gun which in all honestly i think i got cheaply (£320). I didnt buy the Hollis to turn a buck, but we all like to feel we got good deal. My questions is I suppose will the case add any significant value to the gun should i choose to sell it?

I have bought a 1970's AYA 25SL which came in a lovely case but I dont think I paid over the odds because of the case.

Because its an old Hollis would it make sense to purchase the case? I realise its not a Purdey but if it was then it would be a no brainer.

 

 

 

[Scully]

Hard to say really. I'm no expert but it would certainly add to the value of your gun, but by any significant amount greater than the value of both combined I doubt, and certainly not to offset the value of a sleeved gun.

Personally a gun being sleeved wouldn't bother me; if I wanted it I'd get it regardless, and I think it is a great alternative to the alternative if you see what I mean, by keeping guns in everyday use which would possibly otherwise be unsaleable.

There is a lengthy thread on here about re-sleeving guns and the pros and cons if you care to do as search.

[ShootyMagee]

Thanks for that Scully. I have enjoyed shooting the Hollis which i can do with confidence thanks to being sleeved. I will have a gander at the re-sleeving threads but i suspect it all depends on wether you collect, trade or shoot. I doubt theres is any profit in it, (the case is £360 but i will make an offer) i will buy just as a nice thing to have in my gunroom / man cave. Most english guns from this era that are in cases seem to command big money which precludes me from ownership so the matching of the Hollis and the case for just under £700 seems an ok move.

[dougall]

clearly this is not an investment plan,as sleeved guns have ltd resale market etc.A period case does command good money and as you like the gun(and for the best reasons ie shooting it)! I would get the case as a good looking/shootable english gun nicely cased for £700 aint no bad thing!...

[bruno22rf]

Hollis made a plethora of guns in a vast range of grades-you might even have a Belgium made example that would have been supplied in a cardboard box, the quality of the wood is explained by the simple fact that the world was awash with decent Walnut and many "Farmers" guns of that period were adorned with better wood than a modern high grade gun can boast. If it is English then it was born in Brum as like as not even though Hollis had offices in London. But.....even IF it is a low grade English made gun then it has the envious pedigree of having been built by the best Gunmakers the world has ever seen-if you want to put it in a case then do it because the gun deserves to be treated with respect and not because it will add to her value, what you have is a piece of living history and someone has considered the gun of sufficient quality to have her sleeved (many, many fine English guns have not been so fortunate and have been scrapped) so she has enough charisma to warrant someone spending their hard earned on her-may I suggest you do the same. BTW....if you get the case you will spend the rest of your life trying to find the missing accessories

Edited January 19, 2016 by bruno22rf

[reidler]

I was looking for and bought an old English boxlock this year. From what I saw whether they came cased or not didn't make much difference to the asking price. I got one with mine, and they are a nice thing to have but realistically there's not much use for them these days.

[saddler]

I've rebuilt a good few such cases over the years

 

The value of them varies from not a lot to name your price - but it's all down to the perceived value in the buyers eye/how much use the case is in itself

 

Would love to find one of the more modern (70's/80's) Browning made ones for the Auto 5

[JohnfromUK]

Personally - I would buy the case - because the gun and case would make a nice set. Then look out on online auctions to find some nice Hollis accessories. Hollis is a nice sound gun usually, and whilst sleeving does reduce value, sometimes its what you have to do. You won't have a set worth a fortune, but you will have a nice usable set from a respected maker. Bear in mind that cases easily get damp and the old felt can be quite quick to start rust if you use the case in 'anger'. Also check that the case will take you barrel and stock lengths (its not usually a problem, but occasionally cases were genuinely made for a particular gun - and that gun may have had short barrels which were popular in the 'between war and a bit after' years.

 

My only 'criticism' (if you can call it that) would be the implication that you feel safer using it than original barrels; my view is that sleeved barrels are no more or less 'safe' than 'in proof' originals. I'm happy to have/use a sleeved gun, but don't feel any safer than an original gun (in proof or re-rpoof).

 

Enjoy your Hollis

[panoma1]

If you buy a case for a particular gun buy one that suits! A lower to medium grade gun would have a canvas and leather case, a high grade gun may have an oak and leather case, a lower quality gun in a top quality antique oak and leather case looks a bit naff!

Someone on here was selling a nice Brady leather gun case a while ago for a good price (£150 I think?) this would be well worth consideration, you could always obtain a reproduction Hollis trade label to stick in it!

Edited January 19, 2016 by panoma1

[Feltwad]

You could buy a canvas or leather case depending on the guns period of when it was made without the interior and restore it yourself , over the years i have done a lot it is not a hard job and for a label you can always buy a copy if you can not find an original. A gun always sell better in a case.

Feltwad

[ShootyMagee]

This is my first foray into PW and i am very gratetful for all the great advice and experience shared on this thread.

I have feeling this gun has been cherished. I treat my meagre collection of guns with care but this Hollis has less dings than my Silver Pigeon i bought new. The gun has a small bronze plate on the stock with W.B. engraved in fancy letters. This type of thing always facinates me. I Hope old W.B. is looking down (or up?) happy that his gun will be looked after and probably passed to my son in the fullness of time. In response John from UK the makers mark looks to be 1925 which i (probably incorrectly) assumed may influence whether moden cartidges could be fired. That said it was sleeved in the 60's which isnt exactly modern i suppose. Incidently i couldnt tell it was sleeved until i opened her up and had a look at the proof marks. The joins are almost invisible. Prior to viewing the gun i had researched what marks to look for date etc, as a total novice the innards confused the heck out of me until a customer in the shop at the time kindly explained the life of the gun as though he was reading hieroglyphics. It does have the B'ham mark so can i assume it was made in the UK? Anyway i tend to rattle on. i will consider other options for a case before i part with the not inconsiderable sum asked for the I Hollis car case.

[JohnfromUK]

In response John from UK the makers mark looks to be 1925 which i (probably incorrectly) assumed may influence whether moden cartidges could be fired. That said it was sleeved in the 60's which isnt exactly modern i suppose.

There are three main things to observe when using modern cartridges in older guns (in good condition);

1. The gun MUST be both in proof and for the cartridges to be used. In practice - these days that will mean (apart from specialist cartridges) NITRO proof. A gun sleeved in the 60s will be nitro proof, but you should (any dealer would have done this when you bought it) be sure it is in proof.
2. You should be aware that many (the majority) of English guns will be 2 1/2" chambers. Some a 2 3/4", but most 2 1/2" You should (despite what some American websites may say) NOT use 2 3/4" (70 mm) or longer cartridges in a 2 1/2" chamber. 2 1/2 cartridges in 2 3/4 chambers is OK, but 2 3/4 cartridges in 2 1/2 chambers is NOT. Use 2 1/2, 65mm, or 67mm - which are widely available in the UK, but many cartridges are 70mm, so be careful. Personally I use Hull Comp X for clays and Hull Imperial Game for my old guns. I think both of these are fine cartridges.
3. You should not exceed the load stated on the proof marks. Most older s/s guns are light and are better suited to 28 grammes (1 oz.) or less, but don't exceed the load on the proof marks. Generally, 2 1/2 chambers will be proofed for 1 1/8 Oz, which is 32 grammes - intended for regular use with 1 1/16 Oz, which was the old standard game load (30g). 2 3/4 chambers were usually proofed for 1 1/4 Oz (34g) intended for use with the old 1 1/8 Oz (32g) cartridge.

 

Finally, look after an older gun. The modern chrome lined barrels (e.g. your Beretta) resist corrosion better than older steel - so clean after use and enjoy using it.

[ShootyMagee]

proper good advice! Thanks. Will use the Hull Comp X going forward.