Fox - breed management? NOT for pest control

[iano]

Question for you guys:

 

I'll shoot foxes with the rifle, quite happily.

 

However, over here in Ireland the breed has become quite awful. There are a lot of weedy looking foxes, a lot of inbreeding and general over population.

 

If I see a fox that is in good nick and condition, I won't shoot it unless asked to. However if I'm out and about and see a mangy looking thing, I will go for it.

 

I was chatting to some people who do a lot of foxing and they actually go for the 'trophy' foxes, which to my mind is weaking out an already stressed breed.

 

Would be interested in getting your opinions? To be clear - if the fox is vexing a farmer then fine, but when that isn't case, would you follow breed management practices in the same way that most deer stalkers I know do?

[Scully]

In my experience I've found most if not all foxes are shot on sight, and actively pursued with this intent uppermost in the mind, regardless of their condition.

I don't know of anyone who weeds out the infirm, elderly, or injured as some would as deer management as any shooters I know regard fox as vermin.

[iano]

In my experience I've found most if not all foxes are shot on sight, and actively pursued with this intent uppermost in the mind, regardless of their condition.

I don't know of anyone who weeds out the infirm, elderly, or injured as some would as deer management as any shooters I know regard fox as vermin.

 

We have cattle, so foxes don't cause us loss. It is rare to see a good specimen and if I do and have the gun, I won't take the shot.

 

I guess if you were in sheepland, then all will be shot.

[scotslad]

Some of the old keepers would do exactly as u suggest iano, if they or farmers were not getting any problems by a fox would leave it as obviously fit, healthy and clever enough to be finding food without eating farm stock/chickens.

And if it is a big healthy fox it should be holding a far bigger territiory than a smaller weaker fox so less foxes on ur ground

 

Stalkers used to use a similar principle in leaving big bucks in vurnerable yong trees to keep all the young bucks of the crop (the stand buck) nowadays pretty much shot on sight the same as foxes.

 

Wotever ur views on hunting it was/is far better at keeping the fox population fit and healthy as generally hound will only catch weaker older foxes

[bluesj]

Some of the old keepers would do exactly as u suggest iano, if they or farmers were not getting any problems by a fox would leave it as obviously fit, healthy and clever enough to be finding food without eating farm stock/chickens.

And if it is a big healthy fox it should be holding a far bigger territiory than a smaller weaker fox so less foxes on ur ground

 

Stalkers used to use a similar principle in leaving big bucks in vurnerable yong trees to keep all the young bucks of the crop (the stand buck) nowadays pretty much shot on sight the same as foxes.

 

Wotever ur views on hunting it was/is far better at keeping the fox population fit and healthy as generally hound will only catch weaker older foxes

Unfortunately the animal rights lot don't look at the species just the individuals

[iano]

Wotever ur views on hunting it was/is far better at keeping the fox population fit and healthy as generally hound will only catch weaker older foxes

 

It does / doesn't.

 

I've no problems at all with hunting to hounds, but nowadays (in Ireland at least) with ribbon development and less old style farmers, the hunts just aren't getting the runs they used to so having a smaller impact on the foxes. You also see that the 'average' rider on a hunt now now wouldn't be able to hack what hunts used to do as they just don't get the runs and their horse experience would be a lot more limited than say 20 years ago.

[scotslad]

Must admit changed in scotland a lot since the 'ban' but the other way, now u have to 'hunt' the fox to standing guns so essentially a fox drive with horses looking on.

 

Now if 4 foxes break cover out of 1 wood all 4 could potentially be shot, so far better for vermin control but less good for foxes themselves or 'breed management'

If a fox is wounded (does occasionally happen with a gun) the hounds are allowed to chase and get a kill

 

Think nowadays with alomst all shooting all about the numbers and shoot on sight wether deer, fox or pheasant

[Useless Keeper]

Hi All

 

What a great subject raised by Iano with excellent contributions by Scotslad and Scully,

 

The reality is that foxes are regarded as vermin and fair game by the majority of shooters and has in fact become a sport in its own right, with the most modern and expensive paraphernalia being used to shoot them at ridiculous ranges.

 

They don't care if the farmer is losing lambs, and in fact the more the better as the opportunities for their 'sport' increases.

 

It is of course based on machismo, disguised as pest control, by trigger happy numpties who shoot from air conditioned pick-trucks and get a thrill out of 'blowing away' an animal which has adapted and survived for thousands of years.

 

If they're up for a real challenge (and they won't be), try a few days wildfowling in December or January - I think not......

 

Well done Iano for raising such a thought provoking subject - alas, it's a shame that those who it's aimed at will probably never read your excellent article.

 

Thanks

 

 

[kennett]

Hang on, I shoot foxes from an air conditioned pick up truck, sometimes with NV, to look after my pheasant poults. BUT I also go out on the Marsh wildfowling. So what does that mean for me?!

[bluesj]

Hang on, I shoot foxes from an air conditioned pick up truck, sometimes with NV, to look after my pheasant poults. BUT I also go out on the Marsh wildfowling. So what does that mean for me?!

Busy

[oowee]

Hi All

 

What a great subject raised by Iano with excellent contributions by Scotslad and Scully,

Agreed

 

The reality is that foxes are regarded as vermin and fair game by the majority of shooters and has in fact become a sport in its own right, with the most modern and expensive paraphernalia being used to shoot them at ridiculous ranges.

Best equipment available sounds sensible. Ridiculous range? Not sure what that is?

 

They don't care if the farmer is losing lambs, and in fact the more the better as the opportunities for their 'sport' increases.

Really? That could be said of pigeon shooters but not true from my experience

 

It is of course based on machismo, disguised as pest control, by trigger happy numpties who shoot from air conditioned pick-trucks and get a thrill out of 'blowing away' an animal which has adapted and survived for thousands of years.

Whys that then or is that any shooter or anyone you dont know or anyone else.

 

If they're up for a real challenge (and they won't be), try a few days wildfowling in December or January - I think not......

Why?

 

Well done Iano for raising such a thought provoking subject - alas, it's a shame that those who it's aimed at will probably never read your excellent article.

 

Thanks

Yes thx lano what a shame that there are some so ready to imply disrepute on other sportsman following there own branch of the sport.

 

[sako751sg]

Must,not,feed!

[iano]

Taking a bit of heat out here; personally, I see what I do as being responsible for making sure that the best of the breed continues.

 

Sometimes I won't be able to do this (being asked to take out a problem animal) but in general, this is what I try to do.

It seems though, that speaking to some people who do a lot of fox shooting that this isn't the primary concern.

[kennett]

No it isn't, the primary concern is not letting valuable stock be eaten or in my case nearly £4000 of my syndicates hard earned money put into pheasants. Unfortunately a a wise and noble dog fox will kill just as many as a mangy old cub. No matter how hard I shoot I'm never going to wipe them out, and I'm not really trying to!