Zetter Posted November 11, 2017 Report Share Posted November 11, 2017 Can anyone give me any advice on what is causing rust in my .17 Hornet barrel? Its a CZ527 that I have had from new and I clean it religiously after every use. I normally run a couple of wet patches through with Patchout on them, followed by a few strokes with a nylon brush, leave to soak for a bit and then patch through until clean. finally I usually put an oily patch through for storage which I mop out before I go shooting. However today when I was going out with the rimfires I just checked the CZ barrel in the light and could see a load of cack in it which was odd. So I took it into the garage and ran a patch through it and was slightly horrified to find it came out pretty brown with rust. I have given the barrel a thorough clean again and put a few oil soaked patches through again for storage but it seemed to be a fair amount of rust as initially I could almost feel a bit of resistance pushing the patch through about half way along the barrel. I cant work out what causing this as I am not leaving the barrel dirty after use and am not doing a harsh cleaning regime I am careful when cleaning not to be too harsh. Do I just have a rust prone barrel? Also as it was a new rifle is there any mileage in going back to Edgar Brothers on it especially as I have restocked it, or would I get the fair wear and tear comment? Finally is there any products anyone can recommend to use going forward to prevent this if its going to keep being an issue? I am going to try it off the bench this week to see if accuracy has been affected which would be a real blow on a one year old gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted November 11, 2017 Report Share Posted November 11, 2017 If its definately rust ,than is has to be down to water or something corrosive . Is it getting damp in the cabinet or have you picked up something on your cleaning patches . harnser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zetter Posted November 11, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2017 Cabinet is the same one that I have my rimfires in and there is no sign of any external corrosion at all on any of the rifles including around the thread for the mod which is essentially bare steel. Also cabinet is bone dry. All I have ever used to clean the gun is patch out which seems to do a good job and supposedly had anti corrosion agents in it. Also I have generally put an oil patch through after the patch out. Other possibility is its carbon fouling coming off which is supposed to be brown on the patches when you use patchout. Seems a bit strange though as I am brushing through the bore after use which I think should clear it. I may need to find someone with a suitable calibre borescope to check for certain what is going on in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted November 11, 2017 Report Share Posted November 11, 2017 Condensation? Do you transfer the gun from a cold place to a warm one during cleaning? Just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zetter Posted November 11, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2017 Normally clean in the garage and then back into house but I do let the gun warm up before putting it away so I don't leave condensation on the barrel and action Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
telf Posted November 11, 2017 Report Share Posted November 11, 2017 the fella off "point of impact " on you tube had the same problem with his,he scrapped his but wasnt sure what the cause was Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerCat Posted November 11, 2017 Report Share Posted November 11, 2017 Are you leaving the mod on it when you put it to bed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mick miller Posted November 11, 2017 Report Share Posted November 11, 2017 (edited) Same rifle, same calibre, same routine, same cleaning products. I haven't noticed rust but I generally don't leave oil in (unless left for a long period) but will patch through and then finish off with a degreasing agent (isopropyl) before storing. I store with the mod off, bolt out, barrel up. Edited November 11, 2017 by mick miller Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zetter Posted November 11, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2017 Mod off, Bolt out, barrel up the same as you Mick I cant fathom it out at all I cant see any reason the bore would rust Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mick miller Posted November 12, 2017 Report Share Posted November 12, 2017 Me either, I need to check my barrel when I get home this evening. It' been sitting there a week in the cabinet, which is attached to a cool wall. I'll patch through and see if I get the same as you or a clean patch instead. It has to be moisture induced, you may need to dehumidify the room your safe is in. What oil do you use? I have only ever used KROIL in my rifle bores. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted November 12, 2017 Report Share Posted November 12, 2017 I doubt very much it's rust. Give it a good scrub with a phosphor bronze brush, and I mean a good scrub and keep cleaning until not a trace of muck shows on the patches. I bet this solves it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooter Posted November 12, 2017 Report Share Posted November 12, 2017 I own the same rifle and it gets used a lot. The only rust I have ever seen was from the mod, and a blast of WD40 in the threads before putting it away cured that problem. It sounds like you are cleaning the barrel far too much, the copper will help to protect the bore, and iron out the imperfections. So long as you remove the loose crud (dry patch or a pull through) it should be good to go back in the cabinet. If the groups open up, or you start to get pressure signs (carbon rings forming in the throat is not uncommon in the .17 Cal causing increased pressure) then clean it. Have a listen to George Gardner about cleaning, he knows what he is doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zetter Posted November 12, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2017 (edited) 7 hours ago, cooter said: I own the same rifle and it gets used a lot. The only rust I have ever seen was from the mod, and a blast of WD40 in the threads before putting it away cured that problem. It sounds like you are cleaning the barrel far too much, the copper will help to protect the bore, and iron out the imperfections. So long as you remove the loose crud (dry patch or a pull through) it should be good to go back in the cabinet. If the groups open up, or you start to get pressure signs (carbon rings forming in the throat is not uncommon in the .17 Cal causing increased pressure) then clean it. Have a listen to George Gardner about cleaning, he knows what he is doing. To be fair and he knows a lot more than me but I cant see how cleaning the gun regularly causes rusting in the bore. With my .17 I would be more worried with too much copper and fouling build up causing pressure issues eventually Edited November 12, 2017 by Zetter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooter Posted November 13, 2017 Report Share Posted November 13, 2017 12 hours ago, Zetter said: To be fair and he knows a lot more than me but I cant see how cleaning the gun regularly causes rusting in the bore. With my .17 I would be more worried with too much copper and fouling build up causing pressure issues eventually I doubt that copper fouling will cause pressure signs in your Hornet. The copper will smooth out the imperfections in the bore, then level its self out, in the same way lead works in an air rifle (not a perfect explanation but an outline of how the gunsmith explained it to me). Obviously there is a point where copper could become a problem, but what George was eluding to in the video is that it could be as many as 500 shots without cleaning before you would notice any problem. Carbon will build up, and can cause pressure build up, and from reading some of your previous posts you have been using Lil Gun, which is a known dirty powder. DO63 and Vhit powders tend to be clean burning, so less carbon. Post 2, 4 10 and 11 all point to the same thing water/moisture. If this is the case then put a low wattage thermostatically controlled panel heater in the gun safe and leave it in there. I did this many years ago in my old house, which was damp, as a preventative measure and never saw any sings of rust, not even on the outside of the untreated barrels. A true test for damp is to place an untreated piece of mild steel in the gun safe, and check it after a few days, or better still leave it for a week. Any rust and you have a damp problem (get the heater in there). Personally I would never leave a (muzzle up) rifle with any oil in the barrel. The oil will run back into the chamber and eventually into the action, and as oil attracts dust you will end up having to do a full strip down and clean out. Always patch out the barrel with meths to remove any traces of lube or barrel treatments before use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zetter Posted November 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2017 Cheers Cooter The steel idea is a great one I hadnt considered I will try it out Zetter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 Where is the cabinet An uncleaned barrel that's been shot will attract moisture faster than a barrel that's not been shot. If you clean as you say and patch through with oil before storing I can't see why your getting rust. I've never used an oil patch through any barrel I've had and never seen rust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zetter Posted November 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 Cabinet is in the house so its not in a damp area also shotguns are in with it and they have shown no rust signs? Only thing I can think of is weather the patchout solution is causing it? Although I do swab it out thoroughly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 I've used patch out wipe out and accelerator for some years without problems. I'm still convinced it's not rust. I would have it borescoped to see if you can find the cause of the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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