AYA117 Posted April 17, 2018 Report Share Posted April 17, 2018 39 minutes ago, panoma1 said: I still have the Ugartechea SLE, I bought new from a long defunct shop in Worcester.........£75.00 I believe it cost me in the early 70's, I had it refinished, anglicised and regulated by A A Browns. Still in good nick, on the face and the bores are unmarked. Any chance of a picture ? I wonder if there would be any chance of having a ' Side by Side Club' on here ? There is already a 'Pump Club' ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ips Posted April 17, 2018 Report Share Posted April 17, 2018 SxS club, good idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldypigeonpopper Posted April 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2018 (edited) 8 hours ago, JJsDad said: It may do with the clay shooters and re-loaders, but to most Pigeon and Game shooters the majority in my experience dont give a jot what the MV is. I am in a walk / stand syndicate with around 12 full guns and a further 6 half guns, we shoot fibre wad only at the farmers request; while most of our members could quote you the shot load of their prefered cartridge and its size, plus how much they cost; I would place a small wager not one of them could quote the velocity. High velocity loads work in both directions and I have known more than one of our members complain about excessive recoil from a particular cartridge, with the comment they wont be buying that make again. Out of curiosity I have just looked at 3 different boxes of game loads (Eley, Hull & Lyvale) and it is only the later who quotes the MV on the carton. Apologies to the OP, we started off talking about side x sides and have got sidetracked into what cartridges to feed them on. hello, if you mean me JJ its no worry i still find these new grams to the ounce confusing looking at a 28g i consider 1 oz,/ 30g 1/1/16oz 32g 1 1/4 oz, Edited April 17, 2018 by oldypigeonpopper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AYA117 Posted April 17, 2018 Report Share Posted April 17, 2018 11 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said: hello, if you mean me JJ its no worry i still find these new grams to the ounce confusing looking at a 28g i consider 1 oz,/ 30g 1/1/16oz 32g 1 1/4 oz, I know what you mean ! But 32g is 1 1/8 oz, 34g is 1 3/16oz (the old Eley Maximim and Hull Hullmax) 36g is 11/4oz. If we get a Side by Side club on here can we make it a rule to use imperial measurements ! Barrels are always quoted in inches as is LOP ,so why not shot weight ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 9 hours ago, AYA117 said: I know what you mean ! But 32g is 1 1/8 oz, 34g is 1 3/16oz (the old Eley Maximim and Hull Hullmax) 36g is 11/4oz. If we get a Side by Side club on here can we make it a rule to use imperial measurements ! Barrels are always quoted in inches as is LOP ,so why not shot weight ? we are in Europe, and everything needs to be metric. even shot weight. it is often confused some people what the 28g is on the side of a cartridge and it has sadly been miss interpreted by some very un knowledgeable cowboy reloaders. i have heard it happened to a local guy by me who destroyed a gun by loading up 28 grain of powder under 1,1/8oz of shot. essentially everyone survived, the chamber took it, but the gun was FUBAR. same thing that happened when they reloaded 3" shells and put them in a 2,3/4" chamber. that went really wrong. what the guy did was interpret data and change everything. this was also the common mistake by that reputable RFD who ill advised online, for all to see. even the key now is to match cartridges to shotguns because you can get a HP high pressure 1050bar 70mm shell, and it fits in standard proofed 70mm gun and will fire. its all about knowing what shells to buy and use. dont get me started on dram equivalents. there is nothing finer than a high quality component shell, manufactured to very high tollerences, speeds not excessive of 1200, but with a "relative" fast powder causing very clean burn with stunning energy transfer at above average loadings. that is a brilliant combination for exellent internal ballistics, and will often prove to produce patterns with many a barrel and choking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AYA117 Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 2 minutes ago, cookoff013 said: even the key now is to match cartridges to shotguns because you can get a HP high pressure 1050bar 70mm shell, and it fits in standard proofed 70mm gun and will fire. its all about knowing what shells to buy and use. Yes, the JK6 T5 is just such a cartridge. I am not in Europe, long live Imperial measurements Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldypigeonpopper Posted April 18, 2018 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 9 hours ago, AYA117 said: I know what you mean ! But 32g is 1 1/8 oz, 34g is 1 3/16oz (the old Eley Maximim and Hull Hullmax) 36g is 11/4oz. If we get a Side by Side club on here can we make it a rule to use imperial measurements ! Barrels are always quoted in inches as is LOP ,so why not shot weight ? hello, did i get it wrong on the 32g Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 I am a s/s user. I now rarely use my o/u guns, and use 15/16 oz or 1 oz (26 or 28g) on game and 3/4 oz (21g) on clays in a range of 12 bore s/s guns, English and AyA. One thing I have noticed is a (quite unnecessary in my view) push towards ever higher velocities. I would prefer a slightly lower velocity load, especially for clays. I currently use either Fiocchi TTi 21 or Hull CompX 21g. I have found both the Eley and Gamebore(?) 21g offerings to be at least as punchy in recoil as many 28g loads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 1 minute ago, oldypigeonpopper said: hello, did i get it wrong on the 32g yeah, but to be absolutely precise 1oz is 28.4 grams, thats a biscuit over our quoted 28grams. 1,1/8oz is 31.89 grams 1,1/4oz is 35.4 grams not the aforementioned 36g 1,1/2oz is 42.5 grams. i`m not a fan of high speeds. only where steel shot is concerned because its low density and poor external ballistics. but even then 1400fps seems to be a reloading staple. these high speed loads are always reduced payload and high powder charges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AYA117 Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 And yet people talk about grams of shot and grains of powder, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AYA117 Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 (edited) Oh and fps Funny old world ain't it Edited April 18, 2018 by AYA117 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 yeah, funny old world. i work in a lab and we certainly measure milligrams, micrograms, nanograms, picograms and lower, 10to the negative 21. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJsDad Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 (edited) 20 hours ago, oldypigeonpopper said: hello, if you mean me JJ its no worry i still find these new grams to the ounce confusing looking at a 28g i consider 1 oz,/ 30g 1/1/16oz 32g 1 1/4 oz, Yes; you started the topic by discussing side x sides & prices and I felt it was being `highjacked` into a discussion concerning cartridges and re-loading. Edited April 18, 2018 by JJsDad Spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old farrier Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 22 minutes ago, JJsDad said: Yes; you started the post by discussing side x sides & prices and I felt it was being `highjacked` into a discussion concerning cartridges and re-loading. Sort of relevant for me as I shoot older Guns and struggling with soft shooting hard hitting loads not a lot of point having them if you don’t shoot them would be really interested in any black powder loads for 12 bore paper and brass cases Although if you prefer I can start another thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AYA117 Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 So (back on topic) who would be interested in a 'Side by Side' club on here and how do we go about it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJsDad Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 Just now, AYA117 said: who would be interested in a 'Side by Side' club on here and how do we go about it ? Seems like a stunning plan; there seems to have been considerable interest created by oldpigeonpoppers original topic. No idea how its set up, can only assume a note to one of the Moderators would tell us if its feasible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old farrier Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 1 minute ago, JJsDad said: Seems like a stunning plan; there seems to have been considerable interest created by oldpigeonpoppers original topic. No idea how its set up, can only assume a note to one of the Moderators would tell us if its feasible. Good idea should definatly ask a moderator although cake will be the best plan allegedly they may be bribed with cake ? in moderators castle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AYA117 Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 Do any of the moderators use a SBS ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJsDad Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 14 minutes ago, Old farrier said: would be really interested in any black powder loads for 12 bore paper and brass cases Although if you prefer I can start another thread I apologised to oldpigeonpopper for veering off his topic which was on side by side resurgence. The forum guidlines are that we try to avoid going off subject. Its not for me to tell you to start a new topic, but if you have a particular interest in black powder loads, a new topic would probably bring you a flood of replies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AYA117 Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 As a minority, should we not get special treatment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJsDad Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, AYA117 said: So (back on topic) who would be interested in a 'Side by Side' club on here and how do we go about it ? I suspect a new topic should be started to gauge the interest of the overall membership in such a proposal. If there was, for example 200 plus members all giving their thumbs up to such a proposal it could then be put to the Moderatora for consideration. However if the idea is limited to a handful of members the admin effort to set it up would probably be wasted. I personally have no idea how easy or difficult it is to modify the site to include a seperate "Club". It must have been done before, because I cant believe the forum initially started up with a `Pumpers` Club. Further to my last sentence above. I note from the web that the forum started in 2001; the "Pump-guns Club" started in 2013, so it can be done if there is sufficient interest ! Edited April 18, 2018 by JJsDad Additional info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AYA117 Posted April 18, 2018 Report Share Posted April 18, 2018 Started a thread, now lets see what happens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AYA117 Posted April 19, 2018 Report Share Posted April 19, 2018 On 11/04/2018 at 09:02, oldypigeonpopper said: Hello, while sat here looking out the window on a dreary day having another cuppa while peruse ing this fine forum, and having seen on PW sales ads for nice older spanish boxlocks has this market realy out lost to the very popular O/U semi auto, or pumper, i spoke to a RFD monday who has a room full of unwanted S/S going for scrap, back in the early 1970s i saved realy hard to buy my very first spanish 12 bore an ASI yeoman boxlock non ejector for £38.50 and that was an early import, 45 years on and you can buy one or other make for very little money even BOGOF from some ads i see, so to us older generation on PW can you remember what you paid for yours? or anyone remember what price for the english equivalent, A big thank you to you, it was this post that may well have started the Side by Side Club Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Boggy Posted April 19, 2018 Report Share Posted April 19, 2018 On 4/17/2018 at 10:34, panoma1 said: Ah! The Grange Gun co! A great place, in the middle of no where! I remember it well...if I recall A Mr Caldecott and David (Name escapes me) ran it, my brother bought a C G Bonehill BLNE from them in the late 60's (he still has it, pitting and all! Lol!) I had a Grange gun company BA .410, got my first mallard with it! Then you may remember the gunsmith Mike M. who I`ve just visited, served his apprenticeship there I guess in the 60s. He did say that the place was in the back of beyond. He showed me a BA .410 with their name on it. Coincidence or what !! OB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldypigeonpopper Posted April 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2018 2 hours ago, AYA117 said: A big thank you to you, it was this post that may well have started the Side by Side Club hello, thanks AYA, i still hanker after a boxlock XXV but will need to sell my Victor Sarasqueta 6EC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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