For all you None belivers

[tulkyuk]

If someone has both on their ticket, it might be a good thing to do a more real world type test.

 

Simulated hunting conditions (ranges, targets etc) matching for both rifles, call it the zero range or the average distance you normally shoot at with the calibre, targets that react in the same way to a hit (thinking gelatin filled something) and the same sort of ammunition as hunting (expanding in both cases)

 

Just get a couple of camcorders, a dB meter or two and do the test. Noise level at the muzzel, noise level at the impact, impact of shot, damage etc could all be recorded and then worked into a three minute clip.

Might try that this weekend, i'll post the results as soon as i have done them :unsure:

 

thats if i get time though as the pigeons are coming in well up here

[davo]

just got in from rabbiting only got 6 but all were from 50 odd yards to about 100 i doubt i could have have done that with an air rifle at 32ftlb or a 22 rim using subs. nearly all were head shots apart from one which was a chest shot because of the angle ect, but all died where they were shot.

 

 

Confused , why couldn't this be done with 32ft lb Fac air or .22lr Subs, stretching out beyond the limits at 100yds for the Fac air but .22lr subs, definite killing range IMO.

[fieldwanderer]

just my 2p, and I'm sure I'll have people jumping up and down;

 

I don't own a .17 and, apart from the odd video I've seen on here, I've never seen one used but :-

 

I shoot rabbits nearly every day with a .22lr (cz 453), my scope (simmons 6-24 x 50) is zeroed at 25, 50, 80 and 150yds (elevations noted on my phone).

 

Now, I'm an experienced target shooter and a few years ago was very much on my way to the common wealth games (college and women made a mess of that though) and I regularly shoot rabbits at 150yds using both hyper velocity (159ft/lbs) and subsonic ammunition (89ft/lbs) both at that range are very much capeable of spreading the contents of a rabbit's head all over the place - I usually do, to the amasement of my shooting buddy

 

The point is, the .22's a very useful tool and very quiet and, though I'd love to try a .17, I felt someone needed to stand up for the good old .22!

 

For the record though - I once shot a full beer can with 11.8ft/lb .177 air rifle which had similar results to the .17 in the video

[henry d]

just got in from rabbiting only got 6 but all were from 50 odd yards to about 100 i doubt i could have have done that with an air rifle at 32ftlb or a 22 rim using subs. nearly all were head shots apart from one which was a chest shot because of the angle ect, but all died where they were shot.

 

 

Confused , why couldn't this be done with 32ft lb Fac air or .22lr Subs, stretching out beyond the limits at 100yds for the Fac air but .22lr subs, definite killing range IMO.

 

 

Me too M8

[luckytrigger]

I have 22lr and .17 and although i really rate .17 i would never get rid of the .22 as the ammo is so cheap and more readily available plus its virtually silent in use a serious consideration on one of my shoots. I also just like cranking off rounds with the semi auto

[Devilishdave]

just my 2p, and I'm sure I'll have people jumping up and down;

 

I don't own a .17 and, apart from the odd video I've seen on here, I've never seen one used but :-

 

I shoot rabbits nearly every day with a .22lr (cz 453), my scope (simmons 6-24 x 50) is zeroed at 25, 50, 80 and 150yds (elevations noted on my phone).

 

Now, I'm an experienced target shooter and a few years ago was very much on my way to the common wealth games (college and women made a mess of that though) and I regularly shoot rabbits at 150yds using both hyper velocity (159ft/lbs) and subsonic ammunition (89ft/lbs) both at that range are very much capeable of spreading the contents of a rabbit's head all over the place - I usually do, to the amasement of my shooting buddy

 

The point is, the .22's a very useful tool and very quiet and, though I'd love to try a .17, I felt someone needed to stand up for the good old .22!

 

For the record though - I once shot a full beer can with 11.8ft/lb .177 air rifle which had similar results to the .17 in the video

 

 

That is a disgusting waste of a full can of beer you should be ashamed of your self!!

 

dave

[fieldwanderer]

That is a disgusting waste of a full can of beer you should be ashamed of your self!!

 

dave

 

Yeah, good point mate, but I found it in a lake while fishing and it looked like it'd been there a while so I deemed it a suitable target

 

speaking of which........... what a great idea, Mmmmmm - beer! lol

 

On a more serious note, I'd never put the .17 down as I know very little about them, I may even get one one day - the .243 ruger in the gun shop's much more appealing though (just wish I could afford the £650 price tag) I just felt it only right to defend the humble .22 as it's kept me happy on and off the range for the last 10 years

[dunganick]

HMR is just alot faster and expanding, a .22 hornet would make it look like an airgun.

 

HMR is not a miracle round, its just a step up from the .22lr and has its place. But sometimes people like to talk up its true capabilities.

[ChrisDavey]

Hey dont forget at 3p a round and with the right choice of round, you can run amock with wabbits with a .22lr and get the job done 10/10 for less than a pint of beer

 

17HMR hats off to you for brute force, that coke can wont be taking any more hens

 

I see that I will oly get a 17HMR when my field craft gets so appauling I cant get to within 100m or my Range Rover Vogue gets too shiny to get close - like hell

[Tony9r]

just got in from rabbiting only got 6 but all were from 50 odd yards to about 100 i doubt i could have have done that with an air rifle at 32ftlb or a 22 rim using subs.

 

You are joking right... :good:

[Fisherman Mike]

Ive shot cans with my .22 subs and also with my .17 hmr and to be honest the hole was almost the same size....!!!! me thinks theres some trickery afoot

[Ferret Master]

I've shaken up a can of Boddingtons and a .22 airgun pellet which passed straight through the widget blew the can skywards.

 

Ok, shaken is an understatement; we played rugby with it for 10 mins.

 

FM

[plinker]

they both have there uses and to be honest i would not choose between the 2 . i love the range of my hmr but the .22 is so quiet i use it more as i shoot on some dairy farms.another big plus on the .22 is it never loses zero whereas when the .17 needs a clean it drops of zero which can be so frustrating but 150yd bunnies next time out and all is forgiven.

plinker

[Jon-Boy]

I own both and both as good as each other.

 

 

Out shooting from the back of the landie last night, i had me new HMR my mate his .22, bunnie count was about 50/50 between us

 

Both do the job of bunny bashin for which we buy these tools for

 

end of

[codling99]

i only do lamping for bunnies,so 17 out of question for me. likes the quietness of .22,and as for hitting them at 100 yds,ive done it on occasions not easy but gun will do the job if you can hit them.and as for beyond 100 yds ,get a centrefire much easier.

[the pelt man]

Ive shot cans with my .22 subs and also with my .17 hmr and to be honest the hole was almost the same size....!!!! me thinks theres some trickery afoot

 

 

Rabgoat has already spotted that when the clip shows the HMR round hitting the can that it is full of liquid, when the .22 round is shown the can is empty.

 

This clip only shows that the Guy loves HMR and is trying to win a point by showing what he has shown. All he has done is shown that he has to con us that the HMR can cause far greater damage than the .22, but if both cans were empty the results would be much the same.

 

Please note i agree that both rounds have there place, but he was showing a range of 50 yards which i would rather use .22 unless shooting fox.

 

So i think the clip is ****

 

PELTMAN

[hill billy]

i agree with wookie if i want to shoot a rabbit then i use my .22 rimfire if i want to shot the diffrence between shooting a can and blowing it to bit il shoot it with my 22-250 it don't prove nout people and it aint fair shooting the can with solid nose target rounds and a high velocity ballistic tipped round

[P03]

It is unfair to compare the .17 HMR to the .22 LR. The HMR is a MAGNUM round, it is a necked down .22WMR (360 lbs ft with a 40 gr bullet for those of you wondering) and is therefore in a completely different category of rimfire round. What I'd like to see is that bloke on the vid hit the can at 50 yds, with the HMR, with a 10 knot sidewind. Don't get me wrong, I'm not slagging off the HMR but it does,like most rounds, have it's weaknesses.

[SAVAGE HMR]

If you pay close attention to the video you'll notice a serious flaw in this experiment. The can shot with the .22LR is empty hence the bullet travels through it without interruption, where as the can shot with the .17 HMR was full of water thus making the can explode. Reason being then the bullet travels through the water with such force that it forces the water out of the can by ripping it apart. If you do the experiment on your own with two cans full of water the result will me more or less the same. In my opinion the HMR is better but for reasons other that what you just saw in that 'flawed' video.

[SAVAGE HMR]

Just so you know I use a .17 HMR

[fortune]

just my 2p, and I'm sure I'll have people jumping up and down;

 

I don't own a .17 and, apart from the odd video I've seen on here, I've never seen one used but :-

 

I shoot rabbits nearly every day with a .22lr (cz 453), my scope (simmons 6-24 x 50) is zeroed at 25, 50, 80 and 150yds (elevations noted on my phone).

 

Now, I'm an experienced target shooter and a few years ago was very much on my way to the common wealth games (college and women made a mess of that though) and I regularly shoot rabbits at 150yds using both hyper velocity (159ft/lbs) and subsonic ammunition (89ft/lbs) both at that range are very much capeable of spreading the contents of a rabbit's head all over the place - I usually do, to the amasement of my shooting buddy

 

The point is, the .22's a very useful tool and very quiet and, though I'd love to try a .17, I felt someone needed to stand up for the good old .22!

 

For the record though - I once shot a full beer can with 11.8ft/lb .177 air rifle which had similar results to the .17 in the video

 

I totally agree with the above. It wasn't all that long ago that almost no one had a 22centre fire. If anyone used a rifle for vermin it was a 22 rf. They were considered to have more than enough power to take out foxes ECT. It was always touted that they were capable of killing a man at a mile. It still has that message on the box flaps to this day. I remember when I got my first 22rf how powerful it was and how I took shots at tremendous ranges at rabbits. As far as I am concerned the HMR is a very clever sales pitch that has made people go out and buy one. If it hasn’t got enough punch why not get a 22rf magnum? I hear about how the 1.7 don’t ricochet like a 22rf, just like a FEO told me that a 22cf bullet wouldn’t ricochet like a 22rf . If a 22cf bullet hit a grass stem it would disintegrate. It’s statements like this that make you think, “How did this Muppet ever get chosen to be an FEO†The Home Office guidlines state that a .22 rf isn't powerful enough to shoot fox with so go and get another extra caliber so that you can.

[Floating Chamber]

I think he cheated! The can hit by the .17 seemed to contain water! Hydraulics!