Ferret Master Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 Hi, Just found this on YouTube: Doesn't portray us in a good light but I strongly suspect that the keeper had been provoked and also does the LACS 'monitor' have any rights to film a legitimate activity taking place on private land if they don't want him to? Surely that is an invasion of privacy and then to stick in on the internet is just not on. The keeper made the mistake of being aggressive, letting it get caught on film then letting him get away with the film. The word 'monitor' makes me sick. Since when did they have the powers to give themselves such titles. Sounds like some pathetic hall monitor at school with a shiny badge rather than a grown up adult human being. I bet it is his 'job' as well. It's about time they got a taste of their own medicine. We'll see how much they like it when their faces are plastered all over the internet for harassing innocent country people. I suppose all we can do now is rate it with 1 star. FM B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 I am no LACS sympathiser but this should be used as an example of how not to do it What a cock, no point getting into a row with anti's, that's what they want you to do. Be as pleasant as possible and show them where the footpath is, and as if they need a hand - being as they are lentil-loving emotionally damaged vegetarian weaklings they might well need one Seems this guy was just filming, different story if you have the more loony fringe descend and with ski-masks and baseball bats, but there you are. Mind you the only mistake they made was not getting the tape Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 Fair comments Pin but we have no way of knowing how much provocation had taken place up to the point where the vermin started rolling his film. I think the language was a bit harsh, maybe rolling his car onto its roof silently would have got the message across ( whilst claiming he had driven over a fox ). Not sure how the law stands with regard to the sad losers who see fit to " monitor " a perfectly legal past time filming people but one thing I am sure about - he deserved a bloody good hiding, shame he didnt get one. No different to what they have dished out since the 70`s, worm is turning slowly. Who knows, one of them who died on hunger strike may have their body disinterred and decapitated. Veiws above are mine alone and not representative of any other poster on this forum, its moderators or owner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 Surely one of the hardest things in life is dealing with people like this. The whole point of filming is intimidation, when engaged in a totally legal pastime such as this people shouldn't have to suffer this, however it is a fact of modern country life and we as a shooting community have to deal with it correctly. I have had screaming lunatic anti's on my permission and it's not pleasant, we as shooters need to suck it up and take it on the chin though, the whole point of filming, as said, is intimidation. We have to be nice to these people and if we are, they have nothing to show, nothing to incite the next generation of emotionally damaged freaks to fight "the cause". The single worst thing any of us can do is react, we don't need to. We don't do anything illegal, so why react. If the shooting community offered a nip of slo gin to every anti, well, what kind scene could you portray? Nothing they'd put on a website, leaflet or in any of those lame vids they seem to like so much Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 I agree with your points and as you say we are not breaking the law. However my concern is the way the intimidation, violence and worse was tolerated for decades but the hunting fraternity. Once they found their voice and protested in London against a threat the only response was a battering from cowards / thugs in police uniforms. I appreciate I may be clouding the issue by comparing hunting sabs with anti blood sports odd balls but they wont stop at hunting, they are targeting shooting now. Being nice to them is a very bitter pill to swallow after having had dealings with them, including my toddler being called a bitch. Not sure I would want my face plastered on yooftube but then again not sure yooftube would be happy for me to be on there either ( insert ugly smiley ). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malkiserow Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 How do we know this is not staged? An old judge I knew once had this advice..... "only believe a 1/3 of what you hear and 1/2 of what you see" The hard bit is which 1/3 and which 1/2.... Malk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 It's a lot harder to abstain than it is to participate, nobody is arguing that. Having been through it we both know how it feels to be on the wrong side of provocation, frustrating and demeaning. Don't loose sight of this video as an example. The film was worth nothing to LACS if the keeper didn't react. I feel for him and I would do the same in an instant if I didn't have sight of what it will do to our sport! I don't have any children yet Digger, one due November time, and already I have seen me change in defence of (it), I am a hothead and I have no idea how I would react in that situation you mention. I'd like to think I would keep it together but probably not, so respect to you for being honest! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tikkamark Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 I dont blame the keeper for reacting the way he did but it does not give shooters a great image mouthing off and threating to beat the treehugger up that tape should have been confiscated.A lot of them lacs members are just to ignorant to realise the amount of effort hunters/shooters put into conservation work and building and sustaining wildlife populations,all pheasants have a far better life outdoors than factory reared pigs/turkeys/chickens.if im correct forgive me if im wrong but i dont think there would be any pheasants in the wild in the uk or ireland if they were not hunted do them muppets(antis) not realise that Sickens me seeing that **** pin is dead right all they want is to get a violent reaction from the people there filming and they can then use this as propaganda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LEFTY478 Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 I said previously, the only thing wrong here was letting the film tape leave the shoot, that and not giving the cameraman an amateur Colonoscopy, first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chard Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 I don't think he handled it properly, really. I don't blame him for getting stroppy, but if you're going to come on like that, you've got to destroy the evidence otherwise it's just giving these freaks the ammo they need to put their distorted **** across to Joe Public, who, let's face it, isn't the brightest. To leave him with his poxy bit of film was stooooopid. I think we all put our case across wrong, though. I think it's futile chirping on about how we're doing a service shooting vermin, because they don't see these things as vermin. I can understand that, in a way, because I am personally violently opposed to the killing of raptors and owls. If I saw somebody shoot a Goshawk, I would grass them up, once I'd got over the temptation to shoot them :lol: We should emphasise the fact that the only serious conservation efforts made in this country, especially of habitat, are by the fishing, shooting and hunting community. If it were not for field sports, every river and brook in this country would be polluted, there would be no hedges and trees, and moorlands would all be given over to monoculture forestry. On the other side, we have a situation where **** critters like Mink are running riot in this country, because the tosspot antis took it upon themselves to release a few hundred from captivity. They haven't got the brains to understand what they are doing, because they have no understanding of the subject that is supposedly so close to their hearts - *****. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highlander Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 One thing you should all bear in mind is that you hold a SGC or FAC and ANY abusive, violent etc etc behaviour may well put that in jeopardy. LACS and any other anti's know this and probably a lot more about the legals than most of you and if they can get just one shooter to lose their licence they'll consider that a victory. Personally I'd ship them all off to Iraqistan or somesuch place and bomb the s**** out of 'em but that's when I get to rule the world! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Strange that no-one has picked up on the obvious.......... ...........for several minutes prior to the camera switching back on the "monitor" was shouting and swearing and threatening to come back later and do what they were doing to the pheasants to the `keeper and his family. 8 guns, a dozen beaters and a `keepers word against this "monitor" and I might say an illegal video. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 I was a bit drunk last night but I did miss out one bit which Highlander has correctly picked up. You simply can't react in a threatening manner (assault) or use any kind of physical attack, if you do, as has been said, say goodbye to the SGC. The shooting comics regularly regurgitate the BASC's excellent advice for how to deal with these situations. If you know that the keeper or shoot captain (or any of the people on the shoot) are hot-heads then the best thing you can do when confronted is drag them away. Polite diplomacy is the only thing that will work and whilst it might seem that grabbing the tape removes the evidence how do you know that's the only camera? If people have not done so already, have a good read of this page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wookie Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 The keeper might have a legitimate case to have the video taken down. After all, you need to have permission from the filmed person to post the video on YouTube. Yes, the keeper handled it badly, but as one of the comments says, we don't know what was happening between the two sections. That said, they should have got the tape out before he left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Just because he was filming illegally doesn't give anyone the right to take the tape by force, the plod need to be called immediately and let them sort it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starlight32 Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 I have been on a shoot where Anti's attended. What we all need to realize is the pressure the keeper is under at this time. From what I saw the keeper was as they all normally are on the day of a formal shoot, under peer pressure for the day alone, then you get all the guns asking why are they being filmed- Followed by someone saying- 'Keeper go sort out that person' By the time the filming bit is ready to show he has all the abuse from both parties and is stressed out. The results are to be expected!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Whilst I am not a keeper and not a shoot captain so I don't know the pressure personally, I can draw a comparison from elsewhere which might be similar. I completely understand the reaction, but I can't condone it. The only reason that LACS "monitor" was there was to get a reaction on camera. That video will have done a lot of damage to a sport already under fire, pardon the pun, from many angles. If we are to portray shooting as it is, a friendly and wholesome activity, then we can do without this. Perhaps some of the responsible organisations need to consider funding and running some PR/incident management workshops for keepers/shoot captains? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dusk2dawn Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 How do we know this is not staged? An old judge I knew once had this advice..... "only believe a 1/3 of what you hear and 1/2 of what you see" The hard bit is which 1/3 and which 1/2.... Malk My version of that is "nothing of what you hear and only half what you see" (not everything you see is what it appears to be)yes I know im an old cynic but suprisingly very little catches me out these days. Theres a TV ad showing a youth picking up an old ladies purse and then politely returning it to her, this illustrates the point. Theres an awful lot of staged footage around with antis dressed and posing as shooters carrying out scenes of supposed violence etc. D2D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Did you watch the video, someone shot and winged a decent high bird as part of the footage, are we saying anti's have SGC's and will flush a bird to the gun to make it look real? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dusk2dawn Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Did you watch the video, someone shot and winged a decent high bird as part of the footage, are we saying anti's have SGC's and will flush a bird to the gun to make it look real? Pin im not saying this was staged but alot of footage has been, I cannot comment on the way the way the keeper handled the situation I wasnt there but he must have had serious provocation, possibly during previous shoots and just had had enough. D2D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilishdave Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 I am not saying this is a set up it probably isn't but it is edited so they could have filmed the shooting then filmed the abuse with an actor as the keepr. Either way let that be an example of how not to do it. you could be a lot more agresive than that guy was and not look 1/2 as bad on camera. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vole Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Lets face it the LACS won that one.Of all the possible outcomes he got exactly the ones he was after.He got a rise out of the keeper AND he got it on film.Bingo.To have put up with the parasite filming a perfectly good shoot would have been less harmful to the sport and quite possibly good pr for us.After getting the reaction he was after,to allow him to keep the film was crazy.If your going to get physical with the guy you may as well confiscate the camera at the same time,even erasing the film and returning it if need be.Being filmed is surely better than a conviction for assault and losing your sgc,however irritating.Then again as is said we dont know how much of a wind up came from the anti. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROBLATCH Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 not a prety sight,having said we dont know what took place before the video started and as regards the money the guns paid the last thing i would want to see was a carry on like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Just a query, how many of you have added a comment ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pin Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 By the time I was going to add one I thought better of it being that far through the wine as I was Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.