Choke question ???.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

3 minutes ago, Fellside said:

You wouldn’t fancy eating one if it was the real thing.....?! 😃

Only if we were making soup!

[Taileron]

I was chatting to a keeper (now retired) the other day about walked up. He asked me what chokes I was using, I responded with 1/4 1/2, it’s what is in all of my guns and I use it for just about anything. His exact words were “why are you messing about with that nonsense, you want cylinder and 3/4 or full for walked up) 

When I asked him why this particular set up he said “because on walked up they are either right under your feet, or miles away” To be fair he has a point, I’m going to give it a go and see what happens.

[Walker570]

4 hours ago, wymberley said:

Essential, but isn't that only half of the story. That only works if there's sufficient pellets in that pattern to ensure as far as is reasonable a clean kill with every truly aimed shot.

The first half is no good whatsoever without the second.

In my view it is the whole story.  Pattern your shotgun to check which chokes give you the best coverage at the distance you expect to kill a bird and ensure that pattern is even and the majority of the shot load is in it.  Then it is up to the nut behind the trigger.  The reason I tend to use a more open choke for partridges over the hedges is because I don't want to blow them to smithereens.  My full choke tubes will produce a full on hail of pellets about 18 inches in diameter at 20 yards. Yes the bird will be dead but inedible as well.    It is not beyond belief that there are some shots out there who think their shotgun produces the same pattern imediately the shot leaves the barrel.

[Fellside]

1 hour ago, Walker570 said:

In my view it is the whole story.  Pattern your shotgun to check which chokes give you the best coverage at the distance you expect to kill a bird and ensure that pattern is even and the majority of the shot load is in it.  Then it is up to the nut behind the trigger.  The reason I tend to use a more open choke for partridges over the hedges is because I don't want to blow them to smithereens.  My full choke tubes will produce a full on hail of pellets about 18 inches in diameter at 20 yards. Yes the bird will be dead but inedible as well.    It is not beyond belief that there are some shots out there who think their shotgun produces the same pattern imediately the shot leaves the barrel.

Yes agreed - essential to pattern test. The pattern plate doesn’t lie. As mentioned above its often surprising how pattern quality can vary from one brand to another - using the same load/choke etc.
 

It’s useful to settle on a ‘confidence cartridge’. I must admit I actually enjoy messing around with various cart’s and chokes to see how they perform.....a little harmless fun...why not..?

[TIGHTCHOKE]

9 hours ago, Fellside said:

Yes agreed - essential to pattern test. The pattern plate doesn’t lie. As mentioned above its often surprising how pattern quality can vary from one brand to another - using the same load/choke etc.

It’s useful to settle on a ‘confidence cartridge’. I must admit I actually enjoy messing around with various cart’s and chokes to see how they perform.....a little harmless fun...why not..?

Yes it is all part of the learning curve, some people can't get their heads round it and too many others over think it. 

 

But actually patterning your chosen cartridge and choke combination is the ONLY way to really get to know.

[Fellside]

46 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Yes it is all part of the learning curve, some people can't get their heads round it and too many others over think it. 

 

But actually patterning your chosen cartridge and choke combination is the ONLY way to really get to know.

Once I’ve got my choke cartridge - I don’t think about it at all. I just go shooting. 

[Scully]

11 hours ago, Taileron said:

I was chatting to a keeper (now retired) the other day about walked up. He asked me what chokes I was using, I responded with 1/4 1/2, it’s what is in all of my guns and I use it for just about anything. His exact words were “why are you messing about with that nonsense, you want cylinder and 3/4 or full for walked up) 

When I asked him why this particular set up he said “because on walked up they are either right under your feet, or miles away” To be fair he has a point, I’m going to give it a go and see what happens.

On our little rough shoot I often carry a pump which is choked at cylinder. I carry it because I mostly beat and let others do the shooting, so it has a sling which means I can fling it over my shoulder out of the way. Because it’s choked cylinder I use a heavy hitting cartridge so on those occasions I do get a shot at something going away, it has the oomph to get to the vitals on a going away bird. 
I find many folk ***** walked up birds. 

[Fellside]

13 hours ago, Taileron said:

I was chatting to a keeper (now retired) the other day about walked up. He asked me what chokes I was using, I responded with 1/4 1/2, it’s what is in all of my guns and I use it for just about anything. His exact words were “why are you messing about with that nonsense, you want cylinder and 3/4 or full for walked up) 

When I asked him why this particular set up he said “because on walked up they are either right under your feet, or miles away” To be fair he has a point, I’m going to give it a go and see what happens.

To be honest that’s my approach too. Cylinder for birds flushed off my spaniels nose - which are usually about 20 yards when shot. I use a Teague half choke for birds which rise ahead of the dog. The Teague choke profile produces patterns similar to an ordinary (gun maker supplied) 3/4 choke. Lovely pattern quality too. 

[wymberley]

12 hours ago, Fellside said:

Yes agreed - essential to pattern test. The pattern plate doesn’t lie. As mentioned above its often surprising how pattern quality can vary from one brand to another - using the same load/choke etc.
 

It’s useful to settle on a ‘confidence cartridge’. I must admit I actually enjoy messing around with various cart’s and chokes to see how they perform.....a little harmless fun...why not..?

Why not indeed. I'm home and dry now -  apart from which it would be a real struggle -  so no longer do it. I won't be changing my guns and have stocked up with sufficient cartridges to suit.

I see Walker has amplified his comment and is now making sense - and particularly the bit about patterning at the range at which you would be shooting. I would just add one word, 'maximum' for the barrel in question. Problem is if you cater for a reasonable performance for your designated maximum range, you create a problem at the opposite end. There's nothing new about this and it's always been accepted as witnessed by the old advice, 'give it lore'.

If you're out messing around, it's easy to see why, 'at the range you'll be shooting' makes sense. Like all things shotgun, nothing is ever definite, but with a bit of luck it'll work out. Some years ago I was trying to get the answer to a PAS student's question and this happened. Let's say you have a 1/4 choked barrel and if you measured the overall pattern that threw at, say, 20 yards you'd expect 23" but you got close to  26. OK, your 1/4 is actually throwing IC. So you now shoot your IC barrel at 30 yards, measured it and got?!! This is then compounded at 40 yards. OK, these aren't the actual figures which I can't now remember but are just used as an example. The lad had patterned his gun at a relatively short distance and was wounding those Norfolk partridges that he actually managed to hit at almost double the patterned range. We dropped his shot size and upped the load a tad and all was well.

So yep, pattern at the (maximum) range you intend to shoot is good advice.

[Fellside]

15 minutes ago, wymberley said:

Why not indeed. I'm home and dry now -  apart from which it would be a real struggle -  so no longer do it. I won't be changing my guns and have stocked up with sufficient cartridges to suit.

I see Walker has amplified his comment and is now making sense - and particularly the bit about patterning at the range at which you would be shooting. I would just add one word, 'maximum' for the barrel in question. Problem is if you cater for a reasonable performance for your designated maximum range, you create a problem at the opposite end. There's nothing new about this and it's always been accepted as witnessed by the old advice, 'give it lore'.

If you're out messing around, it's easy to see why, 'at the range you'll be shooting' makes sense. Like all things shotgun, nothing is ever definite, but with a bit of luck it'll work out. Some years ago I was trying to get the answer to a PAS student's question and this happened. Let's say you have a 1/4 choked barrel and if you measured the overall pattern that threw at, say, 20 yards you'd expect 23" but you got close to  26. OK, your 1/4 is actually throwing IC. So you now shoot your IC barrel at 30 yards, measured it and got?!! This is then compounded at 40 yards. OK, these aren't the actual figures which I can't now remember but are just used as an example. The lad had patterned his gun at a relatively short distance and was wounding those Norfolk partridges that he actually managed to hit at almost double the patterned range. We dropped his shot size and upped the load a tad and all was well.

So yep, pattern at the (maximum) range you intend to shoot is good advice.

👍