Long lines worthwhile or waste of time?

[wildfowler.250]

Opinions folks, I’ve never personally used them. 
 

I’ve a 14 month old lab. Will generally walk to heel really well. Occasional fit of zoomies sometimes at the start but we had that with his auntie and it settled with age no problems.

 

My current bugbear is: he will retrieve great to hand in garden, it’s a little boring . On the farm track he is pretty good but will occasionally drop the dummy for 1) better scents or 2) to eat cow sht. I do two retrieves max at any given time.

Despite treats, I’d say the cow muck and scents are usually higher reward. He’s 60:40 in my favour for retrieving when there’s a lot of scent about,(there’s a lot of hares and it’s well walked with dogs). But cow muck is clearly better than any treat and he’d gladly run away with some.

I feel like on a long line he would be fine so I’m not sure it’s going to make any odds. And it’s off lead that he’ll still occasionally play up.

I’m all for stacking odds in his favour and maybe choosing a different location is the way to go? But at the same time, the farm track on back door is very handy. Just a shame the cows pass through it so much..

Thoughts? Persistence and it’ll come with age? Any behavioral tricks around this? He’s improving all the time just a bit slower than I expect

Edited July 4, 2022 by wildfowler.250

[scutt]

He's bored !! Try different venue as he comes back you move away from him until he catches up to you.

Long lines work if you now how to use them at 14months I don't think it would take him long to suss it out and revert back to problem soon as you remove the line.

just my opinion as  I am no dog trainer. 

[wildfowler.250]

3 minutes ago, scutt said:

He's bored !! Try different venue as he comes back you move away from him until he catches up to you.

Long lines work if you now how to use them at 14months I don't think it would take him long to suss it out and revert back to problem soon as you remove the line.

just my opinion as  I am no dog trainer. 

Different venue might work. He does get bored fairly easily that’s for sure. I have used the walking/running back idea a couple of times and it does help to be fair

I agree with the long lines comment. Again I’m no expert but I’d have thought as soon as he was off it he’d realise he’d the extra freedom again.

 

 

Cheers for taking the time to reply!

Edited July 4, 2022 by wildfowler.250

[Dave at kelton]

He is still very young and immature. Cow **** is always an attraction to labs in my experience. You really need to break that before trying to do it when retrieving. You have to set him up when you can get at him and make him realise that it is not attractive. A long line might help but you have to be careful how you use it. Trick is something light like 5mm paracord about 4 or 5m long. Knot it every metre so you can stand on it and it won’t slide through your feet. Use it in general walking just trailing so he gets to a point where he does whatever without noticing it. Then set him up with the 💩 and let him know in no uncertain terms that eating it is not worth it.

I agree on the boredom point too. Lastly, don’t do retrieves where there are other distractions until it is nailed on. It my be convenient to use the track but clearly it isn’t helping your training.

Good luck!

[Walker570]

It does sound to me as if you are boring him...no offence..it is easily done when you want to see your dog retireve, to keep throwing dunies.  I would only do two and then change to something else totally diverse to retrieving.  The only time I have ever seen long lines work was on young English pointers on the moor trailing a whole length of plastic cloathes line and then when they came on point the handler walked up and stood on or picked up the line, slowly approaching the dog with quiet encouragement to 'set'.   

added to Dave's comments above.

[old'un]

wish I had the stomach/courage to taste it just to see what makes it so appealing to dogs, I wonder what it tastes like?? anyone.

Edited July 4, 2022 by old'un

[wildfowler.250]

Cheers gents! Plenty to take on here. Probably is the case that it’s a bit dull for him. Figured simple track and you can’t go wrong but there’s not much variation in it. Have been avoiding more open spaces in case he does laps with the dummy but I think I might have to shake it up a bit.

 

Thanks!

 

 

ps: I’ve totally forgotten how long it takes for them to mature. My other two are 8 and 11. In my head a year and a wee bit they’d be out working but clearly I’ve hazy memory..

[WalkedUp]

I would walk him separately to training him. Get up early, exercised and relieved. Train him later in the day somewhere you can park your truck nearby. As soon as any of this zooming or running off occurs, back in the truck for 10 mins whilst you read the news. Back out. He needs to learn that walks are walks, and work is work. 

My dogs are “working” at all times with me until I give them the “at ease” command to run around like madmen. As a puppy it is 99% at ease and playing, by the time they are 3 years it is probably less than 20%. When at work they are heeling, or occasionally retrieving etc. They are not permitted to defecate or urinate unless at ease.

Sadly it is not easy, or quick, to train a good dog. 

[Dave at kelton]

10 hours ago, wildfowler.250 said:

Cheers gents! Plenty to take on here. Probably is the case that it’s a bit dull for him. Figured simple track and you can’t go wrong but there’s not much variation in it. Have been avoiding more open spaces in case he does laps with the dummy but I think I might have to shake it up a bit.

 

Thanks!

 

 

ps: I’ve totally forgotten how long it takes for them to mature. My other two are 8 and 11. In my head a year and a wee bit they’d be out working but clearly I’ve hazy memory..

In my experience labs are maturing later and hence mine are not out in the field until at least two years old. My current one is still puppy silly occasionally at 27 months but we are getting there. He will be ready come September.

[wildfowler.250]

On 06/07/2022 at 08:02, WalkedUp said:

I would walk him separately to training him. Get up early, exercised and relieved. Train him later in the day somewhere you can park your truck nearby. As soon as any of this zooming or running off occurs, back in the truck for 10 mins whilst you read the news. Back out. He needs to learn that walks are walks, and work is work. 

My dogs are “working” at all times with me until I give them the “at ease” command to run around like madmen. As a puppy it is 99% at ease and playing, by the time they are 3 years it is probably less than 20%. When at work they are heeling, or occasionally retrieving etc. They are not permitted to defecate or urinate unless at ease.

Sadly it is not easy, or quick, to train a good dog. 

I think this definitely touches on one problem where walks and training are all in one go. Both my partner and I are in full time 8.30-6pm, (no biggy there) and we’re lucky in that we can kennel him at work and get him out for half an hour at lunch. Evening sessions just with the way life is involve a walk and a couple of throws at the end. He probably needs to burn off some steam and then ideally keep throwing a separate event.

I do give a ‘play’ command but I have to say it’s probably 80% work / heel and 20% charging around once back at the house. He maybe needs to burn off more steam before fetching starts.

I’m probably guilty of being too strict in case you give an inch and they take a mile but appreciate now this can maybe cause it’s own problems

 

On 06/07/2022 at 10:36, Dave at kelton said:

In my experience labs are maturing later and hence mine are not out in the field until at least two years old. My current one is still puppy silly occasionally at 27 months but we are getting there. He will be ready come September.

Yep he’s still got about 10 months to go until he’s 2. I’ve been trying not to put pressure on it but I’ve been desperate to get him out this season,(not going to happen now). The old girl is 11 and the other lab is 8 but she’s a shared gundog with the folks so it’s a bit of a juggle and a limitation at the moment.

Certainly the more folk I talk to say out at 2 years onwards. Some field trial guys have been saying they don’t start any serious training until 18 months. Funnily enough, I was warned off a GWP because they are slow to mature,(but the time scales are starting to look similar).

 

Going to have to be a slow go. He’s keen but still a cheeky pup at times!

[ditchman]

trained all my spaniels with a long line.........used it to bring out their quatering ability...and being able to turn them to the whistle....once they had understood the priniciples i stopped using it...and they were awesome in short scrub and being turned to the whistle.....

dont train them on a long line unless you intend to use that skill