Terrorist attack - Germany.

[Goly]

3 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Identify. Arrest. Deport.

Im sick of hearing about terrorist incidents, then finding out they were 'known' to authorities.

Yeah, that's a start, but what if they are born in that specific country? And what about those that are not known to authorities?

[12gauge82]

58 minutes ago, JKD said:

If only that were possible eh ?! 😕

The annoying thing is it is possible, but the ruling class across the West has decided to ignore its populations and encourage it. 

1 hour ago, Goly said:

It wasn't in the UK, and the fact that he was a practising doctor for almost 20 years points towards an atypical attack. As for extreme views, people from all walks of life have them, remember the IRA attacks, what about the Norwegian terrorist a few years back?

I know it wasn't in the UK but I'm speaking generally. 

Agreed people from all walks of life can be extremists, but why on earth are we importing more from abroad, we have enough issues with issues at home, we don't need more? 

[12gauge82]

1 hour ago, Goly said:

If that is true then the people killed have been failed, but the point stands, you have to be mentally unstable to plough down dozens of innocent people. I hope the man doesn't see the light of day again, mentally unstable or not.

I would argue every terrorist is mentally unstable, you've got to be to commit such a heinous act. But that doesn't excuse being a terrorist. 

[Goly]

6 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

The annoying thing is it is possible, but the ruling class across the West has decided to ignore its populations and encourage it. 

I know it wasn't in the UK but I'm speaking generally. 

Agreed people from all walks of life can be extremists, but why on earth are we importing more from abroad, we have enough issues with issues at home, we don't need more? 

The vast majority of immigrants are not terrorists, that includes Muslims. You just can't deport law abiding citizens because of the actions of a few individuals.

[B686]

42 minutes ago, Goly said:

It is no different to what the IRA were doing and are still doing to this day, people are just obsessed with the perpetrators ethnic background. If people can give a solution that doesn't unfairly punish law abiding citizens then I'd be happy to hear it.

Don’t remember the press or governments or whoever trying to find a reason to make IRA  terror attack not a terror attack . People are probably obsessed with the perpetrators ethnic background because their countries are being flooded with people of these ethnic backgrounds that are mostly responsible for these attacks. 

[JKD]

12 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

The annoying thing is it is possible, but the ruling class across the West has decided to ignore its populations and encourage it. 

I was being mildly sarcastic 😉 But, in reality, it's impossible.

[clangerman]

7 minutes ago, Goly said:

The vast majority of immigrants are not terrorists, that includes Muslims. You just can't deport law abiding citizens because of the actions of a few individuals.

unless a terrorist org claims responsibility for this type of incident it’s just the actions of some nut being used to demonise migrants but the gullible won’t see it! 

[B686]

2 minutes ago, clangerman said:

unless a terrorist org claims responsibility for this type of incident it’s just the actions of some nut being used to demonise migrants but the gullible won’t see it! 

Whats the difference still some nut with the same views as a terrorist  organisation, same outcome .

[clangerman]

6 minutes ago, B686 said:

Whats the difference still some nut with the same views as a terrorist  organisation, same outcome .

world of difference when his actions are being used to demonise migrants or we are all  criminals just because some people commit crime 

[Goly]

22 minutes ago, B686 said:

Don’t remember the press or governments or whoever trying to find a reason to make IRA  terror attack not a terror attack . People are probably obsessed with the perpetrators ethnic background because their countries are being flooded with people of these ethnic backgrounds that are mostly responsible for these attacks. 

Mainstream media have made it pretty clear that this was a terrorist attack, who's trying to cover it up? Ok, but again, i take it you think it would be fair to deport law abiding citizens because of the actions of a very small minority? Would you be happy to deport any Irish living in Britain because the IRA bombed us?

Edited 12 hours ago by Goly

[12gauge82]

36 minutes ago, Goly said:

The vast majority of immigrants are not terrorists, that includes Muslims. You just can't deport law abiding citizens because of the actions of a few individuals.

Agreed, I expressly said a tiny minority in my post. My point is mass uncontrolled migration will invariably lead to a small percentage of unvetted, highly dangerous individuals, with a warped ideology, who hate us and our way of life and will commit heinous acts against us. We need to strictly control immigration. Why bother having borders and passports if we're going to allow anyone to come and stay here?

28 minutes ago, JKD said:

I was being mildly sarcastic 😉 But, in reality, it's impossible.

Yes I got what you mean👌. Crazy world we're living in at the moment! 

24 minutes ago, B686 said:

Whats the difference still some nut with the same views as a terrorist  organisation, same outcome .

Your right. Some nut or a terrorist makes no difference, why allow unvetted people into the UK, that strategy will guarantee people will be murdered, any death as a result of an imoorted murder/terrorist is one to many and everything reasonable and practicable should be done to prevent it. 

Edited 12 hours ago by 12gauge82

[Goly]

3 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

Agreed, I expressly said a tiny minority in my post. My point is mass uncontrolled migration will invariably lead to a small percentage of unvetted, highly dangerous individuals, with a warped ideology, who hate us and our way of life and will commit heinous acts against us. We need to strictly control immigration. Why bother having borders and passports if we're going to allow anyone to come and stay here?

Yes I got what you mean👌. Crazy world we're living in at the moment! 

It's not exactly uncontrolled, this man for instance has lived in Germany for nearly 20 years. In the UK you can't just arrive and be accepted without being granted asylum. I'm not sure what can be done if they don't have criminal records or links to terrorism.

[JKD]

5 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

Agreed, I expressly said a tiny minority in my post. My point is mass uncontrolled migration will invariably lead to a small percentage of unvetted, highly dangerous individuals, with a warped ideology, who hate us and our way of life and will commit heinous acts against us. We need to strictly control immigration. Why bother having borders and passports if we're going to allow anyone to come and stay here?

Yes I got what you mean👌. Crazy world we're living in at the moment! 

But it's too late,,,, too many have already made that journey and are amongst us [Europe].

And yes, crazy, and also very worrying !

[12gauge82]

13 minutes ago, Goly said:

Mainstream media have made it pretty clear that this was a terrorist attack, who's trying to cover it up? Ok, but again, i take it you think it would be fair to deport law abiding citizens because of the actions of a very small minority? Would you be happy to deport any Irish living in Britain because the IRA bombed us?

Hes probably referring to Southport. 

I know you haven't directed this question towards me but I'd like to make my views on this subject clear. I want immigration, I want decent hardworking people with relevant skills that can plug a gap in the UK to come here and contribute and call the UK home. But they must share our core values, speak our language, want to contribute to our society and not hold views that are contrary to our way of life. 

Is that unreasonable? 

2 minutes ago, Goly said:

It's not exactly uncontrolled, this man for instance has lived in Germany for nearly 20 years. In the UK you can't just arrive and be accepted without being granted asylum. I'm not sure what can be done if they don't have criminal records or links to terrorism.

Again I'm speaking generally. We absolutely do have totally uncontrolled migration. People from God knows where can hop on a dingy, land on our beach and exceedingly likely get to stay here. What could be less controlled than that? 

2 minutes ago, JKD said:

But it's too late,,,, too many have already made that journey and are amongst us [Europe].

And yes, crazy, and also very worrying !

Yes very true. We obviously can't deport people who have set their lives up here for the sake of the very few evil people who have slipped in. But we absolutely need to control things very carefully going forwards. 

[old'un]

6 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

Hes probably referring to Southport. 

I know you haven't directed this question towards me but I'd like to make my views on this subject clear. I want immigration, I want decent hardworking people with relevant skills that can plug a gap in the UK to come here and contribute and call the UK home. But they must share our core values, speak our language, want to contribute to our society and not hold views that are contrary to our way of life. 

Is that unreasonable?

And that's the big problem, most do not want to integrate.

[ditchman]

Germany have eections coming up...............this "happening" will effect the politicle landscape.......all the govts are the same ..by not facing the truth..

[Goly]

18 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

Hes probably referring to Southport. 

I know you haven't directed this question towards me but I'd like to make my views on this subject clear. I want immigration, I want decent hardworking people with relevant skills that can plug a gap in the UK to come here and contribute and call the UK home. But they must share our core values, speak our language, want to contribute to our society and not hold views that are contrary to our way of life. 

Is that unreasonable? 

Again I'm speaking generally. We absolutely do have totally uncontrolled migration. People from God knows where can hop on a dingy, land on our beach and exceedingly likely get to stay here. What could be less controlled than that? 

Yes very true. We obviously can't deport people who have set their lives up here for the sake of the very few evil people who have slipped in. But we absolutely need to control things very carefully going forwards. 

The identity of the Southport terrorist soon came out in the wash, you can't just expect the news to hastily state the name & the origin of said person without confirmation.

As for unvetted immigrants, if they pass their application then what else can be done? Perhaps we should toughen them up with more specific criteria but other than that, how can we defend against something down the line that may happen 18 years later like is the case with the German terrorist.

[Rewulf]

1 hour ago, Goly said:

Yeah, that's a start, but what if they are born in that specific country? And what about those that are not known to authorities?

Got to start somewhere.

 

1 hour ago, Goly said:

The vast majority of immigrants are not terrorists, that includes Muslims. You just can't deport law abiding citizens because of the actions of a few individuals.

No one is suggesting that, but I do think that naturalised foreign nationals or asylum granted, of any denominations, should be stripped of British nationality and deported, IF they are found guilty of ANY terrorism offences, once they have served whatever sentences given.

[Goly]

4 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Got to start somewhere.

 

No one is suggesting that, but I do think that naturalised foreign nationals or asylum granted, of any denominations, should be stripped of British nationality and deported, IF they are found guilty of ANY terrorism offences, once they have served whatever sentences given.

I fully agree about that but I'm not sure that would deter individuals with that frame of mind. 

[Rewulf]

3 minutes ago, Goly said:

I fully agree about that but I'm not sure that would deter individuals with that frame of mind. 

That state of mind had been demonstrated previously, and nothing happened.

Reports indicate he is a specialist in psychiatry and psychotherapy.

No motive has been established yet for why the suspect drove into the crowd. 

The alleged perpetrator has been sharing Islamophobic views online for years. 

[old'un]

Taleb al-Abdulmohsen has an account on the X platform, and around 45,000 people follow him there, he became known as an anti-Islamist.

He made a tweet in December 2023 in which he claimed that the German state was persecuting Saudi Arabian refugees to destroy their lives. He threatened retaliation, writing: "I assure you that 100 percent revenge will come soon. Even if it costs me my life.".. this gives a bit of insight..https://www-welt-de.translate.goog/politik/deutschland/article254942760/Anschlag-in-Magdeburg-Terrorwarnungen-die-im-Nirwana-landeten.html?_x_tr_sl=de&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=sc

[Goly]

11 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

That state of mind had been demonstrated previously, and nothing happened.

Reports indicate he is a specialist in psychiatry and psychotherapy.

No motive has been established yet for why the suspect drove into the crowd. 

The alleged perpetrator has been sharing Islamophobic views online for years. 

He's also been sharing anti-islamic views on social media. If he was known to the authorities then the victims have have been failed by the German government.

[12gauge82]

48 minutes ago, Goly said:

The identity of the Southport terrorist soon came out in the wash, you can't just expect the news to hastily state the name & the origin of said person without confirmation.

As for unvetted immigrants, if they pass their application then what else can be done? Perhaps we should toughen them up with more specific criteria but other than that, how can we defend against something down the line that may happen 18 years later like is the case with the German terrorist.

His identity came out after huge pressure and more importantly after hysteria had been whipped up in the presence of a media vacuum left due to speculation. 

People aren't stupid, they can see the media manipulation and in the absence of hard fact, speculation will of course happen. 

There's nothing that will cause anger quicker than double standards and hypocrisy. 

What application? I'm talking of the tens of thousands that turn up on a beach via rubber dinghy, who are then due to the HRA almost impossible to remove. Need evidence, look how long it took us to get rid of radical hate preachers who helped warp the minds of God knows how many people before something was done. 

[12gauge82]

31 minutes ago, Goly said:

He's also been sharing anti-islamic views on social media. If he was known to the authorities then the victims have have been failed by the German government.

Virtually all governments of the West have been failing their citizens for a very long time. Forcing radical, unwanted change on their populations, with no mandate to do so. Branding anyone raising genuine concerns a racist. 

You haven't done that but felt the need to tell me all migrants are not terrorists, despite that being blatantly obvious, no one suggesting it and my earlier statement expressly saying only a tiny minority of illegal migrants having extremist views. 

I think there's a far, far more common problem in this country with people believing others are Prejudist than the number who are actually racist. The UK has really lost its grounding in common sense over the last 20 or 30 years. 

Edited 10 hours ago by 12gauge82

[Goly]

22 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said:

Virtually all governments of the West have been failing their citizens for a very long time. Forcing radical, unwanted change on their populations, with no mandate to do so. Branding anyone raising genuine concerns a racist. 

You haven't done that but felt the need to tell me all migrants are not terrorists, despite that being blatantly obvious, no one suggesting it and my earlier statement expressly saying only a tiny minority of illegal migrants having extremist views. 

I think there's a far, far more common problem in this country with people believing others are Prejudist than the number who are actually racist. The UK has really lost its grounding in common sense over the last 20 or 30 years. 

But there lies the problem, we can't just punish law abiding immigrants for the actions of a few. Unless you suggest an unjust mass deportation plan I don't know exactly what we are meant to do.