12gauge82

Got to be honest, you educated me on that subject on another thread and I don't know enough about that to form an opinion, was the government in that area in enough control to affect whether it's people ate bush meat? If so, it's a good question. Yes very true, it's the tricky bit.

I'm not so sure, if the Chinese have caused this through irresponsible practice at wet markets, or irresponsible practices at a lab, the Chinese must face action from the international community severe enough to ensure they end whatever caused it, to do that, the correct questions must be asked and the truth bottomed out, otherwise what stops this happening again and the next time it could be a virus that spreads like covid, with a 50% mortality rate.

There's lots out there, but here's a piece from the BBC https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/science-environment-52318539 It's all circumstance related, but id say it pushes the chances of a lab release up to at least as likely as a natural accident at the market.

Very interesting, but like all other industries that had to modify its practices, they need to pay a decent wage for the work that's expected, instead of churning out the same offensive nonsense that "The British are too lazy to pick fruit and veg".

I'm not implying that they released the virus on purpose, the point is, that the likelihood of it having come out of the bio lab is now looking a far more likely option.

I'm not arguing with staying in, but there's alot of people flouting it already, flying people in doesn't send the right message out in my opinion.

The whole point is we don't know, I wouldn't rule anything out, including its escaped from a lab, the point to this thread is the lab option, is suddenly looking alot more likely. I'm not sure sure what your point is though.

My proposal is to offer a wage that attracts the right people, as you would in any other work sector. Your dead right, the risk is likely minimal, however, while people are being fined for having a picnic in the middle of nowhere, also very minimal risk, what message is it sending to the millions of people being ordered to stay at home? It's not my job to put a number on it, neither is it my job to put a number on any other sector, if you pay the right wage, you get the right people, that's what happens in virtually every other employment sector in the country.

I'm not implying this is anything other than a natural virus (although I wouldn't rule anything out either). As pointed out by pigeon popper, the Americans and French put money into it, to my knowledge, it's the only level 4 bio facility in whuhan and it has been studying treatment for Corona virus, the Americans and French have been advising them and providing funding, probably due to concerns with the safety of the facility, as raised in 2018, funnily enough specifically with regards to Corona virus testing on bats, put all that together, plus the momentum of noise from both UK and America and it's looking increasingly likely it could have escaped from that lab.

Again, I disagree, foreign workers are only needed because the wage offered to UK workers is lower than what the job requires, business then proclaims they can't get UK workers, you could do that to any career in the UK, if you don't pay enough, you won't get people prepared to do the job. The fact that food production is a vital role only strengthens my argument, why are we relying on foreign labour for vital UK service? I'm afraid I'm not an economics expert. Are you denying that if enough money was paid for the role, you'd still not get UK workers who would be prepared and suitable to do the job, because if you are, that would be utterly ridiculous. The UK population is only allowed to leave their house for specific, set reasons, however you dress it up, thats a huge restriction to their civil liberties. The point is, why risk further virus carriers, or transmission back to Romania and what message does it send?

Yes it's 20 miles from where the Chinese proclaimed the virus originated and to my knowledge is the only facility of its type in China, in 2018, I think the Americans raised concerns of bat Corona virus testing. If it quacks like a duck and looks like a duck, it's usually, a duck!

I'm sure they are, but what's the point or sense in deciding this virus is so dangerous people are being placed under virtual house arrest, to then allow more potential virus carriers in, all for the sake of saving a few quid, even if the risk is minimal, what message does it send to all the people being forced to stay home? Like any labour market, pay enough and you'd get the right workers. Why stop at fruit picking, why don't we stop employing UK supermarket workers and only employ from abroad, you could really drive the wage down, infact why stop there, we could do it with all sorts of employment.

I'm no conspiracy theorists, however, It would appear there is some solid evidence of the virus originating from the Chinese lab in China, there has been conspiracy theories about this from the beginning but now both American and now the UK government are openly questioning the possibility of this.

Got to disagree with this. Why are we risking bringing more potential virus carriers into the country, while everyone else is being told to stay at home. Pay our own people to do it, it might take a bit of time to train people up to standard, farmers would have to pay a much higher wage and the cost of the food produced would go up, but then those workers would make a better wage to go back into the economy. The old "British workers don't want to do it", or "The British are too lazy" is an absolute nonsense, as in all labour markets, you need to pay the appropriate wage to attract the right people, pay enough and you'd get you produce picked every bit, if not more efficiently by a British worker as any Romanian.

Your right of course, the west is far from blameless.

Least aggressive foreign policy! They're building manmade islands and claiming the sea around them, totally against international law and threatening anyone who breaches chinas made up rules!

Agreed 😂

You clearly have a very good understanding of this subject 👍

Very well written post that. I fully agree with everything you say, especially about society policing itself to a degree, there should be free speech and equally, a right to reply.

All valid points. People really are strange creatures indeed!

I think it's more to do with the fact as a society we are more educated and aware than ever, it is telling that as a society, we now are so distrustful of government and authority. Many people (rightly or wrongly) simply don't believe the official line we're told and that leads to half the crazy conspiracy theories out there.

You what? 😂😂😂 Seriously though, what is being proposed is that we mustn't risk someone speaking against the normal excepted practices, as many great minds have throughout history, sure 99% is going to be by crackpots, but restricting that free speech and thoughts, incase some fool does something stupid, is so damaging towards advancement and freedom, I find it all very concerning.

It could, but the other opinion is we slip towards a police state, like I said, it's a fine balance. For instance, the majority of the public would probably be more than happy to shut down the shooting communitys argument that hunting is an important part of countryside management and conservation and there's huge swathes of people out there who'd love to do it.

That's done by choosing to believe someone, or ignore them. Imho as long as no one is purposefully inciting others to commit violence or other criminal acts, people should be free to express any opinion they wish, regardless how stupid it might be. The BBC is complete trash, or most of it anyway