Shot size comparison chart, UK/USA/Europe

[Cranfield]

This is a useful shot size comparison link.

http://www.hallowellco.com/shot_size_chart.htm

[wymberley]

Not too sure about that. For a pigeon shooting forum where, perhaps, sizes 6, 6.5 and 7 prevail in the main, there seem to be a large discrepency when compared to the long standing British dimensions/numbers.

Cheers

[Paul223]

surely thats the point as I've said many times we should really use size in mm's

[wymberley]

surely thats the point as I've said many times we should really use size in mm's

Can't fault your logic but do you remember when we changed fuel to litres and the forecourts put up conversion table until we got the hang of it?

I don't give two hoots what type of measurement is used as long as I know what's in the box and at the moment it could be anything. I have no real problem with doing away with our British system which has served us well for decades provided the replacement is standardized. At the moment that comparison table is not valid because the details of the Engish sizes are incorrect and comparison is therefore impossible.

However, as said, I can't fault your logic and as soon as there is some form of standardization, it'll benefit us all. I just hope they find room for a 2.5mm pellet which we know as No 61/2 and is sadly missing from that chart.

Cheers

[Paul223]

English size 6.5 is on the chart, 2.4mm, the same metric size as the clay carts I'm currently using which are apparently no good for pigeon dispite ' 6.5's ' being the recommended load .... and my clay carts having 7.5 written on the side along with 2.4mm ........ but thats another story

[Guest cookoff013]

surely thats the point as I've said many times we should really use size in mm's

 

actually we should be using #shot per oz, you cant fudge that ! % lead changes, more hardner, but will still have the same mass per pellet.

[wymberley]

actually we should be using #shot per oz, you cant fudge that ! % lead changes, more hardner, but will still have the same mass per pellet.

Hello, mate.

Spot on, clever idea.

 

Paul,

English size 6.5 is 2.5mm and 300 to the oz which is why it's a good pigeon cartridge particularly when decoying. 6 is 2.6 and 270/oz and 7 is 2.4 and 340/oz.

 

Cheers, both,

Phil

[aussie black duck]

Is there any official body in the UK who is responsible for the shot size standards we call English Shot size? Seems to me it should be a very easy thing to look up..........

Edited December 12, 2011 by aussie black duck

[wymberley]

Is there any official body in the UK who is responsible for the shot size standards we call English Shot size? Seems to me it should be a very easy thing to look up..........

Good point, I haven't a clue. I could well imagine that it's the same sort of thing as English law and this topic would come under the heading of "common" and not "statute". Also, the "bible" is probably Burrard!

[Guest cookoff013]

this is a very good point, so in this country, we buy cartridges that have english shotsizes and european equivalent shotsizes. not only that we have different proof laws that the speed is measured at 2.5m. then the speeds are adjusted for muzzel speeds.

 

so not only are we shooting smaller shotsizes, we are also using slower than advertised speeds.

 

so my liking of 1,1/8oz of english 5 is equivalent to the US #6 but 1300fps is the consensus speed here which actually is 1200fps on a good day.

(classy pigeon cartridge)

 

so apart from sifting through all the advertising rubbish, trying to sellect a good shell to use, we are miss informed and duped into buying shells that arnt as fast as advertised or got the correct shotsize.

 

the antimony changes with the cheap pigeon loads, so is less hard /more dense lead. ballisticly is going to be about the same performance, it just depends on how soft the lead is or how hard its going to be hit at, soft lead and 1600fps is a bad combination. thet`ll waste half the shot before it even leaves the barrel.

 

the lyman guide is a great reference to all shotsizes euro, and american. just to show a comparison. but it does recomend 2% antimony.

 

so for a bog standard pigeon load, load up a #5 at 1200fps, realistic its going to cost you more to get the cartridge to do less. in some cases less is more. i do prefer to shoot larger shot than normal. i go usually 1 up, because i dont have to shoot the shot as fast.

why fire a #6 at 1400fps, when a #5 at 1100fps is going to do a better job and still maintain more energy, and in some plaswads like the full cup ones get way better patterns through any choke !

 

i`ve also noticed, when chatting with other loaders, the shotsize can vary from what you order and what you want ! all were counted per ounce.

[wymberley]

That's it in a nutshell.

It's no good having a rant; it's too late for that now. Have you noticed that we're not even Britain any more, let alone Great, just two initials?

We've always been subjects so we didn't really notice that with no influence what-so-ever any more, we're not only subject to the whims of our government/crown but now also to anything everyone else wishes to off load on us. Such is our lack of influence that any attempt to ensure that any product in our market place is identified by our sizes is doomed to failure.

[Guest cookoff013]

That's it in a nutshell.

It's no good having a rant; it's too late for that now. Have you noticed that we're not even Britain any more, let alone Great, just two initials?

We've always been subjects so we didn't really notice that with no influence what-so-ever any more, we're not only subject to the whims of our government/crown but now also to anything everyone else wishes to off load on us. Such is our lack of influence that any attempt to ensure that any product in our market place is identified by our sizes is doomed to failure.

 

its not that i`m ranting. its just i spent ages shifting through lots of information, disecting shells, gathering information and to eventually find out we`re being mislead. did you know to get that extra 100-200fps from 1100-1400fps can actually increase the cost of the powder used in the cartridge by upto 7-9% so instead of paying 5p in powder 5.5p of powder.

 

just by using a bigger shotsize, a normal speed, opens up lots of powders for the job, they maynot be ideal, but the powder choices are there. not only that its cheaper to shoot slower loads. will they peform the same? i severely doubt anyome can tell the difference between 19grains of powder and 20grains, thats only 5% difference, and actually is in the range of less than 5% variation in powder drops anyway that a reloader should be looking out for. a 5% variance is acceptable.

 

now i`m not really saying shoot BBs at everything. seriously i`m not.

 

as a standard no frills, 1200fps, #5 for birds 7s for clays. in whatever payload 1oz.

now under 1oz the shells get faster naturally, whether they pattern better is a different question.

[wymberley]

its not that i`m ranting. its just i spent ages shifting through lots of information, disecting shells, gathering information and to eventually find out we`re being mislead. did you know to get that extra 100-200fps from 1100-1400fps can actually increase the cost of the powder used in the cartridge by upto 7-9% so instead of paying 5p in powder 5.5p of powder.

 

just by using a bigger shotsize, a normal speed, opens up lots of powders for the job, they maynot be ideal, but the powder choices are there. not only that its cheaper to shoot slower loads. will they peform the same? i severely doubt anyome can tell the difference between 19grains of powder and 20grains, thats only 5% difference, and actually is in the range of less than 5% variation in powder drops anyway that a reloader should be looking out for. a 5% variance is acceptable.

 

now i`m not really saying shoot BBs at everything. seriously i`m not.

 

as a standard no frills, 1200fps, #5 for birds 7s for clays. in whatever payload 1oz.

now under 1oz the shells get faster naturally, whether they pattern better is a different question.

Ah,

No, mate - my bit about the nutshell referred to your post.

The rant bit was in general conversation meaning that whatever happens, there's nowt we can do about it.

[webber]

I'm working on a project at the moment, and came across this information.

 

webber

My link

Edited June 27, 2012 by webber

[bicykillgaz]

I dissected some 20b cartridges the other day purely out of boredom here's the results-

 

Gamebore 20b carts-

Traditional game 28g no5 x 196

 

Puregold20 28g no6 x 280

 

Traditional game 28g no7 x 341

 

 

Hull cartridge co carts-

High pheasant20 25g no6 x 225

 

Sterling game20 28g no6 x 267

 

Three crowns 23g no7 x 271

 

I only counted 1 of each so hardly an in depth scientific test but I did find it strange that the puregold20 28g no6 (gamebore) had 13 more pieces of shot than the sterling game20 28g no6 (hull), I guess as you've already mentioned its down to differences in the lead density.

[fennman2]

all these different thoughts on shot sizes verry interesting, but you are all forgeting one thing, if the total bann on lead does come in then the present small shot becomes irelevent. we will have to be thinking bigger like, 4+3,then what happens to our so important patterns.sorry to be so cheerful

cheers fennman2

[auceps]

all these different thoughts on shot sizes verry interesting, but you are all forgeting one thing, if the total bann on lead does come in then the present small shot becomes irelevent. we will have to be thinking bigger like, 4+3,then what happens to our so important patterns.sorry to be so cheerful
cheers fennman2

 

Its not if, its when.

Jim

[Guest cookoff013]

all these different thoughts on shot sizes verry interesting, but you are all forgeting one thing, if the total bann on lead does come in then the present small shot becomes irelevent. we will have to be thinking bigger like, 4+3,then what happens to our so important patterns.sorry to be so cheerful

cheers fennman2

 

Its not if, its when.

Jim

 

ummm yeah.

i`m even thinking bigger #2s and BBs for the respective game.

[kent]

interesting but scanning it over seems to be discrepancies on English to metric conv, slight but present non the less

[oowee]

I just found this shot spread / choke / range program which looks interesting.

http://www.blackbartsoftware.com/shotgun.htm

But its all in us sizes chokes and ranges. Anyone know where I can get a UK version?

[Robertt]

Found this chart. 

For folk interested in this subject I'm not sure if it helps or muddys the waters.

 

[wymberley]

On 06/04/2018 at 12:10, Robertt said:

Found this chart. 

For folk interested in this subject I'm not sure if it helps or muddys the waters.

 

While I'm posting elsewhere, you could peruse the Eley Diary. All you need to do is look at the, 'Details Of Shot Sizes'. Between the 6 and 7 "desig", add an appropriate 'blob', then 6 1/2, 2.5, 0.099, 106 and 300. Should the 0.099 seem invalid, then this can be corrected by adding, '2' after the 0.10 above. However, note the code for the asterisk.

[Retsdon]

On 08/09/2010 at 15:06, cookoff013 said:

actually we should be using #shot per oz, you cant fudge that !

But you know that for the next 30 years you'll have three generations of gun owners looking at the box in the shop and going 'It says here 335 pellets per ounce. What shot size is that in real life?'

[Guest cookoff013]

Thats an eight year quote that should still stand today

[wymberley]

1 hour ago, Retsdon said:

But you know that for the next 30 years you'll have three generations of gun owners looking at the box in the shop and going 'It says here 335 pellets per ounce. What shot size is that in real life?'

Pigeon size.