poorpeet Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 As above. My lot are asking us what we think. I doubt our opinion will matter if they have decided to do it but you never know. They say it will save us money as we won't be taxed on our private mileagebut if we are going to be charged for that then what's the point? I can see lots of cons and no pros but I'd be interested to hear what you think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr W Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 I'd say no, who wants your boss knowing where you are at all times Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silpig5 Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 (edited) if you do private mileage in the motor its a grey legal area . with the firm i worked for before i took all there customers and went on my own ! iwas on call 24/7 in my van , so if i go out i take van , they could not legally put a monitored tracker in it with out my consent . they do cause problems when you have smart mouthed people who has access to the data . " so what where you doing in so and so area last night ?" a smack in the mouth would normaly be the answer but as its work you cant . lol. its a hard one to call , in vans and lorries they do cut down costs because of the up to the minute data . but cars is another ball game good luck ! adi Edited February 18, 2011 by silpig5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 They know where you are, that is both a pro and a con, depends how much you abuse the vehicle and the employer. I have known people seriously abuse company vehicles everything from using them out of hours to deliver take aways in the evenings, to being "stuck in traffic" asleep in a layby.... I can see the point for commercial vehicles but for cars which are taxed (how will they reduce the tax?) as a benefit I dont see it the "pro" from your point of view Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy. Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 GPS Jammer is what you need. I've got one somewhere, but they're only about £30 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
libs Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 As above; tracker blocker. Only problem is, some register the engine starting and idling for the time you are 'not driving' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 (edited) we have them on all our vans, its useful as we don't have to pester drivers as to where they are all the time and of course stops them bunking off. Had a lively day when after quitting one decided to take the company vehicle with him, we recovered it rather than reporting him to the police so had a bonus on both sides. Generally if you like sloping off during the day it will be a bad thing otherwise if its a way of proving you only use it for company use and not personal then I can see a benefit. It will show if you speed a lot whether they do anything is another matter some will some won't, I take the approach its my vehicle and the driver likes it or lumps it really, though I do tend to forget to mention it with new drivers till I've worked out if they are going to be truthful as to their movements or not. obviously the blockers would work short term but not long term as we'd have the engineers back all the time and it would be sussed as our units even when out of coverage store all the gps data so if it wasn't being stored it would show up Edited February 18, 2011 by al4x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentKill Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 GPS Jammer is what you need. I've got one somewhere, but they're only about £30 err nothing a bit of tin foil cant help you with! (providing you know where the aerial is) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy. Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 err nothing a bit of tin foil cant help you with! (providing you know where the aerial is) :blink: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrispti Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 Reduced insurance costs is a pro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poorpeet Posted February 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 A bit more info. The car is fully expensed. So at the moment I am taxed for the benefit in kind which is made up of the car and the fuel I can use the car out of hours as much as I want. If I loose the fuel element and have to pay private mileage plus benefit in kind I'm going to take a hit. I'm not worried about them knowing where I am while working and the system has a privacy button for private use so they won't be watching over me at weekends. I was thinking more along the lines of if the car is tracked and you have an accident. The police can demand the data and will see if yyou were speeding etc. Now, I do 40K plus per year on business so with the best will in the world I am bound to exceed the speed limit from time to time (80 mph on the M way etc) I'm looking for things like that that I can put into a reasoned argument. Any good points too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twitchynik Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 Just wait until all new cars have them as a requirement of government policy due to some green environment HSE anti-car ********.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KPV4 Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 One good argument for fitting trackers to work vehicles is for those who are lone working. If you don't turn up at a call/job because you have gone off the road, the vehicle is out of sight and the driver trapped in the car, they will be able to pin point you from the tracker and direct the emergency services to the exact location :blink: Also it can be a saving to the company with a better use of resources. By contacting the closest person to the call. All to often vehicles cross each others routes to go on call where there is already someone in the area, with the tracker the employer will be able to send the closest to the call. I can't see that you can prevent your company fitting them to a vehicle if they pay all the expenses etc. Different if you make a large contribution for your private use then I would say "no" because if it is the same as my vehicle the lease is in my name not the companies, and I pay a large contribution towards my private use of the vehicle. If your company does decide to go down the tracker route, I would suggest they do it with consultation with all the employees it will effect, and they lay down the business case for going down this route. It is better for the employees to work with the employers and voice their concerns that big brother is watching etc, ask the reasons for fitting trackers, there could be a compelling business case, if so what is it? If they decide to go down the tracker route the company will more than likely implement a policy (as our did) which will tell employees that if trackers are interfered using jammers, tin foil etc, the person doing this will be in line for a disciplinary procedure. If the vehicle is out and the blip isn't on the screen (unless it is faulty) then someone has obviously tampered with it to prevent it working. It depends if the employee values his/her job in this current climate, I'm sure there would be many takers, so would they want to jeopardise their employment just to think they are getting one over on the boss We have had no problems in our firm with employees tampering with the trackers fitted to our fleet of vehicles, and they had major concerns before they were fitted , but they have learned to live with them. Only those who are doing things they shouldn't be (like sloping off etc) during work time will be against having such devices fitted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 (edited) A bit more info. The car is fully expensed. So at the moment I am taxed for the benefit in kind which is made up of the car and the fuel I can use the car out of hours as much as I want. If I loose the fuel element and have to pay private mileage plus benefit in kind I'm going to take a hit. I'm not worried about them knowing where I am while working and the system has a privacy button for private use so they won't be watching over me at weekends. I was thinking more along the lines of if the car is tracked and you have an accident. The police can demand the data and will see if yyou were speeding etc. Now, I do 40K plus per year on business so with the best will in the world I am bound to exceed the speed limit from time to time (80 mph on the M way etc) I'm looking for things like that that I can put into a reasoned argument. Any good points too. I don't see how this will save you money. If the car is fully expensed at present (i.e. all fuel is paid for, including private mileage) then it is a P11d benefit. Them sticking a tracking device on won't change the nature of the benefits you receive and as far as I am aware, there is no government scheme in place which exempts you from treating it as a benefit in kind if the vehicle is tracked. To my mind it is just another invasion of privacy and one more step towards a completely surveilance state. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing to hide, I just feel violated by all this sometimes. With ANPR the authorities can (and probably do being a FAC holder) track my vehicular movements. That, I can live with, but if an employer started tracking me....!!!! What next... cameras in our homes to make sure we aren't doing anything deemed to be not acceptable? Makes my skin crawl just thinking about it... this does not fit with the definition of a free society! Also, the comment made that only those with something to hide will object etc... I disagree, by their very function and design intention, they will increase work related stress and contribute to mental health issues. They also make for a much less flexible and I would expect, willing, workforce. A company I worked for quite some time ago expanded to the point where they needed to install work clock-cards for the office employees, within a week the place was empty each night bang on 5pm whereas before, there were people at their desks ann hour after close of business most nights! There was an incident a couple of years ago where some guy working for one of the major breakdown organisations was sacked for being constantly late returning from breaks...... we are talking a few instances of between 3-5 mins... the tracking system detected he wasn't on the move at the right time and that was the result!!! Edited February 18, 2011 by Vipa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 I'd say my drivers it reduces the stress rather than increases it. In the olden days if I had a customer chasing a delivery wanting an update you had to call them, if they were stuck in traffic it got stressful with customers wanting updates every 15 minutes if stuff is particularly urgent. Now they just get on with it and I have the answer for customers straight away no bothering the driver. The same if they were an engineer on jobs you don't have to keep phoning to find out where they are to work out job planning. Used correctly they are nothing to worry about, I've had issues with blokes with them simply because they can't tell me bull if they've slept in etc I know they have. Take it one step further the next system we have will probably be a PDA that is tracked then I even know where they are out of the van On the upside though the guys tend to earn more money as they are routed better and most like it in my experience and will often ask why I've called as I know where they are. Cars people use as personal vehicles is somewhat different but its getting to the point where probably most commercial vehicles are tracked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasons gold Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 and remember trackers are not always reliable, my old firm phoned me up once to ask me where i was and i said i was downstairs in the car park at the time. They said no you are not you are 40 miles away, i said thats funny while just about to walk in the office. Needless to say that was the end of our tracker systems and it was proven that they were unreliable, and everyone that had been disciplined because of the tracker had them all over turned Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard756 Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 We have trackers on our work phones, they can track us right up to whitch house where in or if its a big site what part of the site we are working in. I used to keep my phone on over the week end just in case the boss or customer wanted to get hold of me (whitch he often did). Now when i arrive home it gets switched off and doesnt gonon till i leave the house to go to wrk in tge morning. The boss spits his dummy out every time he wants me out of ours lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alastair0903 Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 Reduced insurance costs is a pro do they ? not the ones my boss has fitted to all our tractors . they are nothing but a pain but most the time i can explain things away ! for example i would get a phone call asking what i was doing in a local village on the way to a job , he simply got told i was getting my breakfast at the bakery ! now we don`t get phone calls like that as he has learnt that they get a cold reception . 99% of the time i can dream up some excuse for any of my bosses question , just another challenge but costing £2500 to track 6 tractors for a year i could think of far more important things to spend money on. oh and the trackers are waterproof !!!! :yp: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookiemonsterandmerlin. Posted February 18, 2011 Report Share Posted February 18, 2011 All depends if your sleeping with the bosses wife and travelling to see her at his house with the company car . Cheers OTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diceman Posted February 19, 2011 Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 "We're putting trackers on your company cars" translates as "we don't trust you an inch" So you've got nothing to hide? Great. They still don't trust you though. How do you feel about that? Personally I'd rather work somewhere that treated me like an adult. And as for the tax thing, it doesn't matter how many private miles you do, the tax is the same. In fact, you can do no private miles at all and still get taxed if the vehicle is 'available for private use' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy. Posted February 19, 2011 Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 "We're putting trackers on your company cars" translates as "we don't trust you an inch" I don't believe that for one second. "Protecting company assets" is one good alternative Many recruitment agencies I've worked for have recorded how many minutes you spend on the phone per day. Does that mean they don't trust you? No. It just means they want to ensure that employees are doing what they should be doing. I used to work at an agency, a miserable agency at that, but I can quite comfortably tell you that each consultant was taking home around 100k a year. Why? because the boss was a complete 'see you next tuesday' and recorded how long you were on the phone for and if there was any silence in the office, would shout out "Is no one busy right now?" When I first joined, I wondered why no one spoke to each other and when I did try to engage conversation, my boss' motto was "It's showbusiness, Not 'show friends'" He had a lad who had made himself £30,000, yes, £30,000 that month (I was there, so I saw it) admit that he wasn't trying his best. Why? Because if he admitted that he was happy with what he'd made, he'd become complacent. Whilst I don't fully agree with what my old boss was like. I have to say that you're there to work. Stand in his shoes for one minute; You own a fleet of vans which is costing you x amount a month - petrol prices and insurance prices are going through the roof. You want to save money. So fitting £300 GPS trackers to each car will ensure that you're not losing out on any diesel and potentially cutting your insurance by proving to your insurer that you did x amount of miles. If you owned a business, would you not penny pinch? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentKill Posted February 19, 2011 Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 Have to say from a business point of view they are a sound investment! Think about haulage firms like stobbart! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lspencer Posted February 19, 2011 Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 It dosn't matter wether trackers are fitted on your car, for a small fee of aprox £30 you can purchase a jammer from the internet which stops the tracker doing its job! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted February 19, 2011 Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 It dosn't matter wether trackers are fitted on your car, for a small fee of aprox £30 you can purchase a jammer from the internet which stops the tracker doing its job! Which could cost the user of that device his job if he becomes invisible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrispti Posted February 19, 2011 Report Share Posted February 19, 2011 It dosn't matter wether trackers are fitted on your car, for a small fee of aprox £30 you can purchase a jammer from the internet which stops the tracker doing its job! Why would you want one As soon as the tracker conveniently stops working every weekend, it becomes a bit obvious. Your just setting yourself up for a fall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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