Night Vision in Reality?

[ellebarto]

Periodically Ive thought about an NV scope for my .22 for bunny shooting. At present I use a decent scope mounted Deben Minilight, which works well enough but I probably half my bag each night because of lamp shy bunnies. I tried a laser light for a while but that beam was far to narrow to scan a field for targets.

 

I've always been told in the shop, to get half decent NV you need to be spending £2.5K plus and go for generation 2 kit but then I've read numerous threads on here about bargain basement approaches that people claim to get good results from. To be honst if it works and works well, I'll happily spend the cash but some of the Gen 2 stuff is massive and I cant see it making shooting a .22 pleasurable! I'd also like to keep my scope and its zero so its flexible for day shooting as well.

 

So then, anyone got any real life experience of an NV setup that works for them on bunnies up to say 100 yards? It would be helpful to have a list of the kit, roughly what you paid and what rifle you have it fitted to.

[steve_b_wales]

I use a Cobra Merlin with day scope adaptor. It's GEN1 but is more like GEN1+

I use it on my .243 and .22LR. The built in IR illuminator is okay up to 30 yards, but I added a Blaserlite scope mounted lamp with IR filter attached. This allows me to clearly indentify quarry up to 200 yards +

 

Steve.

[ellebarto]

I use a Cobra Merlin with day scope adaptor. It's GEN1 but is more like GEN1+

I use it on my .243 and .22LR. The buiklt in IR illuminator is okay up to 30 yards, but I added a Blaserlite scope mounted lamp with IR filter attached. This allows me to clearly indentify quarry up to 200 yards +

 

Steve.

 

Cheers. Give's me a place to start. Any particular model of Cobra Merlin?

[kdubya]

I had a gen 1 atn aries it was awkward it was heavy and as you only saw things in 2 dimensions you needed to know your land and distance well!!but I could with a decent illuminator clearly see whole fields never mind a few yards in front of me, the lads heavy into foxing are now going the "add on route" not cheap, though for around £900 you can pick you up a second hand unit, I intend to get a new one next jan ( got some money coming in )hawkeye has just bought one and is in the process of setting it up as we speak, this is the type of thing Im interested in

cheers KW

 

http://www.opticsplanet.net/d-121m.html

Edited March 11, 2011 by kdubya

[Dekers]

I use a Cobra Merlin with day scope adaptor. It's GEN1 but is more like GEN1+

I use it on my .243 and .22LR. The buiklt in IR illuminator is okay up to 30 yards, but I added a Blaserlite scope mounted lamp with IR filter attached. This allows me to clearly indentify quarry up to 200 yards +

 

Steve.

 

Ok, this sounds an interesting proposition, but is it just glorified lamping?

 

I have not used an IR filter so I'm very interested in all this.

 

You mounted a Lamp with an IR filter on it and this took the range of the Nightvision from 30 to 200yards, without the use/need for any other illuminators?

 

Was the LAMP beam visible and did it have any visible effect on the quarry.

 

Have you found a way to move from Gen -1 to Gen 5 with a lamping kit?

 

This is a genuine question, have you cracked it, because as the OP said, for general Nightvision you DO need to spend £2.5k+++ to make it worth while.

 

Those that have early nightvision seem to suggest it is fine, that is ******** unless you want to shoot bunnies at 20 yards in you back garden!

 

Cheers

[ellebarto]

Thats kinda where I'm coming from in a nutshell, although I'd be happy 'invisible lamping' if it worked.

 

Lamping in itself is fine and I manage OK. My specific problem is the bunnies being lamp shy. If I'm lighting them in a spectrum they dont see so they arent startled and I need a £400 bit of kit to see that spectrum myself, I'd buy into that!

 

I think its a given you need to spend big money for a standalone scope. Well at least I think it is. I mean there are some digital ones out there making big claims albeit with low mag

[huntsman]

its the old one "you get what you pay for"

I have been lucky and have had the opportuniity and have used a variety,of different types of NV scopes and IRs

there is a remarkable difference between the bottom end of the market Lidl type of NV gen 1 and military spec US gen3.

 

If you can afford to get a good Night vision setup go for it, as it will be an investment,but for the majority of us, we have to save and get the best possible for our money.

bearing this in mind this is were most of the dealers have us in their pocket the mid range,is it worth the money or should I spend a bit more and get the better,wait and hold off for a good deal.

 

the prices will be moving downwards shortly, as the financial grip on shops and suppliers will tighten,we are now enetering a buyers market and the sellers need us to dip our hands into our pockets to keep their businesses afloat.

so our options are :

 

best available US GEN 3

MID range

 

aldi stuff

[steve_b_wales]

Ok, this sounds an interesting proposition, but is it just glorified lamping?

 

I have not used an IR filter so I'm very interested in all this.

 

You mounted a Lamp with an IR filter on it and this took the range of the Nightvision from 30 to 200yards, without the use/need for any other illuminators?

 

Was the LAMP beam visible and did it have any visible effect on the quarry.

 

Have you found a way to move from Gen -1 to Gen 5 with a lamping kit?

 

This is a genuine question, have you cracked it, because as the OP said, for general Nightvision you DO need to spend £2.5k+++ to make it worth while.

 

Those that have early nightvision seem to suggest it is fine, that is ******** unless you want to shoot bunnies at 20 yards in you back garden!

 

Cheers

 

You cannot see any 'light' when using the IR filter, because that's what IR is all about, invisible to the naked eye. The only thing that can be seen is a very faint red glow from the lamp/filter. The Cobra picks up the IR 'light' with excellent results. The only down side to the Cobra is that it HAS to be used with parallax adjustable scopes. A non adjusting one will mean that you cannot clearly see the reticule of the scope.

My set up has been witnessed by at least two other PW members, and they were impressed.

There is no way that I,or anyone else can improve a GEN1 NV to GEN 3 or more. I wish I could! Using an IR filter on a lamp means that you do not need any other illuminator, as this is what the lamp is turned into.

Any other questions, please ask.

Steve.

[steve_b_wales]

Cheers. Give's me a place to start. Any particular model of Cobra Merlin?

 

My Cobra Merlin has no model number on it, but it's the one with added eye relief (recommended)

Just google the name and see what's available. There are many scope attachable monocular's out there for sale, some cheaper than the Merlin, but after months of researching, and asking other people who own the Cobra, I decided to buy one, and I'm glad that I did.

[Dekers]

You cannot see any 'light' when using the IR filter, because that's what IR is all about, invisible to the naked eye. The only thing that can be seen is a very faint red glow from the lamp/filter. The Cobra picks up the IR 'light' with excellent results. The only down side to the Cobra is that it HAS to be used with parallax adjustable scopes. A non adjusting one will mean that you cannot clearly see the reticule of the scope.

My set up has been witnessed by at least two other PW members, and they were impressed.

There is no way that I,or anyone else can improve a GEN1 NV to GEN 3 or more. I wish I could! Using an IR filter on a lamp means that you do not need any other illuminator, as this is what the lamp is turned into.

Any other questions, please ask.

Steve.

 

 

I'd say 30 yards to 200 with a lamp with an IR filter is a SERIOUS improvement and more than worth considering!

[kdubya]

Ok, this sounds an interesting proposition, but is it just glorified lamping?

 

I have not used an IR filter so I'm very interested in all this.

 

You mounted a Lamp with an IR filter on it and this took the range of the Nightvision from 30 to 200yards, without the use/need for any other illuminators?

 

Was the LAMP beam visible and did it have any visible effect on the quarry.

 

 

 

Cheers

I had an atn aries with a built in illuminator which was good for about 30 yards, using a deben pro max with and IR filter I could see more than a couple of hundred yards quite clearly,could scan whole fields, identifying a rabbit or fox was easy, judging the distance was the hard part, as the unit was only 3x mag and your picture is in 2d only, there is no beam as such with a large lamp fitted with an ir filter, just a red glow on your gun ( and a bit of heat)fox or rabbit do not seem to be bothered by the "red light", the only thing that stopped me using it was it was so heavy and awkward to set up / zero.

 

KW

Edited March 11, 2011 by kdubya

[Dougy]

I have used a monocular from Liddl's £99 plus a filter on a cluson for spotting wary fox's in the past. the light built into the mono is not much cop at all really, but by using the cluson it does enable you to spot out to 150 -200yds,I would imagine on a 1/2 decent night vision scope the image would be far better than the £99 jobby from a grocers

 

I am in the process myself for sorting out a dedicated NV set up but keep looking at the addon's. I will see

Edited March 11, 2011 by Dougy

[dadioles]

Last year I spent months looking into this and had settled on the Pulsar digital unit which had just become available but after a final visit to Thomas Jacks took the plunge and emptied the bank by purchasing a Sentinel G2+.

There is a huge difference in price and performance between the different units but Gen1+ from Pulsar is quite sharp.

For shooting rabbits at night 50-60 yards is as much as you need. Magnification is low, typically 5x, so for head shots anything further is not going to work, the rabbit is just too small. You also need to be in the flat shooting arc of the gun because judging distance is really hard and laser distance measuring equipment tends not to be backlit.

I get the impression that you are not loaded with cash and don't want the hassle of a second gun dedicated to night vision.

The addon route as opposed to dedicated is a sensible option.

 

When I go out with my G2+ (which is mounted on a dedicated .22) my son is a bit left out because he is stuck using the lamp on another CZ .22LR so I just bought him the Pulsar Challenger GS addon and it is far better than I dared hope. I spent a couple of thousand pound on my dedicated scope and this addon was less than 300 but very effective. You must add extra illumination though. I had a spare laser illuminator and with that stuck on the side of the Challenger it is really very good. You do need a scope with parallax but setting it up so the scope cross hairs and everything is in focus was easy, for a sharp field of view I kept the scope down to 6.5x but you can zoom in more, no need to.

 

Have a look at the Scott Country web site where they are pushing the addon kit - at that price you cannot go wrong, but do get the extra illumination, it is useless without it.

That way you have a day scope and a night capability with no need to re-zero. At night everything is slow and deliberate and off a bipod or sticks so the fact that your head is pushed back a few inches by the addon is not half as bad as it sounds.

[CZ550Kevlar]

I have a cobra merlin with day scope adapter and bought an N1000 laser IR illuminator, this saves carrying the extra weight of a lightforce 140 with battery belt and IR filter, the laser runs on a rechargeable CR123 battery which gives about 15 hours of use so i carry a spare and the Merlin runs off 2 E90 batteries but i don`t know how long they last for, the results however are excellent, it`s amazing to sit and watch a rabbit who has no idea at all he is being watched in what appears to the user broad daylight.

[Catweazle]

I too use a Cobra Merlin and laser illuminator. Mine is usually on a .22 with Bushnell Elite 4-12x40, sometimes on HMR with Leupold VXIII 6.5-20x50 .

 

It works well, but there are drawbacks with the add-on system.

 

Firstly, quality of the scope is no indication of how well it will perform with the add-on. I have had results with a cheap Zero Option or Whitetail that are as good as the Leupold and results with a Falcon were better. Some scopes struggle to combine good resolution and field of view, I have no idea why.

 

Secondly, although the system can give you a very clear picture at surprising range ( as some have already written ) it relies heavily on your own IR illumination rather than ambient light. This means that anything closeby and near to your field of view will reflect back enough IR to dazzle the unit, this effect can be slightly reduced by fitting a scope sunshade but not much. A single twig can reflect back enough IR to make anything behind it invisible.

 

Thirdly, squinting through it for long gives me a headache.

 

I bought a second unit, a cheap Yukon, for scanning around the fields because I don't like the idea of waving a rifle about. This method works OK, I spot eye shine then mount the rifle to check detail.

 

For me the thing that limits range is not the visibility, it's the problem judging distance. I find it very difficult indeed, with no peripheral vision to help, and because 90% of the time I'm using subsonics I have to limit my range and leave many shots.

 

I recommend having a second hand-held unit, it can help you orient yourself safely as it's easy to become confused in pitch dark.

Edited March 11, 2011 by Catweazle

[bongo321]

ive a yukon gen 1 perfectly fine with a extra ir @ about £350/400 now i think ,weaver mount quick switch between day scope and your nv

[bennyblanco]

I started out with a DM3k which was the predecessor to the merlin, on the .22 it was excellent with a 90mw laser illuminator and absolutely devastating when I got the HMR.

I then bought a gen2 monocular second hand and sold the gen1, its doesn't make a lot of difference at rabbit ranges but is a lot safer as you can see for several hundred yards to make sure there are no trespassing dog walkers to scare the **** out of.

 

I tend to lamp for rabbits unless on foot these days and the nv stays on the .223 layed on the back seat in case we see charlie (which turns out more often than not to be a muntjac )

 

Before you look at any units I would always recommend to set a budget as there is nothing worse than seeing what gen3 can do but having to buy gen1.

 

People claim struggle with add on systems because of the eye relief but I have never had issues and being able to swap it onto the hummer in a few seconds makes the add on very versatile.

 

Illumination is massively important until you get to the high end stuff, I like the lasers due to size but a lamp and filter works well and could save some cash.

As said above quality of scope has little bearing on image quality, some scopes just don't have an eye relief that gives a full image in the monocular.

 

 

ben

[Bazooka Joe]

If your not bothered about laying out a few quid try the Archer, see link below.

 

We've had this unit for about 3+yrs now, & it's accounted for quite a few Fox. Added bonus with this is it can be used as a spotting scope, & when you clock Charlie it just clicks onto the back of your scope for the shot.

 

There's not much difference in the grades, apart from the price, & now 3+yrs later with the Gen 3 out, the quality will be a lot better, so the "D" Grade will be all you'll need.

 

The added lazer that comes with it, is outstanding, practically daylight at times, & the eyes of Foxes light up like diamonds on the darkest of night, with no moon, or cloud cover.

 

They will let you have a go/try before you buy, they did with us. Best to have a scope with parallax, takes a bit setting up & getting used to, all practice to the point now my shooting bud can do it second nature.

 

As said in the previous posts the more you spend the better the NV. Buying the Gen 1 will lead to disappointment especially when you look through a Gen 2, you'll wished you hadn't, & even more with the Gen 3.

 

 

Archer