Catamong Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 It's strange how the Police manage to find the resources to buy and equip the most sophisticated mobile speed camera units, and they spare no effort in ruthlessly pursuing and ticketing us generally law abiding folk who happen to be doing 34 in a 30 limit, whilst the *****'s speed through in their stolen Irish plated Mercedes Sprinters, safe in the knowledge that they are beyond the reach of the law. This is not a dig at the ordinary PC, I too have close family connections with serving officers, but somehow the top dogs seem to have lost the plot. Cat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 I must admit, I do feel sorry for the Police Officers who have to try and make sense of all the nonsense and hand tying laws. But unfortunately, they don't seem to help themselves at times. We recently were subject to criminal damage, 3 future government artists smashed some of our windows at work. We informed the Police got a crime number even canvassed the neighbours and got a witness and names of the offenders, but al lthe Police said was that they couldnt do anything. We were promissed vissits and phone calls and nothing materialised. Eventually we gave up on it. And then when you see all the efforts being made to catch drivers for speeding and the money and resources being spent on this it makes your blood boil! Don't get me wrong, I understand that speeding needs to be controlled but honestly. I was driving down a well known cut through. Over the years it has been subject to many accidents etc and speed cameras were put in place. Thats all well and good, but I spied accross a van sitting on a bend neatly tucked ouot of sight of oncoming traffic. When I reach the van from the other direction, I see he has a brand new fandangled tripod mounted free standing laser gismo 9gawd knows how much thats worth), recording all the traffic and possible violations, not 300 yards after a permenant speed camera! On top of that, we now have a 20 or so large road signs, on the A23 that say "POLICE, Unmarked Cars Operating In This Area"! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNAKEBITE Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 If I break the law I expect to get dealt with. I am only 36 yet I can see the dramatic slide of the quality of law enforcement "since i was a lad". Far from firing from the hip I speak from experience, not urban myths and "my mate down the pub said............" However if i proved wrong I will freely admit it, as I have done in the past. It has been a gradual slide down, who remembers when you got pulled over for having a headlight or brake light out? That never happens now, I have three cars that pass me on the way to work in the morning with only one headlight, they have been like that since we started having lights on at 05:30 morning (September/October?). I am not after a witch hunt but a gentle reminder is all it needs. This might seem a little over the top but the point I am trying to make is it starts with the little things, the lights and slowly it escalates until we have the standard of driving we have today. No one seems to care about anyone else on the road and the only thing that is done is that camersa get put up to fine speeders. Oh and yes I fully believe that if you get caught speeding rather than whine about it pay up. If you want to get rid of cameras then don't speed! The driving analogy can be used in day to day life. There are never policemen/women walking the streets anymore, well not round our way. They speed past in the cars but never develop a relationship with the people on the ground. Anti social behaviour is not dealt with early enough and it slides down to where it is now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Snakebite, you weren't the mayor of New York in a previous life were you I couldn't agree more though, you're spot on Don't forget we've got PCSOs now though - do a wonderful job ( ) P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldBill Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 How many of the 4 covering 300 square miles would you like to walk? Traffic police- hate 'em. One of 'em stood in court opposing me and lied on oath..I couldn't prove it though. Still 34 in a 30 is breaking the law. Just the same as pushing someone is an assault (well, battery to be precise) even if it is minor. Taking a penny sweet is still stealing. Sampling grapes before you buy is also stealing. The point is some laws have to be enforced. How many people here have picked up several dozens of bits of people after a road crash- not many I bet. I'll get back to my point. If you don't like what the old bill are doing, DO SOMETHING about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorfolkBoy Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 I must be lucky that my town's police department has 52 officers.... Town population 15,000... http://www.cranford.com/police/display.asp?choice=7 I do have to pay a private contractor to remove my household garbage though..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldBill Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 I must be lucky that my town's police department has 52 officers.... Town population 15,000... http://www.cranford.com/police/display.asp?choice=7 I do have to pay a private contractor to remove my household garbage though..... but those 52 officers work shifts. Some are detectives, some SWAT, some K9 officers. You don't have 52 officers on the street. My force has around 3000 officers. About 150 on uniformed routine patrol at any one time for 1 million residents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorfolkBoy Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Old Bill Not being argumentative BUT no SWAT officers with the town PD - that's a county issue....as is the K9 section. The detectives are at half strength due to some being on suspension for setting off fireworks in the parking lot..... I kid you not..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 The detectives are at half strength due to some being on suspension for setting off fireworks in the parking lot..... I kid you not..... :yp: P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNAKEBITE Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Snakebite, you weren't the mayor of New York in a previous life were you I couldn't agree more though, you're spot on Don't forget we've got PCSOs now though - do a wonderful job ( ) P. Hang on minute we can't agree on something I've got loads more to complain about I can see your side of things to a point and I've had my say so rather than let it get out of hand I am going to retire and let normal service resume. However I am still willing to back up any points in my arguements if required, I'm stepping back not backing down. :yp: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldBill Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Old Bill Not being argumentative BUT no SWAT officers with the town PD - that's a county issue....as is the K9 section. The detectives are at half strength due to some being on suspension for setting off fireworks in the parking lot..... I kid you not..... Noted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Cheers Snakebite, if we ever meet, I'll buy you a pint P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
death from below Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Old Bill Not being argumentative BUT no SWAT officers with the town PD - that's a county issue....as is the K9 section. The detectives are at half strength due to some being on suspension for setting off fireworks in the parking lot..... I kid you not..... That says it all really.......suspended for chucking fireworks in their carpark.....not very professional and a bit daft.....but suspension..... There is an expression that is used by many police officers up and down the country....."the job is ******". Apparently it was first used by Sir robert peel about two days after setting up the Met police......it was as true then as it is now.... I myself just do as much as I can for as much of the time as possible.....I can therefore take on board ctiticism of my particular job without it effeting my own personal values.....Policing is and always will be a hot talking point due to the very nature of what it entails.....healthy debate will also always be raised. But don't you all love shooting.....I think its great. DFB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNAKEBITE Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 But don't you all love shooting.....I think its great. DFB Amen to that, regardless of what we argue about at least we have that in common. Cheers Snakebite, if we ever meet, I'll buy you a pint P. Is this before or after "he fell down the stairs guv" :yp: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wookie Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Just out of interest, does anyone have any figures for the percenatage of police that are actually out _doing_ things at any one time in an active force? Old Bill's figures seem to suggest that about 5% are actually out on the beat, but that seems very low. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 It's strange how the Police manage to find the resources to buy and equip the most sophisticated mobile speed camera units, and they spare no effort in ruthlessly pursuing and ticketing us generally law abiding folk who happen to be doing 34 in a 30 limit, whilst the *****'s speed through in their stolen Irish plated Mercedes Sprinters, safe in the knowledge that they are beyond the reach of the law. This is not a dig at the ordinary PC, I too have close family connections with serving officers, but somehow the top dogs seem to have lost the plot. Cat. Couldn't agree more. The police are supported by the backbone of middle England and yet most of middle England's only dealings with the police will be on the end of a speeding ticket or an unsolved robbery / mugging reference number. That being said I have three mates who work in the Met and the Met is not like the rest of the police. They really do have better things to do that stick on speeders - if you get pulled in Town and you pass the respect test (and can show you are one of the rare ones who tax and insure their car within the M25) then you will go on your way without a ticket and a sense that you and the police are on the same page and that they have their priorities straight. Got a lot of time for the Met Police, they have a lot on their plates. Essex though, pppffff that's another story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldBill Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Just out of interest, does anyone have any figures for the percenatage of police that are actually out _doing_ things at any one time in an active force? Old Bill's figures seem to suggest that about 5% are actually out on the beat, but that seems very low. I don't think there are any official figures. For any force, you have to allow for shift working spread over a 3,4 or 5 shift pattern. This will automatically mean 33% of the force are on days off. Then take specialist departments into account, CID, dogs, firearms, public order units, specialist squads. Then allow for some doing 9-5 jobs in variety of roles- beat officers, schools liason etc. Then allow for people being sick and having holiday. Don't be overly alarmed by my figures the figure I gave relates to old bill actually patrolling whether by car or foot (during a full blue moon). There are other old bill working, but as I say they are not doing the "routine" patrol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Harry Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Another copper ere to defend my job!!! My force has about 1200 Police officers (not PCSO's). 40% of those are front line, ie meet the public and respond to jobs. Split them across 5 shifts and thet don't leave many for the huge area we cover. 3 of those 1200 officers work on speed detection and drive their vans. This is for a county with loads of youngsters killing themselves and others in their cars. Speed, drink and showing off are the main causes. Their vans were funded by the government and did not come from the local policing budget. To **** you off even more the funding from the government for PCSO's is being withdrawn this year. We will not be able to employ as many police officers this year because we have to pay for a few hundred PCSO's and about £17000 per year, and they cant work after 11pm, arrest anyone, get into conflict, blah, blah, blah. Having said all that I really do enjoy my job and would not want any other. Harry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
il cacciatore Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 You can moan that the police don't have enough powers but you would moan if they had too many. A police state would result in loss of liberty and that has been proven where it has happened. I don't want to live in a society that the police have too much power because it will be abused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjimmer Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Still 34 in a 30 is breaking the law. Just the same as pushing someone is an assault (well, battery to be precise) even if it is minor. Taking a penny sweet is still stealing. Pointing a gun at someone is assault, but police do it all the time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldBill Posted February 5, 2007 Report Share Posted February 5, 2007 Dorset was on my short list for places to move to...it ain't now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro Posted February 6, 2007 Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 My this is a big can of worms Mungler has hit the nail on the head. Most of the coppers I know, (unfortunately there are a lot of young'uns about), are middle aged with kids, mortgages etc and as a result have a bit of savvy. It's much easier to "Give a ####ing" in which the offender goes away thinking that the police are alright and fair, than nick someone and put everyone's backs up. Most of the time in the Met if you pass the "attitude test" and are veering to the side of legality, you'll get away with it P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjimmer Posted February 6, 2007 Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 Dorset was on my short list for places to move to...it ain't now! Don't fancy having the armed response unit interfering with your sport then? The police helicopter hovering over you with the loud hailer hollering at you to leave your guns on the ground and walk 50 yards away when the duck are about to start flighting, just because some **** with a mobile phone has alerted them that "They've got guns". The only way to get a rapid response if you are a victim, is to say that you have guns in the house and that they might be stolen. Don't say you might use them to protect yourself and your property though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highlander Posted February 6, 2007 Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 Sounds to me like one big problem with Ol' Bill (collective not the individual) and that's 'cause they've lost the respect of the law abiding majority of us. In the ol' days if you got taken home in a squad car not only would plod give you a clip round the ear but your ol' man would give you a damn good thrashing. You had a healthy respect for both. Now they'd both be prosecuted for child abuse and you'd most likely grow up a waster! Oh well modern times...a grumpy old man! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldBill Posted February 6, 2007 Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 There is a general degredation of moral and ethical standards in society today. I'm no socialogist, nor am I a rocket scientist but you don't have to be to work out what went wrong. I do PROMISE though that those living in my area will get as traditional service from me and mine, as I'm able to deliver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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