pestcontrol1 Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 as above was just wondering what the pw massives favourite non-tox shot was Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshAndy Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Love hevi-shot - hate the price! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 I love lead and find it just as toxic as the errrr non toxic shot that is actually very toxic what with how fast it is flying I often wonder.....when are we supposed to start seeing the benefits to water birds numbers now that the lead ban is in operation? I mean ever since the ban, moorhens have nearly disappeared compared to before the ban, around here that is U. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donkey Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Gotta say hevi shot glad I bought a load when the dollar was 2 to the pound Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Hevi-shot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 Steel, coz its cheap and it works and it has no links to Cancer and other nasties. Run as the right load (an important point) it has as many advantages as disadvantages, IMO the biggest disadvantage is if you bite down on it, the biggest advantage the short and very full pattern. (not mentioning conservation) which I will come to now The move to non toxic takes many, many years to become of real use to birds that gather grit for their digestion. The reason is there is a lot of lead out there, in the USA they stopped long before us and have many voluntary non use area in areas for game. On some estuaries the channels and sand can move quite dramatically exposing unknown features and also a lot of old lead shot, this doesn't mean the change is a waste of time its just something we had to start. Likewise fresh waters can dry up exposing old lead, just a fact we have to live with not contributing further will help over time but don't expect dramatic short term trends under the circumstances given. Steel once widely adopted as a quality choice bu all manufacturers and a wide a range of shooters as possible can reduce the cost to the shooter. At present the manufacturers that have driven the quality choice in steel Gamebore and more recently Eley with their lightning steel are reaping the rewards of investing in the technology in way of margin. When all are playing a more equal game one only has to start selling cheaper for battle to commence, it will happen it always does. I am not in favour of a lead ban and general move to non toxic by legislation but I don't fear it as regards shotguns (with possible exceptions of .410 and under it makes not a lot of difference), with rifles it will be an unmitigated disaster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 ITM in the Eight, Hevi-shot in the Twelve! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old farrier Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 (edited) Hi I like heavy shot And itm Hate bismuth And am struggling to get to grips with steel although it performs well when I'm on target All the best Of Just to add in the future there may be a issue with ingested steel shot and MRI scans Just a thought Edited May 9, 2014 by Old farrier Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pestcontrol1 Posted May 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 ITM in the Eight, Hevi-shot in the Twelve! Me thinks il have to rob a bank and try itm and hevi Hi I like heavy shot And itm Hate bismuth And am struggling to get to grips with steel although it performs well when I'm on target All the best Of steel works well once you get use to it and get it moving fast. I have shot some cracking birds 2 that stand out was pricked birds well up there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 Me thinks il have to rob a bank and try itm and hevi PC1 As a Wildfowler I have tried just about every type of non-tox shot available since the lead shot ban, I purchased a fair quantity of Hevi from the US when the exchange rate was favourable, and still have a fair bit left! I tried ITM when it first came available, and I rate it as the best for the eight bores, particularly in 4.0mm, for geese.......I have squirrelled enough away from various sources to keep the old Double Tolley fed and probably see me out! If I had to I would use home loaded steel (to US recipes) in the 12 bores without hesitation, as it undoubtedly works and my fowling guns are proved for it....but would not use any hard non-tox in any of my English guns. But in truth I miss the 2 1/2 ozs of size 1 lead in front of Bluedot in the eight for foreshore geese ...............it was uncomplicated, cheap to load.......and over the years really did the biz for me!! P1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pestcontrol1 Posted May 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 P1 yes i know what you mean about the lead i would go back to lead tomorrow if i could but since we cant worse luck its the nontox road. I did try some express hevi shot a few years ago and had mixed feeling about it but now that i load my own there would be better loads out there now. Its funny that you say you like 4mm for geese i to like it in steel thou gives a good patterns and kills well. Do you not rate ITM in 12g ?? Why would you use steel to us recipes is it just a speed thing PC1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 (edited) PC1 With 50 g of 3.5 ITM out of my double Full choke Midland 3" Magnum a couple of years ago I scored a R & L at Big Canada's (the two weighed just short of 29lbs!!) on the shore with the wind up their ****s both stone dead in the air!.......so yes I rate ITM in 12 bore!.............that was after my mate had missed them both barrels with his 10 bore!! ....but I only use Hevi-shot out of the 12 bore these days. Why Us recipes?....because US steel recipes are not fettered by European CIP regs!! P1 Edited May 9, 2014 by panoma1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 What I don't understand is this, how come lead shot shot from a shot gun can be shown to cause problems so we are stopped from using it. What about industry polluting the water ways and the thousands of tons of plastic washed up on the shoreline all the time! It kills thousand of birds a year not to mention other critters! But lead is bad is it! I just think WE are the soft target here....like normal! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berettacocker Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 I think hevi-shot is best ( used it when it first came here,£1 a pop) way too expensive. Like kent says some of the steel loads are good and not over pricey. (Come back lead) thing with steel shot is if you eat a lot of steel shot game and have a build up of shot inside you, and have a MRI scan, the power of the magnets would be like getting shot from the inside out!!!!!!! I'm a veggie! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 I think hevi-shot is best ( used it when it first came here,£1 a pop) way too expensive. Like kent says some of the steel loads are good and not over pricey. (Come back lead) thing with steel shot is if you eat a lot of steel shot game and have a build up of shot inside you, and have a MRI scan, the power of the magnets would be like getting shot from the inside out!!!!!!! I'm a veggie! You serious about being a veggie? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 What I don't understand is this, how come lead shot shot from a shot gun can be shown to cause problems so we are stopped from using it. What about industry polluting the water ways and the thousands of tons of plastic washed up on the shoreline all the time! It kills thousand of birds a year not to mention other critters! But lead is bad is it! I just think WE are the soft target here....like normal! Because we as licensed gun owners are easy to find and cheap for the authorities to regulate and control!......... anything that costs money and/or other resources or is too difficult to enforce (or doesn't suit a purpose)...............the authorities ain't interested!....for example: the authorities will legislate to control/regulate legal gun owners because it is easy and they want to be seen doing something when an incident occurs (and as another insult they now want us to pay for our own regulation via a massive increase in gun license fees) but they don't do beggar all about illegal gun ownership because its too difficult and who will pay for it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berettacocker Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 You serious about being a veggie?. If eating venison loins, pigeon pittas,duck breast and rabbit stews and curries are veggie, then yes I am! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 Because we as licensed gun owners are easy to find and cheap for the authorities to regulate and control!......... anything that costs money and/or other resources or is too difficult to enforce (or doesn't suit a purpose)...............the authorities ain't interested!....for example: the authorities will legislate to control/regulate legal gun owners because it is easy and they want to be seen doing something when an incident occurs (and as another insult they now want us to pay for our own regulation via a massive increase in gun license fees) but they don't do beggar all about illegal gun ownership because its too difficult and who will pay for it? I know and I also know of several people who have dropped out, they now just use archery gear and snares....for everything! They keep a low profile and one gent in particular was a victim of police prejudice! Big brother can only push so far! It likes to divide camps and if it carries on it will lose control completely, about two thirds will continue to suck up and the other third will slip under the radar. The lead shot debate is the same debate as how long is a piece of string! Where do you stop? If I can not use lead shot on water fowl then how about no farm effluent within hundreds of yards of ponds, pit holes being filled with junk, what about the rubbish blown on the wind from land fill and where does it's effluent end up! Plastic wads....when will they be banned! People have been using lead shot since the 1700CE....why are ducks and geese not on the endangered list then? I remember swans having fishing weights in them years ago but they have not died out from it, fishing line how ever is far more dangerous! I have shot birds tangled in fishing line....but lead shot is a big no no is it! They banned lead in petrol for health reasons.....where are the benefits then? Cancer on the rise, probably from the ingredients in non leaded fuels and heavy metal particles from cat' converters! The battle of Blore heath took place near here and the ground is littered with lead ball and lead cannon ball, tons of it all leaching lead oxides into the environment. Is it dead of all life there....no. Is the ground quartered off so no food can be grown or raised on it......no! Oh It's bull, and those that believe it are either fools or bull artists them selves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pestcontrol1 Posted May 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 U I take it you dont like an dont use any nontox then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 U I take it you dont like an dont use any nontox then If I have to I will cut some bismuth out of shells for the frontloaders, hate bismuth too It is another reason that if I want a duck I will use a rifle! I won't put steel through my sxs's or old auto, the muzzleloaders won't be quick enough past 20yds....only get thirty with lead! Forcing redundancy on older guns for political correctness is stupid. I also understand that small plastic beads and the small pieces used in injection mouldings finding their way into the water course is also deadly to birds and other, where is the politicians on that one? RSPCA?RSPB? When it gets to much I will be wayyyy back in the back woods.....minding my own business! U Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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