aka_t50 Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 Hi guys just after some help for those with a bit more knowledge than me I have just purchased a davies, w. j. damscus hammer gun 12g Im told its a live pigeon gun but have no idea what that means. there is some pitting in the barrels but not what I would call a lot but im no expert its very tight when its closed up and the bloke I bought it of said it was sold to him as safe to shoot what I would like to know is what I should be careful of and do I need to use a special cartridge to keep it safe also any other info people might have on the make and possible age and value of the gun. I know its a lot to ask but any info would be gratefully received Thanks Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 A live pigeon gun was used for shooting live pigeons that were released from traps . The for runner of clay shooting . Massive wagers were bet on these competitions . Harnser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demonwolf444 Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/292093-proof-marks-and-pressures/ Read what i have posted here. My opinion for what its worth on shooting any old guns. Keep the loads light, Hull imperial game have an excellent range of game shells from 28 to 32 grams. Make sure you have the right length shells for your chambers.. ie. 2 1/2 inch chambers need 2 1/2 inch shells or 65mm. Don't have any other info aside from whats been said above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 IS it Nitro proofed? IF not dont shoot nitro shells! Worth getting as decent gunsmith to give it a once over and measure the walls! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figgy Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 It's down to the trappers and lines to open the lids to release the live pigeons from crates and baskets we still call pull today. Some it names back in the day made a lot of money at it. He lice is probably closest to it in today's shooting. Figgy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 BEFORE you shoot it, have it checked by a gunsmith. Don't trust the word of the seller who had been told by 'someone' that it was OK. It may well be OK, but if it isn't, a nasty accident could happen . It would certainly ruin the gun, might well injure you or anyone else nearby. Much better safe than sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlesP Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 John's advice to take it to a gunsmith is solid gold advice. Not just any gunsmith - like merely a retailer, but someone who can reasonably judge the extent of the pitting, someone who understands the proof marks, and who has a bore gauge. Should this person discover that the gun is out of proof (ie bore measurements greater than allowable) then take it back to the vendor, tell him he is committing an offence by selling an out-of-proof gun and get your money back, or get him to have it reproofed at his expense and his risk If it's only black powder proof, do the same, the chap won't be selling an out of proof gun but he will be misrepresenting its safety. Maybe he will agree to have the gun submitted for reproof (which will necessarily involve fine boring) at his expense and risk. If the pitting is deep enough to mean that any necessary fine boring to remove it would remove sufficient metal to render the gun out of proof, then take it back as above If the gunsmith measures the barrel walls and tells you there's too little left for asfety, then take it back. Get him to check that the rib hasn't lifted and the lumps are solid. If everything with the barrels is fine then get the gunsmith to tell you if the apparently tight action is merely unworn or if someone has been clouting the lumps for a temporary bodge. A live pigeon gun is usually a bit heavier than an ordinary game gun, this may be to your advantage in this case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_t50 Posted August 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Morning guys and a big thanks for advice so pretty much what I thought the gun is nitro proofed and was sold as 23/4 chamber but I suspect its 21/2 I will take it to my local gunsmith this week and ask him to take a look the other ting I could do with some advice on is the barrels are waxed and are sticky is there any way I can get rid of this or is this just a side effect of Damascus thanks Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demonwolf444 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Even way back when as i understand it, "live pigeon guns" often had longer chambers, i am sure i have heard of very old guns with 3 inch chambers as original. The issue is that a lot of three inch cartridges today are "magnum" cartridges, which would be unsafe to use. But standard velocity cartridges would be fine. When damascus barrels are re browned you can coat them with several things, beeswax is the original way, boiled linseed oil, or shellac. In my experience boiled linseed oil remains tacky for a while, and beeswax as its bee made, varies greatly, so some beeswax can be sticky. I don't know how you would remove the stickiness without harming the browning. James. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_t50 Posted August 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Thanks mate just had a great hour looking at your projects must say how amazing they are me and the better half couldn't believe the start to finish quality is great have you had any gun smithing training or are you self taught Thanks Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 live pigeon guns were usually tightly choked.... A live pigeon gun was used for shooting live pigeons that were released from traps . The for runner of clay shooting . Massive wagers were bet on these competitions .Harnser think that is where the words come from...."PULL"......"TRAP" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holloway Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Your chamber length should be marked on the flats if not a simple job to measure to the start of the chamber shoulder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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