Lies Told To Norway

[Danger-Mouse]

It does when you can quite easily switch trading partners to someone still in your club, whereas your former trading partner has just cut themselves out of the largest trading bloc in history.

 

 

 

Yes that works,maybe Greece,Croatia or Bulgaria could make up the shortfall in the £48 bn of lost German car sales to the UK ?

 

 

 

 

Do you want to come back when you've decided which it is?

 

 

Really? You`re going to argue over someone rounding up a figure? That`s kinda pathetic.

 

As Rewulf said, who is going to magically find $47 billion down the back of the sofa to buy all these cars? It`s not like Germany isn`t already selling it`s cars across the EU.

[Granett]

Arguing over figures out by 33% or £12bn pathetic? Really? It has been a rich vein throughout the campaigning that those that would leave fail to grasp the numbers - the economic arguments for remaining. Now we're to gloss over that?

 

I don't think anyone's denying it's going to rough for people like BMW, but their desire to sell us cars is going to be in the hands of the Commission, not the board of BMW.

Edited June 17, 2016 by Granett

[Rewulf]

Arguing over figures out by 33% or £12bn pathetic? Really? It has been a rich vein throughout the campaigning that those that would leave fail to grasp the numbers - the economic arguments for remaining. Now we're to gloss over that?

 

I don't think anyone's denying it's going to rough for people like BMW, but their desire to sell us cars is going to be in the hands of the Commission, not the board of BMW.

 

Umm, the difference between £48 bn and £47.3 bn is £700,000,000 ,see I can add up !

 

What also makes a big difference in car sales is parts back up and service,worth further billions a year.

 

Who would have thought BMW is run by the EU commision, WOW!

Edited June 17, 2016 by Rewulf

[ShootingEgg]

 

Thats pretty. Shame the question was what do they buy.. Also % don't mean big numbers... And vice versa.

[Danger-Mouse]

Arguing over figures out by 33% or £12bn pathetic? Really? It has been a rich vein throughout the campaigning that those that would leave fail to grasp the numbers - the economic arguments for remaining. Now we're to gloss over that?

 

Ah I see now, an error between $ and £. A simple enough mistake to make considering we`re used to quoting things in £s.

 

It doesn`t actually change anything though does it?

Edited June 17, 2016 by Danger-Mouse

[Rewulf]

 

Ah I see now, an error between $ and £. A simple enough mistake to make considering we`re used to quoting things in £s.

 

It doesn`t actually change anything though does it?

 

He only quoted the difference so he didnt have to answer the main argument anyway.

A 5th of German car output comes to the UK ,but according to his argument ,they will send no more cars here,but will make it up with other countries in the 'bloc'

And all because the EU will tell them they cant!

Mind boggling how on one hand you can state that the EU is not dictatorial and meddlesome ,yet then state these things could actually happen!

[AVB]

 

He only quoted the difference so he didnt have to answer the main argument anyway.

A 5th of German car output comes to the UK ,but according to his argument ,they will send no more cars here,but will make it up with other countries in the 'bloc'

And all because the EU will tell them they cant!

Mind boggling how on one hand you can state that the EU is not dictatorial and meddlesome ,yet then state these things could actually happen!

 

I don't believe that the EU could prevent a company doing business in another country other than if they declared us a 'rogue state' and imposed trade sanctions on us. Let's not forget that the fallback position is the World Trade Organisation under whose rules companies would still be able to trade. Would they be more expensive under WTO? Almost certainly although market forces define price more than tariffs alone.

[oowee]

 

I don't believe that the EU could prevent a company doing business in another country other than if they declared us a 'rogue state' and imposed trade sanctions on us. Let's not forget that the fallback position is the World Trade Organisation under whose rules companies would still be able to trade. Would they be more expensive under WTO? Almost certainly although market forces define price more than tariffs alone.

And ,market prices would force labour rates down in the UK to compensate for tarifs and tax movements for sales purposes abroad. New Foreign Direct Investment (expansion of foreign owned UK companies) would favour the EU. The UK has been the largest recipient of FDI for years and this will be lost. Why make stuff here to sell into Europe?

[Rewulf]

 

I don't believe that the EU could prevent a company doing business in another country other than if they declared us a 'rogue state' and imposed trade sanctions on us. Let's not forget that the fallback position is the World Trade Organisation under whose rules companies would still be able to trade. Would they be more expensive under WTO? Almost certainly although market forces define price more than tariffs alone.

 

I dont pretend to know how it all works these days, but surely it makes more sense not to wrap everything up in red tape and complication.

Business works best when it runs smoothly and unhindered, exactly why I think we are better of out of the EU.

Nearly 30 years ago when I was involved with bringing cars into this country,Japanese cars attracted more duty than European cars,as I remember something like a 15 % difference.

The Japanese eventually got round this by producing the cars in the UK ,so then they werent imported so did not attract the higher tax.

It made Jap cars more competitive and provided jobs.

Peugeot ,Citreon and others followed the example,making transportation costs cheaper and streamlining the motor trade when it was going through rough times.

Nowadays the EU are actively encouraging them (with cheap loans) to move to Eastern European countries (plus Turkey) without thought for the job losses and impact on our economy.

All this and we are told they really really want us to stay,doesnt look like it to me.

A straightforward question to Remainers ,if this referendum was about joining,not leaving ,how would you vote?

Edited June 17, 2016 by Rewulf

[Rewulf]

And ,market prices would force labour rates down in the UK to compensate for tarifs and tax movements for sales purposes abroad. New Foreign Direct Investment (expansion of foreign owned UK companies) would favour the EU. The UK has been the largest recipient of FDI for years and this will be lost. Why make stuff here to sell into Europe?

 

Why make stuff in Europe to sell here?

Why not make it here and sell it here,makes the product cheaper,fresher and creates jobs.

[Granett]

 

He only quoted the difference so he didnt have to answer the main argument anyway.

 

Jees - now you're just ignoring the bits in my posts you can't answer?

 

 

I dont pretend to know how it all works these days, but surely it makes more sense...

 

Yeah, I think that sums up the basis on which is resting a large chunk of Vote Leave's support

A straightforward question to Remainers ,if this referendum was about joining,not leaving ,how would you vote?

 

If we could join on the terms we have, absolutely Yes.

 

Unfortunately we'd never get offered them.

[rjimmer]

 

 

If we could join on the terms we have, absolutely Yes.

 

-1

[12gauge82]

I believe there's more opportunity for trade out of the EU and it will also encourage healthy business rather than the sick ones artificially propped up by the EU at present, but none of that matters to me anyway, I lost a relative I never met keeping this country a free democracy, unless the EU becomes a democracy all other talk is just noise to me, end of story.

Lest we forget

[Rewulf]

 

Jees - now you're just ignoring the bits in my posts you can't answer?

 

 

Yeah, I think that sums up the basis on which is resting a large chunk of Vote Leave's support

 

If we could join on the terms we have, absolutely Yes.

 

Unfortunately we'd never get offered them.

 

Ive just looked back and ,no you have not asked me a single question.

I will answer anything you ask about the referendum or the EU,with my opinion ,and if I can find a source to back it up (because otherwise you will ignore it ) I will.

Common sense is usually the best policy in my book,if someone tells you something ,do you automatically think it correct,or do you use your head and think about it first before deciding ,eg: If you are told that we will face economic ruin after Brexit,do you think a.Yes that will definitely happen or b.Why would that be then ?

You seem to think the EU promises utopia ,yet demonstrate dystopia ,I can only think you have other reasons why you vehemently would like to remain.

Whichever,I wish you good fortune on the result you prefer.

[UKPoacher]

And don't forget that VW cars are significantly less expensive in non EU countries such as Australia and Canada.

[oowee]

 

Why make stuff in Europe to sell here?

Why not make it here and sell it here,makes the product cheaper,fresher and creates jobs.

Because we are too small a market place. For 35 years I worked to attract foreign business to UK much of it only came because we are in the EU and our relaxed labour laws. These companies, this future investment will go to Europe so less of the product is subject to tariff.

And don't forget that VW cars are significantly less expensive in non EU countries such as Australia and Canada.

Tax? and spec.

Edited June 17, 2016 by oowee

[Granett]

Unless the EU becomes a democracy all other talk is just noise to me, end of story.

In what way is it less of a democracy than Britain will be after a vote to leave?

 

 

You seem to think the EU promises utopia ,yet demonstrate dystopia ,I can only think you have other reasons why you vehemently would like to remain.

Not what I think and not what I've demonstrated (unless you can show me otherwise). My reason for voting to stay is because on balance the evidence and the impartial commentators agree that Britain will be better in than out. My vehemence is due to me not feeling like staying quiet on this topic today.

 

Likewise on the good fortune - if we end up out, I sincerely hope I'm proved wrong.

Edited June 17, 2016 by Granett

[ShootingEgg]

 

If we could join on the terms we have, absolutely Yes.

 

So give a load of money away get a bit back, 60% of our legislations made up by people we cant name... And let anyone travel here no matter of there skill set.. Oh and free trade, best not forget that...

 

Do you work in the UK? If yes why? You have the freedom to go where ever you like to work with in the EU.. Oh wait the benifits in other countries arent that good, thats why everyone is coming here and filling this country.. currently 3.5 times more crowded than france.

 

And before you say it "typical brexit anti imagination" im not anti it, but if we fill this country which we are doing then we wont have a thing! Why are rrmainers saying brexit supporters are anti when actually all they say is adopt a points base system not a free for all.

[Granett]

So give a load of money away get a bit back, 60% of our legislations made up by people we cant name... And let anyone travel here no matter of there skill set.. Oh and free trade, best not forget that...

 

Do you work in the UK? If yes why? You have the freedom to go where ever you like to work with in the EU.. Oh wait the benifits in other countries arent that good, thats why everyone is coming here and filling this country.. currently 3.5 times more crowded than france.

 

And before you say it "typical brexit anti imagination" im not anti it, but if we fill this country which we are doing then we wont have a thing! Why are rrmainers saying brexit supporters are anti when actually all they say is adopt a points base system not a free for all.

 

Because I'd rather legislation be drawn up efficiently rather than waste money on the exact same legislation drawn up at Britain's sole cost, I rather be part of Europe than outside it, immigration is a net benefit to this country, I enjoy living in this country, and don't vote purely on the basis of personal gain.

[oowee]

 

And before you say it "typical brexit anti imagination" im not anti it, but if we fill this country which we are doing then we wont have a thing! Why are rrmainers saying brexit supporters are anti when actually all they say is adopt a points base system not a free for all.

Because to trade with the EU they will insist on open border migration as part of the trade deal. The money we save from EU membership will go on tariffs and the down turn in the economy will be more than the cost of EU membership. We need migrants to maintain growth and pay our pensions. Any points based system / or quota approach would slow down growth or be so woolly as to be meaningless.

[secretagentmole]

 

Because I'd rather legislation be drawn up efficiently rather than waste money on the exact same legislation drawn up at Britain's sole cost, I rather be part of Europe than outside it, immigration is a net benefit to this country, I enjoy living in this country, and don't vote purely on the basis of personal gain.

No immigration is not a net gain to the country. Most of those who have migrated here are a drain on the country, this is in terms of benefits claimed and services used. The NHS cannot cope because the population has increased beyond funding, now if they were all working and paying national insurance contributions then that would be good, but they are not. They are put to the front of the housing lists in most areas, hence complaints about social housing waiting lists. Their children are attending schools, pushing up class sizes, yet unable to speak English so the education that British children should be receiving is getting worse and worse as the teachers have to try and teach English as a foreign language to Lithuanian, Albanian, Polish, Romanian and children from other Eastern European states that have taken membership of the EU and export people faster than Dacia can export cars!

 

When they come here we do not get a shed load of cash from Europe to cope with them, we are left to sort it out.

Edited June 17, 2016 by secretagentmole

[Granett]

No immigration is not a net gain to the country. Most of those who have migrated here are a drain on the country, this is in terms of benefits claimed and services used. The NHS cannot cope because the population has increased beyond funding, now if they were all working and paying national insurance contributions then that would be good, but they are not. They are put to the front of the housing lists in most areas, hence complaints about social housing waiting lists. Their children are attending schools, pushing up class sizes, yet unable to speak English so the education that British children should be receiving is getting worse and worse as the teachers have to try and teach English as a foreign language to Lithuanian, Albanian, Polish, Romanian and children from other Eastern European states that have taken membership of the EU and export people faster than Dacia can export cars!

 

When they come here we do not get a shed load of cash from Europe to cope with them, we are left to sort it out.

Want to provide a credible source for that? I won't hold my breath. While you're looking:-

 

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/news-articles/1114/051114-economic-impact-EU-immigration

 

"European immigrants to the UK have paid more in taxes than they received in benefits, helping to relieve the fiscal burden on UK-born workers and contributing to the financing of public services"

[oowee]

No immigration is not a net gain to the country. Most of those who have migrated here are a drain on the country, this is in terms of benefits claimed and services used. The NHS cannot cope because the population has increased beyond funding, now if they were all working and paying national insurance contributions then that would be good, but they are not. They are put to the front of the housing lists in most areas, hence complaints about social housing waiting lists. Their children are attending schools, pushing up class sizes, yet unable to speak English so the education that British children should be receiving is getting worse and worse as the teachers have to try and teach English as a foreign language to Lithuanian, Albanian, Polish, Romanian and children from other Eastern European states that have taken membership of the EU and export people faster than Dacia can export cars!

 

When they come here we do not get a shed load of cash from Europe to cope with them, we are left to sort it out.

This is taken from the Mail and the Telegraph both of which took only part of the information from the Dustmann and Frattini report and failed to report the conclusion.

The study concluded that, over that decade, EU migrants made a net positive contribution of £20bn. Of this £20bn, migrants from the original 15 EU western European countries contributed £15bn more to the UK economy than they took out, while those from the 10 eastern European accession states, such as Poland, made a net contribution of £5bn. On top of that, recent migrants from outside Europe have also made a net contribution of more than £5bn bringing the net benefit to Britain’s finances from recent immigration to more than £25 billion over the past decade.

Snap

[12gauge82]

In what way is it less of a democracy than Britain will be after a vote to leave?

 

Not what I think and not what I've demonstrated (unless you can show me otherwise). My reason for voting to stay is because on balance the evidence and the impartial commentators agree that Britain will be better in than out. My vehemence is due to me not feeling like staying quiet on this topic today.

 

Likewise on the good fortune - if we end up out, I sincerely hope I'm proved wrong.

Because the EU and appointed people make and pass laws which can not be changed, these appointed people can not be voted out and the laws can not be changed, how is that a democracy

[12gauge82]

As an example the people can do nothing regarding immigration while a member of the eu