North korea and japan

[Zapp]

Patriot isn't designed or intended for ICBM intercept.

[ditchman]

Patriot isn't designed or intended for ICBM intercept.

 

 

 

they know that we know that....everybody knows that....................so it is going to be a pre-emptive strike...on the silos and mobile ones....i dont think USA et al is going to wait for Ping pong to hit them first.........

[Zapp]

The North Koreans just want to secure their personality cult in such a way that nobody can ever threaten them and gain leverage with economic sanctions. Nobody can defend against an ICBM because it is in outerspace, Raegans star wars project was never anywhere near a reality. Defending against such missiles just isn't possible short of having some sort of missile defense system on the moon and even then you'd need some sort of laser system not invented yet.

 

Bear in mind the North Koreans are not crazy, far from it, the Korean Peninsula has the highest average IQ on earth and to keep such a population in servitude shows an incredible ability to organize. They know exactly what they are doing.

ICBM defence is theoretically possible, just extremely hard to do. You can intercept in the terminal because since ICBMs are true ballistic missiles once you have a track on them you can predict where the RV or RVs will land and can therefore select an intercept point.

 

The problem is more to do with penetration aids and decoys which are dispensed from the payload section which either produce very large radar returns or which are RCS matched against the RV. Missile defence shot doctrine is at least two, if not three or four interceptors per target. If youre up against an advanced country like Russua or China and find yourself facing a 5-10 MIRV payload with penaids and decoys, it doesnt take long to exhaust your supply, and thats without considering that ICBMs would be salvo launched.

 

Boost phase intercept is the other option and something everyone would really like to do, but would probably need orbital weapons, which are currently prohibited under various treaties.

[Zapp]

 

 

 

they know that we know that....everybody knows that....................so it is going to be a pre-emptive strike...on the silos and mobile ones....i dont think USA et al is going to wait for Ping pong to hit them first.........

My post was a reply to ordnances comment about SCUDs which then talked about intercepting ICBMs.

 

NK has no silo launched BMs . They are all mobile.

[kyska]

School kids were able to hack into NASA and the Pentagon secure systems without undue difficulty. Maybe there is a child somewhere, sitting a bedroom with a computer, who could hack into a missiles control system and steer it straight back to the launch pad, or disable it before it ever left the ground. Much cheaper than trying to shoot it down.

No doubt an expert will be able to tell me that this cannot be done, but quite a lot of impossible things have been achieved over the years.

Hav you e mailed the NSA about this, I imagine they've not thought of such things.

[ordnance]

My post was a reply to ordnances comment about SCUDs which then talked about intercepting ICBMs.

 

NK has no silo launched BMs . They are all mobile.

I said if they develop ICBMs.

 

Ordnance. The problem is thats what the American military said about the Patriot in Iraqi, it was the Israelis that started to question the claims. The only thing they successfully shot down was a RAF Tornado jet. If they develop a ICBM then the chances of shooting down a missile successfully becomes a lot more difficult than some seem to think.

[ordnance]

Edit.

Edited September 16, 2017 by ordnance

[Zapp]

I know, I read it before I replied.

[kyska]

ICBM defence is theoretically possible, just extremely hard to do. You can intercept in the terminal because since ICBMs are true ballistic missiles once you have a track on them you can predict where the RV or RVs will land and can therefore select an intercept point.

 

The problem is more to do with penetration aids and decoys which are dispensed from the payload section which either produce very large radar returns or which are RCS matched against the RV. Missile defence shot doctrine is at least two, if not three or four interceptors per target. If youre up against an advanced country like Russua or China and find yourself facing a 5-10 MIRV payload with penaids and decoys, it doesnt take long to exhaust your supply, and thats without considering that ICBMs would be salvo launched.

 

Boost phase intercept is the other option and something everyone would really like to do, but would probably need orbital weapons, which are currently prohibited under various treaties.

An eloquent, thoughtful and learned response.

 

It truly describes the importance of deterrence.

 

The thought of orbital weapons scare me, a new balance of power, anything that negates MAD is a scary thought.

 

IMO NK are already a nuclear power, lots of countries have been and given them up, South Africa and some obscure others.

 

The issue now is balance, Pakistan and India were a nuclear melting pot, until a balance was struck.

 

I'm not sure where NK is going with this.

 

We, the west, have meddled so much in others affairs to make other states very nervous.

[Zapp]

I don't know where they are trying to go either. The only thing that's for sure is that once they have the weapon and the delivery system sorted the genie will be well and truly out of the bottle.

[Mice!]

It hopefully is all about look what we've got, the whole point of nuclear weapons is all the big players have them so no one uses them, its about deterrent.

 

I watched something last week about HMS Dreadnought? It was commissioned built and sailed to Australia to defend a harbour, never fired a shot in anger so job done no one got hurt.

[pinfireman]

Ditchy, you are well up on world affairs aren't you?

 

Nothing will happen over these incidents. China will not get involved as it has 95% of the trade with North Korea. The Russians will not get involved as it is not their fight and they don't need to. The Americans will not fire a retaliatory missile as that will upset the two aforementioned.

Until one missile lands where it should not....then all bets are off!

 

I am not well up on these matters but I believe that the only 'American' soil within missile range is the base of Guam. There is a long history to the American 'ownership' of Guam which makes interesting reading. Let me put it this way, Guam is not as American as apple pie.

It is if a missile lands there!

if one lands on American soil you will want to change that statement

 

 

He will never drop one on USA soil , Kim ping pong will just keep taunting the the USA until they snap and start a punch up. That way everything Kim ping pong does will just be in defence / self defence

You may find that an error in the flight path of one of these missiles will negate your statement! They do not always go where intended.......

[pinfireman]

You can bet on it. I would not at be at all surprised to see China and Russia standing behind Kim plinky pong . The military might of both those countries would make the USA poo the bed !

 

And I think both leaders would love the chance to see danald trump wind his neck in .

Don,t bet on it! Russia will NEVER put herself at risk for North Korea, and China will think twice......she does 50 times the amount of trade with America than she does with North Korea, and it,s trade that,s dragged China into the 21st century. The Chinese do not want to go back to abject poverty!

[mudpatten]

During the second world war the Imperial Japanese Army kidnapped an alleged 200,000 Korean women and forced them in to sex slavery as "comfort women" for the Japanese troops.

 

It`s quite likely that the North Koreans, bonkers as they are, have not yet forgotten this.

 

[fern01]

During the second world war the Imperial Japanese Army kidnapped an alleged 200,000 Korean women and forced them in to sex slavery as "comfort women" for the Japanese troops.

 

It`s quite likely that the North Koreans, bonkers as they are, have not yet forgotten this.

 

 

 

The Chinese may not have forgotten Nanking and all the other Japanese atrocities either.

[clakk]

Yes there,s plenty of film footage of Japanese experiments on Chinese soldiers and civilians and having fought them in Burma grandad hated them with a loathing for what they did to his friends .The far east wars between China/Japan and Russia were nothing to do with humanity and an absolute horror story of depravity and atrocity .So none of the potential combatants in this potmess have any moral high ground .

The so called human race in a nutshell

[kyska]

Yes there,s plenty of film footage of Japanese experiments on Chinese soldiers and civilians and having fought them in Burma grandad hated them with a loathing for what they did to his friends .The far east wars between China/Japan and Russia were nothing to do with humanity and an absolute horror story of depravity and atrocity .So none of the potential combatants in this potmess have any moral high ground .

The so called human race in a nutshell

My grandfather was in Burma too.

 

I was only reading today at the vast numbers of people killed, not entirely in the shade of Hitler's headcount.

[Mice!]

It was never spoken about when I was at school doing history it was always Germans Germans, I read an article some time ago that when Japan occupied part of China they were actively made to be mean to the local population, and by mean I'm meaning torture rape etc so it's no wonder they don't like each other.

 

Also read bits and pieces about Burma and other conflicts around Thailand which make you cringe, the fact they dropped two nukes on them before they surrendered says how bad it could be if it was all to kick off.