12 gauge for novice

[Gerry78]

23 hours ago, Gunman said:

Suggest a field grade O/U , 28" with fixed chokes 1/2 & 1/4 for preference ,if its a multi just use these until you are confident .There are so many about so just find one that you feel comfortable with ,The shop should ,THATS SHOULD , be able to advise you and see that the gun fits you reasonably well .  Ask advice but dont be persuaded by over jealous sales pitches or in some case " mates and blokes at the club" who are very keen to sell you something .

As said before semi autos are a no no on most game shoots 

Here' s the reasoning for my suggestion .

As a novice you need to learn to shoot , lessons are fine if you can find a good teacher >you will need to learn how to stand and mount , this will change as you adapt to the gun so dont even think of gun fitting for at least 6 months , thats if you have problems > fixed choke so you do not get confused and start blaming the wrong choke for misses , I would also advise sticking to one cartridge so as to give the best consistency .Taking out as many variables as possible so if you miss its you.> 28" as this is in my opinion the best all round barrel length and will be more handelable until you have built up the necessary muscle memory to hold and swing consistantly .

After 6/12 months you will then be able to decide if this is the gun for you , maybe try others and indeed change if you want and you will know yourself what feels right and what doesn't . 

PS. I have used the word consistantly several times . Thats because IMHO based and a lifetime in the trade that lack of consistency is one of the biggest problems a lot of shooters have .

THIS ☝️☝️☝️

12 hours ago, sam triple said:

SxS maybe traditional but no one wants them , I’ve got one and never use it , it’s evolution I guess like a Model T compared to a Tesla but each to their own 

I still shot my S/S even for clays but your correct with the explosion 💥 of clay pigeon shooting over the decades the o/u has become quite popular BUT have to admit there’s something about side by sides when you handle one Maybe I watched too many cowboy 🤠 movies 👊

[Stimo22]

Why would you not use a sine by side 16g occasionally when you have it

[Dave at kelton]

11 hours ago, Scully said:

A modern 2&3/4 chambered HP steel proofed multi-choked OU will have much more resale value and desirability than a fixed choke nitro proofed OU, dependant on what make and model, but all are capable of handling steel shot. 

A traditional double triggered, short chambered, fixed choke, thin walled sxs has none of these properties, and unless the cartridge manufacturers come up with something to suit them, the impending lead shot ban coupled with a generous smattering of indecision will render many obsolete, so is not a good choice. 

I agree with your first paragraph but not your second. I have shot this season with a high quality, thin walled, English side lock ejector using Eley Ecosteel. There have been absolutely no issues and when I do my job it kills. That being said it is not a starter gun and never will be

[London Best]

38 minutes ago, Gerry78 said:

THIS ☝️☝️☝️

I still shot my S/S even for clays but your correct with the explosion 💥 of clay pigeon shooting over the decades the o/u has become quite popular BUT have to admit there’s something about side by sides when you handle one Maybe I watched too many cowboy 🤠 movies 👊

 

25 minutes ago, Stimo22 said:

Why would you not use a sine by side 16g occasionally when you have it

I only own SxS guns. Wouldn’t have an OU as a gift (well, maybe a Mackay Brown or a Woodward or a Boss!). I would buy an auto before I bought an OU.

[Stonepark]

On 15/02/2023 at 16:51, Acerforestry said:

Having just had approval for shotgun license, I realise I have a couple of months before purchasing anything but I'm looking at what is out there for a modest budget, and ideally nearly new at that budget (£500 ish). I quite like the idea of a semi auto and in that range the Winchester SX3 holds some appeal - opinions please, would be mainly for clays but possible pheasant shoot also

Acer,

going back to the start.... for regular clays and possibly some walker up pheasants, pigeons etc you want a Sporter OU 28 or 30 inch multichoke that fits you.

Some get along with Brownings, some Beretta, some Franchi, some Bettsolini, some Lincoln, some Yildiz etc as each manufacturer has their own recipe for the "average" shooter and whom they size and fit their guns for and the important matter when learning, is to find an acceptable gun off the shelf which fits you as closely as possible and then once you are happy with your progression in 12 to 18 months and if you are not happy with the gun you already have, to look for a "keeper" .

Most of the cheaper guns will resell for at least 75% of what you pay (as long as you don't over pay) through private sale but a lot of gunshops will not deal in S/H less expensive guns as there is not significant margin in it for them. Ideally if they do take a less expensive gun in they are looking for 30 inch or 32 inch barrels, multi choke, 3 inch chambers and the newest required discriminator is Steel shot proofed.

Whilst learning, arguably there is no need for chokes more than 3/8 (Light modified) and I would siggest ***** (Cylinder) or SK (Skeet) in your first barrel and **** (IC or 1/4) in your second and leave them there. First barrel will cover to 35 yards, 2nd barrel will reach to 40 yards, but both will provide a significant spread pattern at closer distances to help offset any accuracy issues as you are learning.

Likewise with ammo, ignore the top and bottom of the ranges and start with something middle range and consistant with moderate recoil and speed.

Use 28g fibre 2.2mm no8 for clays and use 28g fibre 2.4mm (No7 UK or 7.5IT) for everything else (I personally prefer FBlack Sporting 8.5IT (No8 UK) and White Gold 7.5 (UK No7) but other alternatives are out there and anything you are looking to shoot for Clays (No8) and pheasants/pigeons etc (no7) and you are on target with will drop, if it is within 40 yards.

Happy hunting!

[udderlyoffroad]

14 hours ago, Acerforestry said:

is there any particular guns in the bracket mentioned that will sell easier should that be necessary at any point, makes / models that are particularly desirable, thanks

Everyone will tell you secondhand Beretta or Browning, if you're worried about resale value.

But I found when I got my SGC end of 2018, I certainly couldn't find one for less than £800, never mind £500 .  So, I went for new Turkish ATA O/U at a shade under £600 at the time, much to the consternation of many on here.  So far no regrets, as I must be built like the average Turkish male, as the gun seems to fit me.

A few months later I bought a second hand Hatsan Escort Semi Auto for £150 to scratch that itch.

I've still got both. 

You  might find that because times are harder now, you can pick up a Beretta Silver Pigeon for £500

[Scully]

2 hours ago, Dave at kelton said:

I agree with your first paragraph but not your second. I have shot this season with a high quality, thin walled, English side lock ejector using Eley Ecosteel. There have been absolutely no issues and when I do my job it kills. That being said it is not a starter gun and never will be

For those who aren’t terrified of ruining their guns and are simultaneously terrified of submitting it for HP steel shot proofing, that’s grand, but what about trade in/resale value? 

[London Best]

1 minute ago, Scully said:

For those who aren’t terrified of ruining their guns and are simultaneously terrified of submitting it for HP steel shot proofing, that’s grand, but what about trade in/resale value? 

I’m much like Dave at kelton, in that this season my Holland has had some steel through it, both Eley and Express, with no ill effects. 
As regards resale value, I have no desire to sell any of my guns before I die.

[Scully]

8 minutes ago, London Best said:

I’m much like Dave at kelton, in that this season my Holland has had some steel through it, both Eley and Express, with no ill effects. 
As regards resale value, I have no desire to sell any of my guns before I die.

Good for you. You both own quality guns, which would attract a premium abroad if not this country. 
The OP however doesn’t, and is concerned about resale value. 

[Gerry78]

6 hours ago, London Best said:

 

I only own SxS guns. Wouldn’t have an OU as a gift (well, maybe a Mackay Brown or a Woodward or a Boss!). I would buy an auto before I bought an OU.

LB You’re not asking for much 🤭😀

[Dave at kelton]

4 hours ago, Scully said:

For those who aren’t terrified of ruining their guns and are simultaneously terrified of submitting it for HP steel shot proofing, that’s grand, but what about trade in/resale value? 

You are dead right what about resale value? Fortunately I don’t have to sell my guns at present and am happy to ride it out as I feel it will not be as bad as we all fear. That said the value of my collection has doubtless dropped like a stone and isn’t the investment I hoped. Hey ho still nice to have them and the kids can worry about it when I go up the chimney. 😂

[Acerforestry]

10 hours ago, Stonepark said:

Acer,

going back to the start.... for regular clays and possibly some walker up pheasants, pigeons etc you want a Sporter OU 28 or 30 inch multichoke that fits you.

Some get along with Brownings, some Beretta, some Franchi, some Bettsolini, some Lincoln, some Yildiz etc as each manufacturer has their own recipe for the "average" shooter and whom they size and fit their guns for and the important matter when learning, is to find an acceptable gun off the shelf which fits you as closely as possible and then once you are happy with your progression in 12 to 18 months and if you are not happy with the gun you already have, to look for a "keeper" .

Most of the cheaper guns will resell for at least 75% of what you pay (as long as you don't over pay) through private sale but a lot of gunshops will not deal in S/H less expensive guns as there is not significant margin in it for them. Ideally if they do take a less expensive gun in they are looking for 30 inch or 32 inch barrels, multi choke, 3 inch chambers and the newest required discriminator is Steel shot proofed.

Whilst learning, arguably there is no need for chokes more than 3/8 (Light modified) and I would siggest ***** (Cylinder) or SK (Skeet) in your first barrel and **** (IC or 1/4) in your second and leave them there. First barrel will cover to 35 yards, 2nd barrel will reach to 40 yards, but both will provide a significant spread pattern at closer distances to help offset any accuracy issues as you are learning.

Likewise with ammo, ignore the top and bottom of the ranges and start with something middle range and consistant with moderate recoil and speed.

Use 28g fibre 2.2mm no8 for clays and use 28g fibre 2.4mm (No7 UK or 7.5IT) for everything else (I personally prefer FBlack Sporting 8.5IT (No8 UK) and White Gold 7.5 (UK No7) but other alternatives are out there and anything you are looking to shoot for Clays (No8) and pheasants/pigeons etc (no7) and you are on target with will drop, if it is within 40 yards.

Happy hunting!

Really helpful post, in particular thanks. There's clearly plenty to learn

[Scully]

21 hours ago, Dave at kelton said:

You are dead right what about resale value? Fortunately I don’t have to sell my guns at present and am happy to ride it out as I feel it will not be as bad as we all fear. That said the value of my collection has doubtless dropped like a stone and isn’t the investment I hoped. Hey ho still nice to have them and the kids can worry about it when I go up the chimney. 😂

🙂 We’re smiling about it but it really annoys me.
There will be no compensation scheme regarding such guns, as the depth of one’s pockets may dictate to what extent they are rendered obsolete. 

[Dave at kelton]

28 minutes ago, Scully said:

🙂 We’re smiling about it but it really annoys me.
There will be no compensation scheme regarding such guns, as the depth of one’s pockets may dictate to what extent they are rendered obsolete. 

Quite right! All English quality guns from the 19th century and part of our sporting and engineering heritage. Still fit for purpose if given the chance. Whilst I put Ecosteel through a gun it at least had steel barrels…not fine Damascus.