Engineering strikes

[starlight32]

Well my lads have just had a meeting and voted to walk in support of the action across the country....

 

So far by 9.00 am 17,000 engineering workers have called it a day for 24 hours....

 

I don't blaim them either for one minute-Best of luck too....

 

 

Think I might as well go home too, as I have no-one to supervise........and chase a few pigeons in the snow

[MJN]

as most of em can't get to work anyway why not have a day off on strike ! UK jobs for UK workers , I laugh .

[starlight32]

as most of em can't get to work anyway why not have a day off on strike ! UK jobs for UK workers , I laugh .

 

 

Prehaps you would like to explain yourself-I take it you do do not support the preservation of uk jobs?

[Country_est]

Bit late for all that in my Industry (if you can call computing that) its mainly off shored any way with a lot of thier teams ONSHORE learning the processes.

 

With the EU and subcontracting I cant see how any of this will work. Nice Idea but with the Poles & all other EU nations here I cant see it being turned round as its all done for the MONEY, and as the companies are all calling them selves global players they cheapest way of doing things will be what is done.

[MC]

While I fully support the UK jobs for UK workers I do think that the unions need to look a little further than the ends of their own noses. Personally if I had the choice between employing a load of lazy UK workers who want everything handed to them on a plate and walk out at the drop of a hat or employing a few foreign workers who will get on with their work and get the job done then I know who I would choose.

 

I have heard that the workers at the New Holland factory in Basildon have walked out because their bonus wasn't large enough. It's a good job I don't own that factory because I would be changing the locks as we speak so the ******** couldn't get back in.

 

I am writing this from my desk at work after driving for 2 hours to get here in attrcious conditions, not taking the easy way out. I bet most of the foreign workers have gone to work as well.

 

Half of the unemployed are british people who can't be ***** to go to work. If they don't want the jobs then why shouldn't the poles or romanians have them?

[starlight32]

While I fully support the UK jobs for UK workers I do think that the unions need to look a little further than the ends of their own noses. Personally if I had the choice between employing a load of lazy UK workers who want everything handed to them on a plate and walk out at the drop of a hat or employing a few foreign workers who will get on with their work and get the job done then I know who I would choose.

 

I have heard that the workers at the New Holland factory in Basildon have walked out because their bonus wasn't large enough. It's a good job I don't own that factory because I would be changing the locks as we speak so the ******** couldn't get back in.

 

I am writing this from my desk at work after driving for 2 hours to get here in attrcious conditions, not taking the easy way out. I bet most of the foreign workers have gone to work as well.

 

Half of the unemployed are british people who can't be ***** to go to work. If they don't want the jobs then why shouldn't the poles or romanians have them?

 

 

MC,

 

I would'nt classify engineering workers in the same category as 'lazy British?

 

I had Poles, Portugese and Rumainians working for me last year, and from an impartial point of view-Yes they are willing workers and do what they are told, but the quality of their work was poor>

 

A case of six and two three's I think.

[Nial]

UK jobs for UK workers , I laugh .

 

 

Specially seeing as we're in the EU and any EU citizen has the right to come and work here

(and vice versa).

 

Never mind the (insert big number here) who get in under the radar.

 

This analysis suggests it's costing us 40 billion/year to remain in the EU ..

A cost too far?

..it's a few years old so it could be even more now.

 

 

 

Nial

[Chard]

I think Gordon Brown would have been better off if he'd kept his "British jobs for British workers" bull **** speech to himself.

 

I think that one may come back to haunt him as he seems powerless to do anything about immigration and the EU

[MC]

Rob,

 

Yes some of them do produce shoddy work, but then that is nothing new. I have seen some **** poor british carpenters and joiners as well. A lot of companies wmploy them because they are cheap.

 

If you pay peanuts you get monkeys. Unfortunately the fat cats of british industry don't care about the quality as long as they can afford their new car/ yacht or house in the country.

 

That is why places like china are booming in manufacturing.

[rocksaplenty]

There’s a lot of anger out there!

 

The government would have done well to ‘string up’ a few of the greedier bankers after the banking crisis. Perhaps then we’d all feel a bit less frustrated!

[V8landy]

Working myself in the industry effected (Petrochemical refining), I can not see how this quote of “UK jobs for UK workers†can be fulfilled when there is a MASSIVE UK skills shortage, of coded welders, COMPEX electrical engineers, Chemical engineers and Process Operators.

 

These jobs could not have been filled by the typical un-employed person, without years of training and experience.

 

Other question is why strike now? Brown announced his statement in 2007, and the contract was awarded in 2006 with a completion due this year.

 

And like many other UK workers I have worked overseas due to better pay and more work availability is Gordon going to create these extra jobs?

 

And what if all this backfires on the strikers? And companies start bringing in Indian workers or all the ex pat workers get kicked out of other country around the world!

 

You cant have it both ways!

[Andy W]

I dealt with a new company last week who I had never dealt with before, they promised me the earth and let me down badly, the order value was £1,500 so not as if it was a small amount, all they said was "at least you got there in the end" yes because I sorted it out myself at my own cost.

 

Each day I come across much incompetance whilst dealing with various companies, false promises, people not returning phone calls, deliveries not made on time, no one cares and that seems to be the general attitude.

[fullbore]

. Personally if I had the choice between employing a load of lazy UK workers who want everything handed to them on a plate and walk out at the drop of a hat or employing a few foreign workers who will get on with their work and get the job done then I know who I would choose.

 

 

Half of the unemployed are british people who can't be ***** to go to work. If they don't want the jobs then why shouldn't the poles or romanians have them?

 

 

I'm no financial genius but the way an economy works is you have to "spend your money in the village" These immigrant workers are taking/sending their wages out of the Uk so the local economy is collapsing. The pattern seems to be with the poles at least is they come for 2 years and they have enough to buy a house back home outright. Can't knock em for that but it doesn't help the skills base back here. Then when they have bought their house, they come back and do any job on emergency tax, then get the rebate back then go home, and claim UK benefits for 6 months while not even living here

 

 

 

 

Because I think that is a very short term view, if you were prepared to invest in your workforce and the future you would reap the benefits instead of going down the fast buck route. I am sure there are more people than me looking at who employs immigrants as opposed to British people and will never deal with those companies again. What goes around comes around

How many of these immigrant workers buy the products you produce? How many Buy the houses the building companies who employ them build?

I think if you employed them don't bitch about the recession

Edited February 2, 2009 by fullbore

[dustyfox]

I'm no financial genius but the way an economy works is you have to "spend your money in the village" These immigrant workers are taking/sending their wages out of the Uk so the local economy is collapsing. The pattern seems to be with the poles at least is they come for 2 years and they have enough to buy a house back home outright. Can't knock em for that but it doesn't help the skills base back here. Then when they have bought their house, they come back and do any job on emergency tax, then get the rebate back then go home, and claim UK benefits for 6 months while not even living here

 

 

 

 

Because I think that is a very short term view, if you were prepared to invest in your workforce and the future you would reap the benefits instead of going down the fast buck route. I am sure there are more people than me looking at who employs immigrants as opposed to British people and will never deal with those companies again. What goes around comes around

How many of these immigrant workers buy the products you produce? How many Buy the houses the building companies who employ them build?

I think if you employed them don't bitch about the recession

 

Yeah MC your right, Poles and that will be cheap labour, more money for you I suppose, but everyone else will have to suffer with tax rises because they are saving and sending all the money back to the country of origin that really should be spent here instead.

 

One of my next door neighbors is getting an extension put on his house he has stated to the contractor that he only wants British builders and tradesman to work on it. Which I am chuffed about it as it gives the Local economy a little helping hand and keeping British Workers in British jobs.

 

I will have no foreign worker work on anything of mine in future, I like to see my money spent in my country.

 

Think of your fellow Citizens before money please.

[digger]

There is an economic down turn, there are clearly workers from over seas ( not all Polish amazingly, but lets not cloud the issue ) with the training / skills to carry out the jobs of those on strike.

Striking wont change a thing, did it work for the miners ?

Out of interest Dusty, when you take your car in will you ask the garage owner where his staff are from?

[myzeneye]

greed and exploitation, thats the motives behind most employers who go with the immigrant labour.

granted, they turn up, they work hard. but an awfull lot of uk workers do too. they should not be penalised because they have a higher cost of living and have been getting a wage higher then the poles are willing to take.

i was in work today, i drove round in poor conditions getting heating and gas back on for old and vulnerable people...i work hard.....

however, when i put a price in for a job and i get under cut by a team of poles doing heating for peanuts, its tends to get your back up a bit.

people will say , you plumbers had it coming, ripping people off etc etc... let me tell you, the industry is cut throat as it is, you cant afford to have extortionate prices as people are willing to under cut you all the time.... but the the poles come in, you cant compete... they wanna fit the cheapest nastiest gear they can find, and use a drain pipe for a flue just like back home.... as they say, you pay peanuts, you get monkeys....

 

but as stated above, the main issue has to be the cash which is going out of the country..... and the benefits etc..... immigration is a joke as it is...

and of course, ultimately... any employer who stipulates non uk workers only, must be held to account for discrimination.

[Mungler]

It's not just wages to immigrant workers that is doing the economy in. When people splash out on any foreign imported good then the bulk of the purchase price goes abroad albeit some English middle men (stores etc) get a cut. And unfortunately it's all those aspirational big ticket goods Plasmas, BMWs, Rolexs, foreign holidays.

 

For example, when you buy a drill from your local B&Q do you think you are helping Great Britain? No, you have helped B&Q out a little bit but the Chinese fella that made that drill is laughing all the way to the Shanghai Bank. That's all money out of the Country and a shagged balance of payments

 

I have more time for people that holiday in the UK because that really is putting pounds straight into British pockets and into (seasonal) regions that will need it the most these coming years.

 

As for strikes, well that's a waste of time. The last time they worked was back with the peasants revolt and only because they had a head start with the Black Death

Edited February 2, 2009 by Mungler

[dustyfox]

There is an economic down turn, there are clearly workers from over seas ( not all Polish amazingly, but lets not cloud the issue ) with the training / skills to carry out the jobs of those on strike.

Striking wont change a thing, did it work for the miners ?

Out of interest Dusty, when you take your car in will you ask the garage owner where his staff are from?

 

Dont have to local garage local people work in there.

[starlight32]

greed and exploitation, thats the motives behind most employers who go with the immigrant labour.

granted, they turn up, they work hard. but an awfull lot of uk workers do too. they should not be penalised because they have a higher cost of living and have been getting a wage higher then the poles are willing to take.

i was in work today, i drove round in poor conditions getting heating and gas back on for old and vulnerable people...i work hard.....

however, when i put a price in for a job and i get under cut by a team of poles doing heating for peanuts, its tends to get your back up a bit.

people will say , you plumbers had it coming, ripping people off etc etc... let me tell you, the industry is cut throat as it is, you cant afford to have extortionate prices as people are willing to under cut you all the time.... but the the poles come in, you cant compete... they wanna fit the cheapest nastiest gear they can find, and use a drain pipe for a flue just like back home.... as they say, you pay peanuts, you get monkeys....

 

but as stated above, the main issue has to be the cash which is going out of the country..... and the benefits etc..... immigration is a joke as it is...

and of course, ultimately... any employer who stipulates non uk workers only, must be held to account for discrimination.

 

 

Here,Here..........

 

Don't be put up by that rubbish is on about the Italians being 'specialist labour' either........

 

 

They are no different in the trades they require than what we have over here.

 

I personally think all this is just a jibe back at the UK workforce-They ain'nt forgot we gave em hell in the past.

 

Its about time they got it again.

[derek.snr]

i passed the plant this morning ,i did not know lincs had so many riot police.would they be there if it was muslim workers,no that would be racially inflamatory.the workers are putting zilch into the local economy ,they are staying on a floating hotel in grimsby.ships like that must be booked months in advance ,the italian firm who got the contract had no intention of using local people .hopefully this will be a start of british people first.

[MC]

 

Yeah MC your right, Poles and that will be cheap labour, more money for you I suppose, but everyone else will have to suffer with tax rises because they are saving and sending all the money back to the country of origin that really should be spent here instead.

 

One of my next door neighbors is getting an extension put on his house he has stated to the contractor that he only wants British builders and tradesman to work on it. Which I am chuffed about it as it gives the Local economy a little helping hand and keeping British Workers in British jobs.

 

I will have no foreign worker work on anything of mine in future, I like to see my money spent in my country.

 

Think of your fellow Citizens before money please.

 

 

WHOA there Nelly,

 

I think you have got the wrong end of the stick completely.

 

There is a lack of skills in this country because companies put profit before anything else. To take someone on as an apprentice and invest time and money is expensive. Only to find that once the apprentice has passed all his exams he ******* off to get a job where the money is better. I know I did it, most apprentices do.

 

The lack of skills is down to the previous government abolishing proper apprenticeships and replacing the 4-5 year training with some mickey mouse NVQ which in reality is worth ****** all.

 

The second problem is with this government allowing any tom **** or harry in to this country. The last company I worked for had all manner of nationalities work for them because they couldn't find any british workers. While manufacturing is having to compete with cheap imports from eastern europe and the far east there is only one way to do it and that is to cut costs.

 

The only way to do that is to use cheaper labour.

 

I could not afford to work for what the poles do. They are happy to work for £6.50 an hour whereas that ammount wouldn't pay my bills.

 

Why is it that it is only union lead companies and employees who bitch about this sort of thing? You never hear of a private owned company with no union rep going on strike. The company I now work for employ hundreds of workers from all over europe. Why? because without them and their skills we would not being able to compete and succeed in what we do.

 

Vote the BNP in and get all the british back to work, the country will be on it's knees in a year or two.

 

The situation with the cash going out of the country is just nuts, how many of the building tradesmen who were out in germany in the late eighties or early nineties spent all of their cash in Germany? not many as all the ones who I know where there now lead a bloody good lifestyle.

 

There is a saying what goes around comes around.

Edited February 2, 2009 by MC

[myzeneye]

i hear folk saying uk workers are whinging and striking at any opertunity...well let me tell you, right now, folk aren't ganna take an unpaid day off work unless they have too....

also, they make it sound like a uniquely british trait... my god, get over to france,,, now, they take no **** from the man...if they dontr like, they strike. and,get results.

nothing wrong with standing up for your rights or wanting yourselves to be put first..

[MC]

No you are quite right,

 

Now't wrong with standing up for your rights. But that is where your arguement fails.

 

These people are not employed because it is their right to be in a job. They should be bloody grateful that they have a job in the first place and they should get back to work and do the job they are paid to do.

 

It is a bloody shame that Maggie Thatcher didn't break all the unions, maybe just maybe this country would be great again.

[derek.snr]

i never use non-british tradesmen,i never use car washes manned by foreign workers, or 24 hr garages that sell overpriced groceries manned by the owner 24hrs a day,never eat danish bacon,new zealand lamb,crossants,mcdonalds=foreign food,does it make me racist ,i do not care,i might not be doing much but ,i am doing more than most.

[myzeneye]

yes , i agree mate... if your paid to do a job, you should just get it done...end of.

however, you have to agree, often the emplyment role is a two way thing... i do my employer as great a favour as they do me... i could easily up stix and take my skills elsewhere....

ok, not everyone has a skill, and cant really afford to show any cheek, but that doesnt mean they should be outed by a foreign work force who the employer can get away with paying a lower rate...

i agree, alot of the dopes we have here are work shy louts who havent a clue, but most of them are on the dole...,thats another row all together, but those who wrok, wanna just do their time for their pay, no more no less. cant argue with that really, theres more to life then work and money..trying to get that balance is hard enough as it is.

 

to be fair, mc.. ihold my hand up and admit, i dont know much about the situation going on right now, i dont have much reason to get involved in this conversation , but my opinion is just that we as a country need to start investing in ourselves.... if we allow apathy to win and just right off the general uk public, we'll just end up in a worse state then we're in..

Edited February 2, 2009 by myzeneye