brynhaller Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 wonder if somebody could advise me on the following.... Police knocked on my door on sat night and said they wanted to speak to me regarding an alleged assault which took place on 26 aug,I asked what they were on about as I didnt know.Apparentley a traffic warden I had a row with said I had assaulted him after he had given me a ticket.Isaid I remember the argument but I said I never laid a finger on him.The police said an allegation had been made and that they were here to arrest me.with this they read me my wrights and put me in the van no ifs buts or maybes.all this infront of my wife elderly mum and my 12 yr old daughter On arrival at the nick I was searched stripped of my shoes the cord in my tracky bottoms removed made to sign forms I couldnt read without my glasses and. then I was fingerprinted photographed and dna swabbed before being put in a cell to await an interview.At interview I explained what had gone on in minute detail all the while being taped but again maintained that I hadnt touched the traffic warden and that I had an independant witness who saw the full incident. this seemedto surprise the officer as he hadnt been aware of any witness.He then asked for their name and telephone no,I obliged with both.I was then put back in my cell.In the interview I was asked time and time again wether i hit him or not which I continually denied.After about 4 hrs the cell door opened and I was told I could go and no charges were to be brought. My witness had told them what had happened,it appears mr traffic warden was lying ,he told police I had grabbed him round the throat,smashed him into a wall before dropping him to the floor and threatening to eat him alive. Now I know the police have a hard job to do but Ifeel really angry about the way I was treated.I now have all my details on a criminal database for no reason, and as I work in schools ,prisons and other sensitive areas I feel has though this could go against me .What happens when I renew my sgc. What can I do? What can I do about the lying cheating traffic warden,whos probably been on sick leave cos of his so called injuries. Any advice or suggestions from people on here who might know would be greatly recieved. thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pegleg31 Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 i might be wrong but if you was'nt cautioned they're not allowed to keep any of your prints DNA ect. i could be wrong though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Geordie Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 You could give him a good kicking on the double indemnity clause Sorry I will get back on topic! I would firstly go and check if there is any CCTV coverage of the area of the alleged assault. If so explain the circumstances and see if you can get a copy of the coverage, Also if you have a witness thats a Bonus! Get in touch with the local council and inform them you are to seek damages for defamation and slander and make an appointment with your solicitor and explain all. If you can't afford a brief then take a trip the the Citizens advise and explain the situation. They should be able to help. As for the retention of DNA and Fingerprints I think that stinks to be honest. I thought if the case was dropped (unless cautioned) then they had to destroy held DNA and prints but reading recently I don't think this is the case! You could argue the fact and make a complaint to the Chief of police in your local area reguarding the whole situation! Other than that I think your details WILL be held BUT if you were released "Without caution" then you shouldn't have a problem for future firearms applications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 Go for CCTV and see if there were any more witnesses. Make a formal complaint to the police and follow through the procedures with appeals if need be. Be clear that he was lying and wasting police time. Do you have the traffic warden's number - if so make a public access information request about the amount of time he has had off sick, length of employment other disciplinary issues and allegations. I dunno what you can get away with, but have a bit of a dig around, he may have made a habit of it. Press the police to see if they will take matters further; someone has told some fibs and it's not you. Given that you have no previous and this related to an incident in August they could have had you attend the station for a chat - no need to be arrested and the paddy wagon. Make the complaint in writing. Be specific but don't exaggerate; go through how many officers attended, when, how many cars - paint a picture of a massive waste of time. Emphasise that you are of good character and innocent until proven guilty. It will probably amount to F-all but give it a stir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 (edited) You DNA, fingerprints at the moment can be kept, although this is subject of debate at present and may change. You can write to the force concerned to make application for them to be destroyed setting out your case. The arrest sounds lawful based on what you have written, as the Police would have acted on the information received from the traffic warden. Your account was corroborated by an independent witness and you have been subject of no further action so have no criminal record. You can complain about the actions of the traffic warden through the forces Professional Standards department or to the IPCC if he is a Police employee (rare these days) - more likely to be a local authority employee. Edited November 4, 2009 by Dibs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roadkill Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 the dna will be kept no matter what , this will not go against your sgc or your job as it never went to court and no caution was given .. So you will be fine . If you happen to be in this situation again get a solicitor straight away as this can make a big difference from not getting a conviction Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 Just to add from what Mung has said. Keep hard copies of all letters sent, this is for your own records if you are using a solicitor tem you will need to also give them a copy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 (edited) DNA, fingerprints will in the majority of cases always be kept. In very exceptional circumstance where there is an unlawful arrest which makes the processes carried out afterwards potentially unlawful a local force decision can be made for them to be removed. In this case as the arrest appears lawful you are going to struggle. Edited November 4, 2009 by Dibs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 The arrest sounds lawful based on what you have written, as the Police would have acted on the information received from the traffic warden. Your account was corroborated by an independent witness and you have been subject of no further action so have no criminal record. Are you sure this would have been a lawful arrest or is it a typing error and should read awful. being arrested for an asault over 10 weeks after the event, its not like the guy was hard to find being as the warden had the vehicle details in black and white, why wait that length of time to follow up a charge of possible ABH. They would normally be at the house waiting for the accused persons house before they got back or if not pretty much soon after. Why did the warded wait so long or did he why did the police wait so long Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 Are you sure this would have been a lawful arrest or is it a typing error and should read awful. being arrested for an asault over 10 weeks after the event, its not like the guy was hard to find being as the warden had the vehicle details in black and white, why wait that length of time to follow up a charge of possible ABH. They would normally be at the house waiting for the accused persons house before they got back or if not pretty much soon after. Why did the warded wait so long or did he why did the police wait so long Who knows? but valid points, those are questions he may want to ask. Length of time won't necessarily make it unlawful, as for awful - could well be if there was no reason for waiting that long. there may be a valid reason for the delay or there may not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roadkill Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 Who knows? but valid points, those are questions he may want to ask. Length of time won't necessarily make it unlawful, as for awful - could well be if there was no reason for waiting that long. there may be a valid reason for the delay or there may not. I believe they can wait up to three months to arrest you maybe even more roadkill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snap Cap Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 (edited) I got arrested for common assault even though it was self defense. I got off with a caution but still had DNA taken, fingerprints etc. I asked at the interview would this cause a revocation of my shot gun license. The inspector said he did not know. But as I am a Certificate holder, details of the offense would have be sent to the firearms team and the outcome would be up to them. This happened over two years ago and nothing has come of it. Renewal is in 2011 not sure or confident as to how that will go. Edited November 4, 2009 by Snap Cap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AIRARMSTX200 Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 (edited) are the police going to arrest the warden for lying and the council should then sack him for what he's done . Edited November 4, 2009 by AIRARMSTX200 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snozzer Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 (edited) Point 1) The police did make a lawful arrest and followed procedures - forget that part and move onto point 2) Traffic warden lied, how do you prove that, well, for a start he made a formal written complaint to the police, so there is documentary evidence in existence, you are in your rights to have been given access to that at the point of interview. This traffic warden worked for someone, most likely local authority, if he claims he is assaulted then an incident report would have been filed for the H&S act reporting and <expletive>***</expletive> covering by the LA, you can request access to that under freedom of information (FOI), it will be sanitised, but should still have the wardens name, which the police will also give you as you still remain entitled to know who accused you. Next you need to establish what the police said to your witness, did they take a written statement, contemporaneous notes or just asked questions and made pocket book entries. Write to the Chief constable, explain you are taking legal action against the Warden and LA (Not the police, they acted lawfully) and that you need this information. Furthermore, you might suggest that, if it can be proved that the warden lied, he is guilty of wasting police time (offence under Section 5(2) of the Criminal Law Act 1967), copy this letter to the chief executive of the Local authority and your local MP. Also ask for a copy of the interview tapes that were sealed at the time of the interview as this will help prove the line of questioing which substatiates your claim for "being fraudulently accused of assault". At the heart of this matter lies a reason why the warden claimed assault, being a suspicious man, I would think he is thinking some sort of injury claim, or long term sickness stress related injury. If that is the case, he will have made a statement of that to someone and probably had medical treatment. Medical records are difficult to obtain, but ask for them anyway. On balance, if you have a solid independant witness who can verify the authencity of your side of events that includes seeing either you leave the scene or the warden leaving the scene uninjured, then you have grounds for a claim. You claim will include the matter of being humilitaed infron of family, friends and neighbours, the risk of losing a FAC/SGC, the risk of loss of employment and the mental anguish you have suffered. They key to this is the independant witness and how you present your casae to the LA on whose employment this incident took place, what you really want is an apology and out of court settlement :-) Edited November 4, 2009 by snozzer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justintime Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 wonder if somebody could advise me on the following.... Police knocked on my door on sat night and said they wanted to speak to me regarding an alleged assault which took place on 26 aug,I asked what they were on about as I didnt know.Apparentley a traffic warden I had a row with said I had assaulted him after he had given me a ticket.Isaid I remember the argument but I said I never laid a finger on him.The police said an allegation had been made and that they were here to arrest me.with this they read me my wrights and put me in the van no ifs buts or maybes.all this infront of my wife elderly mum and my 12 yr old daughter On arrival at the nick I was searched stripped of my shoes the cord in my tracky bottoms removed made to sign forms I couldnt read without my glasses and. then I was fingerprinted photographed and dna swabbed before being put in a cell to await an interview.At interview I explained what had gone on in minute detail all the while being taped but again maintained that I hadnt touched the traffic warden and that I had an independant witness who saw the full incident. this seemedto surprise the officer as he hadnt been aware of any witness.He then asked for their name and telephone no,I obliged with both.I was then put back in my cell.In the interview I was asked time and time again wether i hit him or not which I continually denied.After about 4 hrs the cell door opened and I was told I could go and no charges were to be brought. My witness had told them what had happened,it appears mr traffic warden was lying ,he told police I had grabbed him round the throat,smashed him into a wall before dropping him to the floor and threatening to eat him alive. Now I know the police have a hard job to do but Ifeel really angry about the way I was treated.I now have all my details on a criminal database for no reason, and as I work in schools ,prisons and other sensitive areas I feel has though this could go against me .What happens when I renew my sgc. What can I do? What can I do about the lying cheating traffic warden,whos probably been on sick leave cos of his so called injuries. Any advice or suggestions from people on here who might know would be greatly recieved. thanks Speek to a bloke off here called Winchester he went through the same thing and is fighting it now he might advise you on what steps to take Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyboots Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 (edited) ive been arrested in the past for a few different things that havent went to court and i never declared them on my FAC and had no come back Edited May 5, 2010 by monkeyboots Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lord_seagrave Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 Lots of good advice here. The only point I would re-iterate is the need to keep copies of all the documentation that you send and receive. Print off the emails, if there are any, and request read-receipts if that is an option for you. Mungler v Goldfish is a textbook case file. I was involved in an accident and although the other party admitted liability, the process of extracting a personal injury settlement from his insurers is taking a month of Sundays. Telephone calls are all very well for venting your frustration, but it is the paper trail that will really count in the end. Best of luck, LS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 I believe you have three options; First would be to do nothing. Second would be to formally complain to the Police and the Traffic Wardens Employers. Thirdly you can follow the second suggestion, but also take legal advice with the intention of extracting some financial compensation from the Traffic Warden's Employers ( I think you have no case against the Police). This may be the most attractive option, but you must be prepared to spend some money upfront, with no guarantee of getting it back if you fail. Thats the hardest bit of your option choosing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fo5ter Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 I got arrested for common assault even though it was self defense. I got off with a caution but still had DNA taken, fingerprints etc. I asked at the interview would this cause a revocation of my shot gun license. The inspector said he did not know. But as I am a Certificate holder, details of the offense would have be sent to the firearms team and the outcome would be up to them.This happened over two years ago and nothing has come of it. Renewal is in 2011 not sure or confident as to how that will go. You should never accept a caution in this situation - accepting admits fault. If it really is self defence and you believe you were using appropriate and reasonable force for the situation you have acted within the law. you have addmitted to the police you were at fault by accepting the caution. it might sound like being let off with a warning but a 'caution' disposal is a detection indicator making you the 'offender' and being recorded as such Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 You need to focus this on the person who caused all the trouble and that is the traffic warden. I would avoid a scatter gun approach making complaints to all and strirring it up and focus on the traffic warden. It is not the Police's actions that are at fault they will have just acted on an allegation made by this person. I am sure if you rang the Officer up who arrested you or his Supervisor they would have no problem giving you some feedback and to see if they are pursuing anything re the lies the traffic warden told. Raise your concerns with them about the lies told by this person and the fact he has made a statement where you sign a declaration to confirm it is the truth and may be prosecuted if it is not. The fact it took some time to arrest you does not make it unlawful and there may be good reason. You will never win that battle and a complaint against the Officers will mean they simply wont talk to you but let the complaints process deal with it. But a constructive phonecall to the officer might assist you. You may find they are already dealing with matey if he has fabricated evidence and provided a false statement, wasting their time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 Speek to a bloke off here called Winchester he went through the same thing and is fighting it now he might advise you on what steps to take probably the worst person to speak to IMHO I'd be putting in a complaint to his employers and also to the police about his actions and asking them what they were going to do about it. On the other side was it a fairly heated discussion that might look bad on CCTV, if so I'd leave it well alone. you've come out of it character unblemished so the law has worked for you. Had you lumped the traffic warden however i'd have been well in support i hate them with a passion but then seems half my days get spent appealing tickets these days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 If what you say is true and I dont doubt you for one minute then you have been hard done by . My advice to you is to seek proper legal advice with the view to complaining about your treatment from the police and the lies told by the traffic warden . Although you will recieve views and advice from forum members who mean well dont take this advice as the law as it stands . This is a very serious matter and you need some serious legal advice from a lawyer . Harnser . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 the big problem for the man on the street is legal advice is costly and to make a point it depends how deep your pockets are. In reality you can make yourself a pain in the backside to that traffic warden by firing off letters left right and centre and possibly phone the local rag they like a good hard done by story and lets face it no one likes traffic wardens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justintime Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 (edited) probably the worst person to speak to IMHO I'd be putting in a complaint to his employers and also to the police about his actions and asking them what they were going to do about it. On the other side was it a fairly heated discussion that might look bad on CCTV, if so I'd leave it well alone. you've come out of it character unblemished so the law has worked for you. Had you lumped the traffic warden however i'd have been well in support i hate them with a passion but then seems half my days get spent appealing tickets these days Your opinion is void of the facts and very ill informed sir, Winchester has found people who will help others in such cases , one of them me and lets remember that gun owners have to be whiter than white. There are people who will fight to uphold your rights. Winchester is fighting injustice as to prevent the same thing happening to any other lawfull shooter. The case of this fellow could mean revocation for aggresive behavior. No charges !! I have heard that before. But it still dose not stop them revokeing. enough said on an open forum Edited November 5, 2009 by Justintime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 sorry winchester I didn't till earlier know you had an alias back on so no offence meant, but your case is very different and as James Marchington posted going after officers doing their job isn't going to get far and is not likened to this case at all. The police did what they had to do in this case ascertained the facts they had were incorrect and released him without charge so innocent. It won't be taken up as an issue on renewal as he was cleared of involvement and the incident wasn't as reported. lines to pursue are to see if you can get the warden arrested for wasting police time or if he's doing a naughty and done it to get time off and money then they may be able to get him for more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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