22 lr

[camokid]

how loude are they i shoot a bit around horses and want somthing with a little pop dont really want to use a air gun and the 17hmr is a bit on the loude side so thought of a 22 lr.

[scout]

I use a 22lr with a sound mod around horses and have no problems, often find the lamp disturbs them more than the shots.

[Dempy]

I would suggest aswell, you use subsonic ammo, lot quieter than high velocity

[ellebarto]

I use a 22lr with a sound mod around horses and have no problems, often find the lamp disturbs them more than the shots.

 

I shoot a CZ auto with a SAK moderator using sub ammo and you virtually just hear the click of the bolt sliding and thats it. Very often I can pop a bunny and it was so quiet his mate is still looking around to see whats going on while I line him up for no 2!!

[camokid]

so you would say its as good as a air rifle with mod

[Westcountryman]

They can be very quiet, mine is quieter than my HW77 (spring powered airgun).

 

Only issue with horses is the potential richocette.

[camokid]

are they that bad for richocette. ??

[Colster]

are they that bad for richocette. ??

 

Hard to answer that one really, on stony ground and shooting prone off a bipod you can expect a few whizzers, soft earth and shooting from a vehicle I very rarely get one.

 

Read various reports on here though of people using HMR around horses and they don't seem to mind the crack, the lamp usually freaks them out more.

 

... but to answer your original question LR is VERY quiet, I have an AirArms S400 FAC and my LR (with a SAK moderator and using subsonic ammo) is quieter than that.

[Dekers]

so you would say its as good as a air rifle with mod

 

Far to wide a question but put simply, a .22lr with sub sonic ammo and a moderator is unlikely to upset anyone!

 

 

are they that bad for richocette. ??

 

Sorry, but this is one that always p****s me off and a question that somehow wonders around and around...

 

There are more .22lr in civilian hands in this country than any other caliber

The .22lr is the WORLDS most popular civilian calibre

There are vast quantities of differing ammo for the .22lr, some specifically marketed as VERY low recochet.

When did you last hear of death, injury, property damage plastered all over the press because of ricochet!

 

So...what do you recon??

 

:yp:

Edited June 22, 2010 by Dekers

[Redgum]

because of the great increase in power with a .22lr with subs compared with an air rifle you need to make sure you have a suitable back stop, and of course, don't shoot into the air either. Used correctly the .22lr is an extremely safe calibre.

[Alpha Mule]

I shot my first .22LR a couple of weeks ago and was gobsmacked at how quiet it was.

It was even quieter than my CO2 powered .22 (both moderated).

I was plugging rounds into a hard earthen embankment and had no probs with ricochettes, until I intentionally started hitting stones so that I could hear what they sounded like.

 

If I could find the right permission I would flog my CO2 and buy an LR with the procedes faster than you can say "Bang"!

[camokid]

i shoot 17hmr and 223 but for around live stock and buildings i thought i could do with a little round that was quiet ether a 22 rimfire or a good air rifle i cant decide?:yp:?

[shakin stevens]

took my brno cz 22lr pigeon shooting past few nights one night on fresh drilled game cover

other evening on clover near houses, got a parker hale silencer on it, and yes it does the

job without to much noise, it was good fun had deeks out 60yds.

[kyska]

Too true, but as said, it very much depends on the land, and being sensible, I had one and loved it, quiet, cheap, bloody effective....but I just kept getting riqochet, it just didn't work out for me.

 

 

 

 

Far to wide a question but put simply, a .22lr with sub sonic ammo and a moderator is unlikely to upset anyone!

 

 

 

 

Sorry, but this is one that always p****s me off and a question that somehow wonders around and around...

 

There are more .22lr in civilian hands in this country than any other caliber

The .22lr is the WORLDS most popular civilian calibre

There are vast quantities of differing ammo for the .22lr, some specifically marketed as VERY low recochet.

When did you last hear of death, injury, property damage plastered all over the press because of ricochet!

 

So...what do you recon??

 

:blink:

[Super major]

I've been searching on here for the last hour or so and it looks like the 22lr ricochet discussion has been done to death so I don't think I dare post a new topic on it! Seems to be 50:50 between "Great calibre, quiet, any ricochets will have lost energy after impact" or "Ricochets far too much, dangerous, get a 17HMR"

 

I got my FAC earlier this year with permission for a .22RF but haven't got my gun yet. I'm wanting to get one bought but I'm just hesitating at the moment because I've had a friend with much more shooting experience than me nagging me to get a variation for a .17 as he says .22's ricochet too much. The farm I have permission for is 1000+acres of arable, mixture of clay land and carr land, and I know the land pretty well as I used to work there. I know to check the backstop for the shot regardless of calibre but if the .22 can ricochet then how much of a safety margin should I allow for in other directions?

 

Cheers,

 

[kent]

Far to wide a question but put simply, a .22lr with sub sonic ammo and a moderator is unlikely to upset anyone!

 

 

 

 

Sorry, but this is one that always p****s me off and a question that somehow wonders around and around...

 

There are more .22lr in civilian hands in this country than any other caliber

The .22lr is the WORLDS most popular civilian calibre

There are vast quantities of differing ammo for the .22lr, some specifically marketed as VERY low recochet.

When did you last hear of death, injury, property damage plastered all over the press because of ricochet!

 

So...what do you recon??

 

 

Yep it has happened well reported Can't remeber the name of the guy but one poor soul got it in the eye when picnicing in next field and yes he died, few years ago a kid walking near a golf course was killed Yorkshire i think (not sure if it was a ricochet that time but it sounded like it to me) forget low ricochet subs they all bounce. Best advice i can give is i should not use one too close to stock end of. Try fac air well moderated as Horses hate these type of noises and can injure themselves if they panic. As far as moderated .22 lr using subs go the bullet connecting will make more noise.

 

Dekers if you get upset about it it's perhaps coz you obviously don't know enough

[Colster]

I've been searching on here for the last hour or so and it looks like the 22lr ricochet discussion has been done to death so I don't think I dare post a new topic on it! Seems to be 50:50 between "Great calibre, quiet, any ricochets will have lost energy after impact" or "Ricochets far too much, dangerous, get a 17HMR"

 

I got my FAC earlier this year with permission for a .22RF but haven't got my gun yet. I'm wanting to get one bought but I'm just hesitating at the moment because I've had a friend with much more shooting experience than me nagging me to get a variation for a .17 as he says .22's ricochet too much. The farm I have permission for is 1000+acres of arable, mixture of clay land and carr land, and I know the land pretty well as I used to work there. I know to check the backstop for the shot regardless of calibre but if the .22 can ricochet then how much of a safety margin should I allow for in other directions?

 

Cheers,

 

 

They (HMR and LR) both have their strengths and weaknesses. I'd probably be inclined to use HMR in places where I'd feel uncomfortable about using an LR. Around horses? I'd probably take the HMR to be honest, yes it makes more noise but less likely to fling a stray bit of lead into a horse. Depends how close you're shooting to the horses, we shoot on a dairy farm and go on foot around fields with friendly dairy cattle following us around, for there it's FAC Air every time.

[bruno22rf]

Is there no-one local to this fella can let him come along and hear one firing?-my .22lr with a cheap as chips parker hale moderator on it is much quieter than my airgun-on firing its just the click of the bolt followed by the thud of the impact.Use good quality subs for best results-be hard to beat Eley Extra.

[Ian750]

I use my CZ .22LR in the same field as my own horses, however if there's any greater angle than 90 degree between myself, the intended target and one of the horses, I will not take the shot, I just don't see that it's worth the risk.

As far as the noise goes, the horses will probably spook slightly at the first couple of shots, but I found it was not at the report of the rifle, it was at the bullet impacting with the target, which can make a fair old whack. I'm using Winchester hollowpoint subs with a SAK moderator and think the combination is great. After a few rounds my horses settled with no problems at all, but I'm mighty careful how close I get to them when shooting, I'm only really happy if they're at least 40 yards away from the intended target and also my own 90 degree rule mentioned earlier comes into play.

Just my own opinion of course, but I'm happy with this as I've never accidently wounded or killed a horse!

 

Just a quick edit for a question, Camokid, are these horses your own? Is it a livery yard where many people stable their horses? or are they all owned by one person?

The reason I ask this is, if I were at a livery yard and the yard owner had given permission for someone to shoot in the same field as my horse without asking me first, I would be absolutely livid! This I know would be perfectly legal, BUT, should the unthinkable happen and a horse was injured (and when I say this I don't mean from a bullet I mean spooking and cutting itself etc) there would be an almighty can of worms open, which as a shooter I really wouldn't want to be in the middle of. The yard owner legally has a duty of care to the horses at livery on their land and if the owner deems this to be in question or breached, then there can be a legal case made. I have known similar things like this happen at livery yards (albeit not concerning firearms) but the principal is the same.

Just be careful mate, if you can get permission in writing from all owners of horses as well as the yard owner, if it's a livery yard that is, and make sure you're covered!

Edited August 29, 2010 by Ian750

[kent]

I've been searching on here for the last hour or so and it looks like the 22lr ricochet discussion has been done to death so I don't think I dare post a new topic on it! Seems to be 50:50 between "Great calibre, quiet, any ricochets will have lost energy after impact" or "Ricochets far too much, dangerous, get a 17HMR"

 

I got my FAC earlier this year with permission for a .22RF but haven't got my gun yet. I'm wanting to get one bought but I'm just hesitating at the moment because I've had a friend with much more shooting experience than me nagging me to get a variation for a .17 as he says .22's ricochet too much. The farm I have permission for is 1000+acres of arable, mixture of clay land and carr land, and I know the land pretty well as I used to work there. I know to check the backstop for the shot regardless of calibre but if the .22 can ricochet then how much of a safety margin should I allow for in other directions?

 

Cheers,

 

How far to allow is not a question that can truely be answered, some maybee 30yds but potentially the full range of the gun it just depends on what angle it hits and how much the bullet is effected what it hit etc. What it is best to do is assume everything has the potential to bounce and take shots only with that in your mind and i mean even those that look perfect!. Many think the HMR will not ricochet but that is rubbish any gun can, some is just less risky and some more .22 lr is certainly in the latter catogory. Personally i think the best safer option to the .22 lr is a 30ft lb air rifle with 20 ish grains of air pellet not the HMR especially near stock or roads as it carries a lot more energy at least 7-8 times that of the FAC rated air rifle

[Dekers]

Yep it has happened well reported Can't remeber the name of the guy but one poor soul got it in the eye when picnicing in next field and yes he died, few years ago a kid walking near a golf course was killed Yorkshire i think (not sure if it was a ricochet that time but it sounded like it to me) forget low ricochet subs they all bounce. Best advice i can give is i should not use one too close to stock end of. Try fac air well moderated as Horses hate these type of noises and can injure themselves if they panic. As far as moderated .22 lr using subs go the bullet connecting will make more noise.

 

Dekers if you get upset about it it's perhaps coz you obviously don't know enough

 

Not sure if it was a ricochet that time,....... can't remember, .....they all bounce

 

The most popular civil calibre in the world and you can't remember......

 

Lets put it in perspective......

 

700 people are electrocuted by their toaster in England every year, 3500 suffer injuries from sharpened pencils, and over 5000 go into hospital for routine procedures and are killed by completely unrelated unhygienic conditions.

 

I could't find any figures for those killed or injured by bouncing .22lr, perhaps you could enlighten us all about this major problem!

[Ian750]

Dekers come on, that's not how I interpreted Kent's post at all. It read to me that it is POSSIBLE to have a ricochet and to be aware of the risks, I personally don't think this is poor practice. Can anyone honestly say they've never had a ricochet, whatever the calibre? It just might be that shooters who are overly aware of a possible ricochet than someone half asleep shoving bread into the toaster may have something to do with the figures, is this a bad thing?

Personally I can't see the owner of a dead or injured horse being overly comforted by the knowledge that there are more deaths using sharpened pencils than ricocheting bullets. If we carry on using safe practice and being aware that this is a POSSIBILITY then maybe the figures will stay that way, I for one will be happy with that.

[Dekers]

Dekers come on, that's not how I interpreted Kent's post at all. It read to me that it is POSSIBLE to have a ricochet and to be aware of the risks, I personally don't think this is poor practice. Can anyone honestly say they've never had a ricochet, whatever the calibre? It just might be that shooters who are overly aware of a possible ricochet than someone half asleep shoving bread into the toaster may have something to do with the figures, is this a bad thing?

Personally I can't see the owner of a dead or injured horse being overly comforted by the knowledge that there are more deaths using sharpened pencils than ricocheting bullets. If we carry on using safe practice and being aware that this is a POSSIBILITY then maybe the figures will stay that way, I for one will be happy with that.

 

 

I have never suggested .22lr does not ricochet and I totally accept that it does...SOMETIMES. The fact is all I ever seem to hear is it is dangerous, it's about safe practice, and it isn't a major problem anyway, if it was, the .22lr would not be so popular and the Government/police would have been more than happy to ban it.

 

Help me with a single incident of a Horse being killed by a ricochet .22lr?

 

Where are all the figures to back up the apparent deaths and injuries caused by .22lr ricochets?

 

Where are all the horse owners campaigning to ban this round as it is so dangerous?

 

The point I am trying to make is this ricochet business is way over hyped in my book, yes it happens, yes people should be aware of it and yes they should be mindful. It just seems to me there are a lot of horror suggestions, but Facts seem thin on the ground!

 

Perspective!

Edited August 29, 2010 by Dekers

[Ian750]

Now that I can agree with

I am a horse owner and use the calibre in the field with my own horses, far from wanting to ban it! For me the point was always about the possibility, not the certainty and yes it probably is over hyped, I agree.

Oh and just to be pedantic, I did say whatever the calibre and didn't mean to suggest there are dead horses lying around as a result of ricocheting .22LR's

[Dekers]

Now that I can agree with

I am a horse owner and use the calibre in the field with my own horses, far from wanting to ban it! For me the point was always about the possibility, not the certainty and yes it probably is over hyped, I agree.

Oh and just to be pedantic, I did say whatever the calibre and didn't mean to suggest there are dead horses lying around as a result of ricocheting .22LR's

 

 

 

ATB!!